mpeg 4 -

ronan.michael@g

Watty kindly informed me of an mpeg4 receiver (looking to the future) for the transmissions from 3Rock but after a re -format I've lost the info.! (Yeah I know - hav'nt I heard of backup?!) Damage done. If I remember it was purchase on the continent. Many thanks Michael r.

byrnefm

It wasn't the Neotion model, was it?
http://www.pixmania.com/fr/fr/165663/art/neotion/recepteur-enregistreur-tn.html

It's the only one I know of at the moment.

JHMEG

I was talking to someone recently who is *sort of* involved in technical end of the DTT trials. Looks like only HD stuff (some RTE sport) will be mpeg4. The normal SD stuff will be mpeg2.

He also said the new phase 2 channels will be news channels (Sky, CNN, Euronews.. ie stuff that's already FTA on satellite), and that the main UK channels (as speculated) will not be included.

watty

No one in the trials is deciding what happens next. It is not clear who or when is deciding next.

Also the current content is only as provided by those that tendered for the Trail. It has no connection with any nationwide DTT rollout content.

It is really only guesswork as to what the "final" DTT will be. I would guess that most content will be MPEG2, but with permission for a PayTV provider to use MPEG4 SD content as this can be done as in France, via module from Pay TV company that goes in CI slot and has CAM included.

fta keith

Whatever what MPeg2 or Mpeg4 my tv with the digital tv tuner is ready for any diameters

The UK mainstream channels have to be part of the Irish DTT pilot project and the Irish DTT roll out on a fta basis or it could be bankrupt like ITV digital.

As the UK mainstream tv channels apart from channe 4 etc and Five are fta on digital satellite, I don't mind if the 4 terrestrial tv channels and channel6 are the only ones which are FTA on Irish DTT, it will go well with FTA digital satellite

zilog_jones

fta keith wrote:

Whatever what MPeg2 or Mpeg4 my tv with the digital tv tuner is ready for any diameters

Is that sentence supposed to, you know, make sense?

The UK mainstream channels have to be part of the Irish DTT pilot project and the Irish DTT roll out on a fta basis or it could be bankrupt like ITV digital.

No they don't, that is complete bollox. Irish FTA DTT is there to replace analogue terrestrial TV, which contrary to what some people believe is used by a large proportion of the population, including many people nowhere near terrestrial NI/Welsh channel reception (directly or by deflectors or whatever). Irish DTT has absolutely no need to compete with cable/sat/MMDS services, therefore it does not need to include any UK channels. And moreso the pilot tests don't really have to include anything at all - they could just transmit test cards and demos if they wanted to be really mean.

JHMEG

watty wrote:

No one in the trials is deciding what happens next. It is not clear who or when is deciding next.

When is March.

Since March is not far away, whoever is deciding needs to decide soon, if they've haven't done so already.

byte

fta keith wrote:

Whatever what MPeg2 or Mpeg4 my tv with the digital tv tuner is ready for any diameters

Are you quite sure your iDTV is capable of receiving MPEG4 transmissions?

All iDTV's I've seen so far have all been MPEG2 (aimed at UK Freeview viewers).

fta keith

Yes I am very sure its in the tv manual its german made

Tom Dunne

fta keith wrote:

Yes I am very sure its in the tv manual its german made

Just OT for a moment, what's the make and model, if you don't mind? I'm in the market for a new TV, so might aswell go the whole hogg.

Psygnosis

Does any one know of pci card preferably dual that can recieve MPeg4 as well?

watty

For cheap ones the MPEG etc is actually done on your PC, so having 2GHz + (non-Celeron) and a MPEG accelerator like ATI X1600 or better or Nvidia equivalent will work. Esp if you have Cyberlink Power DVD.

For Satellite it is different as most HD is changing to DVB-S2 and Sd may eventually change to DVB-S2 and MPEG4.

MPEG4 saves about 50% bandwidth and DVB-S2 almost a further 30%. DVBS-2 needs a specific tuner card buut will receive ordinary DVB-S also.

