Vat is a feminist and vat does it do?

simu

This thread is not about whether you think feminism is a good or a bad or a middling thing. That's been done so many times before on boards! Rather, I would like to know how much people here believe they know about the topic and where they learned about it?

Was it a topic you studied at school, picked up from random commentators in the media, read in depth about or what? Just curious!

(Great thread for a Saturday night, huh? )

WindSock

A Feminist is a person who realises injustices and inequality to women and voices or takes action against it. Where did I learn? Life experience, from other people, mostly women, from books and telly.

mike65

Feminism was beaten into me by my liberated mother Then she stopped when she checked The Female Eunuch and read that physical violence was a male trait!

Mike.

monkeyfudge

I thought this was going to be about how value added tax relates to feminist ideals.

mike65

Its made looking good more costly. 21% on lippy? Bloody outrageous.

Mike.

InFront

Feminism is everywhere lately, what is going on!

Anyway, feminism is a hugely broad term. If it means promotion of fairer attitudes where men and women can both be respected equally and without being denied happiness or human rights, then I'm all for it.

If feminism means promotion of women's rights to the exclusion of men, and the presumed envelopment of all women everywhere no matter what their political cultural or religious outlook and to hell with them if they disagree, then I'm against it.

Son Goku

I had read a bit in my teen years, but my girlfriend introduced me to the history of it. I've only really read the actual writings of the first wave feminists. The second wave I only have the gist off.

Although I actually like the contrast between the cultures of first and second wave. Anyway, I should probably read more.

WindSock

monkeyfudge wrote:

I thought this was going to be about how value added tax relates to feminist ideals.

Yeah, initially I did too, I thought it was about luxury tax on feminine hygiene products.

Feminism used to mean militant lesbo dykes with droopy boobs and moustaches to me, but thats when I was 5 and told that by my brother.

impr0v

InFront wrote:

Feminism is everywhere lately, what is going on!

Anyway, feminism is a hugely broad term. If it means promotion of fairer attitudes where men and women can both be respected equally and without being denied happiness or human rights, then I'm all for it.

If feminism means promotion of women's rights to the exclusion of men, and the presumed envelopment of all women everywhere no matter what their political cultural or religious outlook and to hell with them if they disagree, then I'm against it.

Some feminism is completely against the concept of rights at all, as rights are a tool of the patriarchal, rule orientated legal system. Instead they advocate a legal system with a core belief in care, and founded on the premise of non-violence, i.e. that nobody should suffer any hurt.

DaBreno

I saw a film about Feminism last night. They had one that choke men where they sat. They built a huge battle station to control the galaxy but the men blew it up. Great stuff! The second part is on tomorrow night.

scojones

A Feminist is a lesbian.

el rabitos

feminism is when a fat chick goes into a mans barbers and gets a short back 'n sides

Heisenberg.

This post has been deleted.

simu

Quit the one-liners and instead, tell us where you got the ideas behind the one-liners from!

Anyways, to answer my own question - I've learned bits and pieces about feminism all over the place - school, college, some books - more sci-fi and other fiction than the classic feminist tracts-, blogs, message boards and so on. It's quite an interesting topic imo - the best of it makes very good sense, the worst is interesting for different reasons. I find that the representations you get of feminism in mainstream newspapers and other media to be pretty poorly-researched a lot of the time tbh. I'm also shocked at how bitter many people on boards seem to get at any mention of females being at a disadvantage which is part of the reason I started this thread!

InFront

Obviously things are different on an international level, but are women at any (legal) disadvantages at all in Ireland? Where is 'fatherism'?

monkeyfudge

I think women are still forbidden from eating Yorkie Bars in the UK and Ireland.

DaBreno

I heard it from my Dad. Dad told me God created Lesbians so Feminists couldnt breed. Its Darwinism in action. God bless Darwin.

InFront

Equal labour and voting rights I can agree with entirely, but a girl eating a yorkie, it's just wrong!

