Honda civic

gary the great

Im moving to the UK in a couple of momths and im going to avail of the cheaper cars over there and buy something nice (well, nice for a 23 year old!)

Im thinking one of the 2 door civics (the 2002 - 2005 model), with the vtec engine. I think these can be got in 1.6 vtec?

I currently drive a 1.5 323f and although its nippy enough, im looking for something with a bit more power, but still a fairly small car.

Would there much difference in power? What do people think of these cars?

And just another thing, is a vtec far better than a mivec?

bazz26

gary the great wrote:

Im moving to the UK in a couple of momths and im going to avail of the cheaper cars over there and buy something nice (well, nice for a 23 year old!)

Im thinking one of the 2 door civics (the 2002 - 2005 model), with the vtec engine. I think these can be got in 1.6 vtec?

I currently drive a 1.5 323f and although its nippy enough, im looking for something with a bit more power, but still a fairly small car.

Would there much difference in power? What do people think of these cars?

And just another thing, is a vtec far better than a mivec?

Not sure if you are referring to the Civic coupe or hatchback.

As far as I know the Civic coupe was only sold in the UK with a 1.7 litre engine 123bhp from 2001. Not sure it is VTEC either. They did have a 1.6 litre VTEC 3 door hatchback alright but it has a modest 110bhp.

layke

If it's only putting out 123bhp it's not a Vtec.

And to answer your question yes there will be a huge boost in power however insurance will be very high seeing as you have no NCB.

The Vitec is a naturally asperated engine so there's no mods added to give it more of a boost where as the higher end mivecs use a turbo. You will find certain mivec engines out there that are 1.6 and put out about 200bhp. Where a powerful 1.6 Vtec will do roughly 160.

This advice is all model depandant of course.

JohnCleary

You said nice? Buy a BMW or something with a bit of comfort and luxuries, not a frickin honda

Stephen

Jesus, you've had one for a wet week and now you've become one of "them" already.

JHMEG

The 2-door Civic Coupe is 1.7 VTEC (and is SOHC), putting out modest power already mentioned. The nice thing about these is that they are easy enough to get in the UK with full leather etc. The interior is more akin to the 4-door saloon than it is to the 3 or 5-door hatches (eg gear stick on centre console, not on dash). Nice enough car, nippy enough, but no scorcher.

If you are talking about a hatch, then yes, a 3-door 1.6 VTEC (again SOHC, modest power) is available. Also nippy but no scorcher either.

Insurance for both is modest.

If you want a scorcher in that generation you'd be looking at a 2.0 Civic Type-R. High performance, high insurance.

VTEC vs MIVEC: Like-for-like they are quite similar, ie when comparing a 1.6L DOHC VTEC, and a 1.6L DOHC MIVEC. On paper the MIVECs will have slightly more power, but it is reckoned the VTEC engines have better power delivery which negates MIVEC's peak power advantage.

Technically MIVEC has seperate control over the intake and exhaust valve cam profiles by means of two actuators, allowing independent control, whereas with VTEC both cams switch profiles at the same time due to having a single actuator.

Higher end MIVEC *can* come also with turbo chargers, something Honda by and large has chosen not to do.

Biro

JHMEG is bang on there. The '01 - '05 civic v-tec's are SOHC and designed for fuel economy. The older generation vti's (DOHC v-tec) weren't selling too well. The 1.6 DOHC v-tec was 160bhp. Did roughly 33mpg. The newer one will do about 42mpg, but is 110bhp. Power comes from much lower down in this, but it's a completely different ball game to the older ones. Designed for the masses rather than the rev-happy crew!
The coupe is the same story with the 1.7. Reasonable economy, and modest power.
So basically, if you want the manic high reving power go for the older generation. If you want the newer generation, then either settle or splash out on a type R

gary the great

Thats for the input. Thtas a bit disappointing, I was in an SIr Vtec civic years ago and I said when i had a bit of cash its what id get. Although i dont like the look of the older civics, but think the 2002 model was lovely (in 2 door version), so thought i could get an SIR vtec in the new model.