DVB-T (DTT)/ Terrestrial is already spectrum efficeient so existing tuner card for MPEG2 will work for MPEG4 with suitable PC software unless it is a HW MPEG2 decoder (most are SW).

SRB

fta keith wrote:

Yes I am very sure its in the tv manual its german made

It may well be German made, but that doesn't mean it's equipped to view MPEG4 channels.

fta keith

Yes it is a friend of mine has the same model for German DTT in Berlin

lawhec

fta keith wrote:

Yes it is a friend of mine has the same model for German DTT in Berlin

And German DVB-T TV broadcasts are all MPEG-2 currently.

SRB

Beat me to it, NC !

keanebg1

tom dunne wrote:

Just OT for a moment, what's the make and model, if you don't mind? I'm in the market for a new TV, so might aswell go the whole hogg.

I too would be interesting in the make and model, Did'nt know there were any Mpeg4 ddt ready TVs available...

byte

fta kieth, tell us make and model of this apparent MPEG4 capable iDTV

Tom Dunne

byte wrote:

fta kieth, tell us make and model of this apparent MPEG4 capable iDTV

Please do, I'm intrigued.

Mossy Monk

fta keith will probably go missing for a few days

not necessarily a bad thing

fta keith

My Integrated tv model is a sharp 32 inch HD tv with in built digital tv tuner

in 4 weeks the second phrase of the Irish DTT pilot project will begin with Channel 6 fta and most of uk mainstream tv channels fta as well

With my UK freesat sky card giving me every sky subscription channel for the month of February, then March 2007 the second phrase of the pilot project of Irish DTT we will see who has gone missing

furthermore

I don't really watch any of the sky subscription tv channels as the FTA tv channels are better

DMC

fta keith wrote:

in 4 weeks the second phrase of the Irish DTT pilot project will begin with Channel 6 fta and most of uk mainstream tv channels fta as well

How much are you willing to wager on the above?

slicedpanman

fta keith wrote:

in 4 weeks the second phrase of the Irish DTT pilot project will begin with Channel 6 fta and most of uk mainstream tv channels fta as well

Well I for one really really hope that fta_keith is correct... But I'n not even sure that they can even get their act together enough to start phase 2 in 4 weeks. As far as I recall it was left as vague as March 07, so I would bet that it will only start on the very last day of March.... :rolleyes:

But I do hope I am wrong and keith is correct

Mossy Monk

fta keith wrote:

in 4 weeks the second phrase of the Irish DTT pilot project will begin with Channel 6 fta and most of uk mainstream tv channels fta as well

who told you this? your deep throat source at the communications department?

JHMEG

fta keith.. what model number is that Sharp TV?

byrnefm

slicedpanman wrote:

But I'n not even sure that they can even get their act together enough to start phase 2 in 4 weeks.

Since there are other companies concerned wrt the roll-out, we might be lucky and that they start on time .. but I'm putting my bets mid-way, ie. in time for St Patrick's Day

Now that Channel 6 is going to be on Sky, would Sky let them put it on DTT also? Or is the sample size of the DTT testers too small for them to care (and that it's 'just' a trial)?

Fingleberries

byrnefm wrote:

Now that Channel 6 is going to be on Sky, would Sky let them put it on DTT also? Or is the sample size of the DTT testers too small for them to care (and that it's 'just' a trial)?

I don't think Sky will care too much once Channel 6 Cough up their money on-time.

I digress. I'll keep my Channel Speculation for the other speculation threads and leave this as an Mpeg4 discussion.

byte

Yes, back on topic or thread will be closed.

Mossy Monk

byrnefm wrote:

Now that Channel 6 is going to be on Sky, would Sky let them put it on DTT also?

Sky don't have a say in how channels not owned by them are broadcast

Tom Dunne

JHMEG wrote:

fta keith.. what model number is that Sharp TV?

fta_keith is being very evasive on the make and model number.