InFront

DaBreno wrote:

God bless Darwin.

lol, it's great to see God and Darwin in the same sentence without an argument breaking out!

Karl Hungus

simu wrote:

I'm also shocked at how bitter many people on boards seem to get at any mention of females being at a disadvantage which is part of the reason I started this thread!

Are you really that shocked people are bitter? I can't see why.

We live in a society where men are emasculated. The idea of father's rights are a joke, barely even given consideration by anyone. Total inequality in rape cases / False Rape. We constantly face stereotyping as either the dunce in just about every advert on TV, or the villian/ignorant bastard/chauvinist/what have you. Or god knows how many condescending sneers you'd get from women-types like prepackaged slogans; "Oh you're a man, what would you know?" Basically insulting a man's intelligence based solely on their gender. Not to mention the fact that all this seems to be treated as a big joke.

So with that in mind, I'd a lot of people would think that women who are still balking about feminism is quite condescending. I'd also add that a lot of people would view feminism as no longer about equal rights, but pushing female goals at the expense of males; gender supremacism as it were.

I'm fully prepared to have this post dismissed and laughed at though.

Naikon

monkeyfudge wrote:

I thought this was going to be about how value added tax relates to feminist ideals.

LOL, same here:D

connundrum

mike65 wrote:

Its made looking good more costly. 21% on lippy? Bloody outrageous.

Mike.

Register as a company and take the 13.5% route

Oh and Nell McCafferty (sp) on Newstalk, quite the feminist apparently... and quite a talker too

Brian Capture

Surely the title of this thread should read

"What is a feminist and what does it do?"

Why are you ridiculing the German accent?

Beruthiel

Karl Hungus wrote:

We live in a society where men are emasculated. The idea of father's rights are a joke, barely even given consideration by anyone. Total inequality in rape cases / False Rape. We constantly face stereotyping as either the dunce in just about every advert on TV, or the villian/ignorant bastard/chauvinist/what have you. Or god knows how many condescending sneers you'd get from women-types like prepackaged slogans; "Oh you're a man, what would you know?" Basically insulting a man's intelligence based solely on their gender. Not to mention the fact that all this seems to be treated as a big joke

You're not wrong Ken. That does go on. You could also say that for a lot of the above, women were treated like that since the dawn of time.
With any movement, you will always get fools, that doesn't mean the core of it is wrong, the ideals were there for a reason, starting with the Suffragetts and going on right into the sixties with Betty Friedan, it's thanks to these women that we have gotten where we are today in the west. Many countries still have a long, long way to go.
If men feel emasculated, why is that? Perhaps they don't know what to do with themselves having had the upper hand power wise for so long. They need to re define themselves perhaps and if they don't like the way that things are now, then it's time to start your own movement

Dyr

Beruthiel wrote:

They need to re define themselves perhaps

Screw that, a blokes a bloke.

peasant

You can recognise a true feminist in that she kicks you in the balls after you just held the door open for her ...you chauvinist pig, how dare you !

Nevyn

A Feminism is a woman who thinks she should have the right to self determine.
That is the right to have a say over her own life, her own body and to be able to vote.

It is not 110 year from when women did not have these rights and they were owned by thier fathers and then given in marragie to thier husbands who were then responsible for them.

mike65

Brian Capture wrote:

Why are you ridiculing the German accent?

Check simus' avatar

Mike.

simu

Karl Hungus wrote:

Are you really that shocked people are bitter? I can't see why.

We live in a society where men are emasculated. The idea of father's rights are a joke, barely even given consideration by anyone. Total inequality in rape cases / False Rape. We constantly face stereotyping as either the dunce in just about every advert on TV, or the villian/ignorant bastard/chauvinist/what have you. Or god knows how many condescending sneers you'd get from women-types like prepackaged slogans; "Oh you're a man, what would you know?" Basically insulting a man's intelligence based solely on their gender. Not to mention the fact that all this seems to be treated as a big joke.