Doubt id ever be able to afford a new style type R.

I may go for an older SIr if I can find one in nice condition with loads of extras. looking to spend about 7k sterling.

JHMEG

For less than £7k you should be able to get a mint '00 Civic VTI (160bhp). Nicest in Coupe form. The few I've seen with leather all had different designs/colours/quality leading me to suspect the leather is aftermarket, and wasn't available as an option.

SiR is the Jap equivalent, and fairly rare in the UK.

gary the great

The type R isnt as dear as i thought, i might splash out - Heres an example, im sure i could get one private for cheaper:

http://www.cargiant.co.uk/cars/detail.asp?Id=313707#

Demmo

Note VTEC engines burn alot of oil especially when some lad thinks he has a Ferrari F360 and redlines it every time to get more power. Its more like a different engine note that more power.

Mivec and Vtec are the same thing, variable valve timing.

The Lancer evo uses a mivec turbo engine.

5500

Demmo wrote:

Note VTEC engines burn alot of oil especially when some lad thinks he has a Ferrari F360 and redlines it every time to get more power. Its more like a different engine note that more power.

Its a hell of alot more than a different engine note,eg my car makes its most bhp at 7000rpm but vtec engages at 5500.Theres a good 60bhp jump from under 5500.

Mine uses practically no oil between 5k changes with daily vtec,its something to be checked every few days but they dont neccesarily all just burn oil unless the car isnt looked after.

@The op - Im looking at an EP CTR too,they can be got for good money in the uk compared to what youd pay here.If possible get a drive of one and it should convince you!

JHMEG

Technically VTEC doesn't give more power. VTEC allows the engine to breath properly at higher RPM, and its the higher RPM that deliver the power (by burning fuel at a faster rate).

Technically (again) if there is a surge in power at 5,500 (or whatever), it means the engine was already having trouble breathing (and the power curve being flattened) just before VTEC switched profiles. The "surge" effect is cool, altho I have only ever noticed it in Preludes. The B-series has more linear power delivery... have never driven a K20, tho cam phasing on those is supposed to smooth out the power curve even more.

gary the great

Whats the fuel economy like on these? Im sure if I use the Vtec its gonna use a lot of petrol, but what MPG should i expect from refraining from using the vtec? I'll be driving it in rural areas mostly.

And i know insurance in the UK is less than here in Ireland, but roughly how much would a 23 year old with a full licence be looking at? I only have about 7 months NCB? I reckon the insurance will be a killer, so may go for an older VTi to make up for it then move up to the type R when I get some NCB and more cash together.

5500

JHMEG wrote:

Technically (again) if there is a surge in power at 5,500 (or whatever), it means the engine was already having trouble breathing (and the power curve being flattened) just before VTEC switched profiles.

So technically i should have the power all the time?My curve is fairly straight on the printout though,bit of a flatspot/dip at 3k but then its back on track but straight up after 5.5.Thats with standard airbox + filter but with the resonator removed,ive seen civics graphs with stuck on cone filters and woefull curves altho the noise at 5.5 is nice!

For a full tank in mine(just over 40 euro) i get about 250miles to a tank city driving,but thats on a 1.6 whereas the Ep your looking at is a 2litre.

Im not too sure of how insurance works in the uk but a vti is group 15 and a type r is group 17 and *i think* group 20 is the highest so both may be pricey to insure.

Mayshine

I drive an S2000 - My commute is about 17km each way in mixed driving - a lot of slow moving traffic included. I fillup with about 40 l = <9 gallons and do about 400-440km (250-275 miles) on the tank

So my MPG is at worst about 28mpg rising to about 31-32mpg on good weeks. Which seems pretty decent when I hear what people are getting with bog standard petrol saloons

gary the great

Quinn wont quote me on there uK site, on both the Type R and Vti. I'll be using it for work to, so maybe I could go on some work insure policy!

Looks like il be just getting another 323f when i go over!