So with that in mind, I'd a lot of people would think that women who are still balking about feminism is quite condescending. I'd also add that a lot of people would view feminism as no longer about equal rights, but pushing female goals at the expense of males; gender supremacism as it were.

I'm fully prepared to have this post dismissed and laughed at though.

Well, the fathers' rights and rape situations are nasty alright - I agree with you there but highlighting things like the fact that we have a very low level of female politicians and so on doesn't mean one is denying that these problems affecting men exist. Although the lack of consideration for fathers comes from sexist assumptions in the first place - that it's more natural for any woman to look after the kids etc. The whole area of rape seems to be stuck in the dark ages but it's pretty bad for women too - afaik, they can still ask rape victims about their past sexual history an so on. :eek:

As for ads, meh - most ads are just aimed at stupid people and reflect what makes stupid people feel good about themselves. Unfortunately, jokey sexism is one of these. Still, I'd prefer to have sth approaching 50% female TDs than some dumb ad trying to convince me to buy some useless rubbish because I'm a woman and smarter than men or some such tripe. Also, I'd prefer not to have my son listen to such nonsense - I must teach him cynicism from a young age!

Although some of the most bitter comments were about gender discrimination in the developing world where sexism is far more extensive than here - hence the surprise.

brian capture wrote:

Surely the title of this thread should read

"What is a feminist and what does it do?"

Why are you ridiculing the German accent?

Arnie tribute! This is AH, not one of the more po-faced forums, after all!

Karl Hungus

Beruthiel wrote:

You're not wrong Ken. That does go on. You could also say that for a lot of the above, women were treated like that since the dawn of time.

Now we're getting into this whole "The sins of the father being visited upon the son" crap. Because I don't care how long women have been treated badly, it wasn't this generation of men living today who treated them as such, and it wasn't this generation of women who've been treated as such.

Beruthiel wrote:

Perhaps they don't know what to do with themselves having had the upper hand power wise for so long.

See above. None of the current generation have ever had the upper hand power wise, never mind for "so long" so it's a pointless argument. I've personally never had any upper hand, nor have I treated women badly, and it's pretty much the same across the board.

What you're talking about is assumed guilt, and that's very, very wrong.

Sangre

I studied feminist criminology in college...that was fun.

The Sparrow

I hate the term feminism. I would much prefer if people who were for equality called themselves equalitarians (if that is a word?!) I`m all for equal rights for everybody but I think Karl is right... All this stuff is about thousands of years of oppression against women is ridiculous when it is said by women who have never been oppressed to men who have never oppressed anyone! I view feminism as the new chauvinism.

jesus_thats_gre

Dirty carpet munching skanks!!

Beruthiel

Karl Hungus wrote:

Now we're getting into this whole "The sins of the father being visited upon the son" crap.

I don't recall saying that.

Because I don't care how long women have been treated badly, it wasn't this generation of men living today who treated them as such, and it wasn't this generation of women who've been treated as such.

I was discussing feminism and what we know about it.

None of the current generation have ever had the upper hand power wise

Well, there's more than one generation still alive, I've met quite a few men in my time who still do have out dated views, they are not all dead yet.

RoundyMooney

simu wrote:

Arnie tribute! This is AH, not one of the more po-faced forums, after all!

Hoo iss your Mommy, end vot does she doo? (from nine to five, when she's not doing the school/dancing/singing lesson run, laundry, shopping, or being what advertising execs like to call a "homemaker").

Speaking as someone whose genitalia hang without, we may like to think we're all tolerant and on a par with each other, but then you have those men who consider "keeping house" as a non valid use of a woman's time, (If it were a man at home, he'd probably be considered unemployed), and then you have the "all men are idiots" brigade, who think "sex and the city" is a true to life depiction of the female struggle, and only see as far as the next Prada handbag.

Like Tom Petty, I can't decide which is worse.