A quick google shows he may in fact have his information wrong (surely not!). I found two sharp LCD tv's that allow mpeg4 video playback via a PC card slot. Linky 1 and linky 2. One has a dvb-t tuner, the only reference I can see to mpeg4 is the playback via the pc card, not dvb-t.

As I am still looking to purchase a tv with in-built dvb-t tuner, I would really love to be proved wrong by fta_keith.

Mossy Monk

so are you saying that he may not be equipped for the future?

Tom Dunne

Mossy Monk wrote:

so are you saying that he may not be equipped for the future?

I would never make such broad statements, unless I knew what I was talking about and had checked my facts.

ronan.michael@g

byrnefm wrote:

It wasn't the Neotion model, was it?
http://www.pixmania.com/fr/fr/165663/art/neotion/recepteur-enregistreur-tn.html

It's the only one I know of at the moment.

Many many thanks to all who have offered advice on my request. Been "off-air" for a while - sorry for delay in answering. Thanks again to all. Michael r.

8T8

Just curious but some of you mentioning MPEG-4 in the DTT are you referring to MPEG-4 ASP (of which XviD & friends are based off) or MPEG-4 AVC (H.264 & Co) ?

As those are separate standards & within those there are sub standards like in H.264 which has baseline/simple, main & high profiles etc. I recall some time ago a news blurb about the DTT trials and I think H.264 was mentioned but I'm not sure.

For example if they started using high profile H.264 then even if you had a H.264 hardware decoder but limited to main profile it would not be able to decode the broadcast.

DMC

tom dunne wrote:

fta_keith is being very evasive on the make and model number.

Still no reply to the exact device fta keith has........

Mossy Monk

i suspect the tv isnt mpeg4 compatible at all

byte

Mossy Monk wrote:

i suspect the tv isnt mpeg4 compatible at all

It would seem that you are correct by the look of things.

However, back onto the topic of MPEG4...

watty

The only TVs I know that work with MPEG4 are ones that are really MPEG2 with a CAM slot. Neotion make a MPEG4 to MPEG2 convertor used in French TVs and set boxes. Due to design of MPEG2 decoders in such TVs and set boxes and limits to speed a CI slot (CAM slot) can run, these convertors can NEVER ever do HD MPEG4. They are only for regular resolution MPEG4.

Yes it is all H.264 versions that EVERYONE doing MPEG transmissions uses, and indeed HD services do NOT all use the same profile, hence on Satellite only one model of HD receiver box could receive BBC HD initially.

On satellite there is also the additional problem that most HD only transponders use a new modulation scheme and can't even be tuned on older receivers. However that is unlikely to happen on DTT.

fta keith

Irish to get HD, but not us Back
08 February 2007


Ireland will show the UK how to do it when it launches its digital terrestrial television (DTT) service, which is expected to feature high definition content, according to an ERT Weekly investigation.
A two-year Government-funded DTT pilot project kicked off last August and next month will see a 1,000-home trial across the east coast of Ireland – from Dublin to Dundalk.
According to one industry source, the test, which is transmitting from the Three Rock site in south Co. Dublin and from the Clermont Carn site in Co. Louth, is in standard definition for the time being.
“However, the preferred strategy when the full service is introduced – probably at the end of 2008 – is that at launch, or very soon thereafter, there will be high-definition service,” said the spokesman.
“Part of the DTT service will include HD content.”
ERT Weekly understands that the test currently uses the MPEG 2 transmission standard, but that there will also be high capacity MPEG 4 when the national service rolls out.
The spokesman said: “Although nothing is decided, trials have started and the specification may change during the course of the test.”
The position in Ireland is somewhat different to the UK, where regulator Ofcom is caught up in a row about its proposed auction of broadcast spectrum that will be freed following the move to digital TV.
It had been hoped that the Government would earmark some of it to bring high-definition viewing to digital terrestrial TV. The move – which is likely to see a series of auctions in the second half of 2008 – would put an end, many believe, to any hopes of this country ever having an HD service on digital terrestrial TV.
The Irish source said: “It is believed that one of the features that will be used to make the DTT service attractive to viewers will be the availability of HD content.
“High definition will form part of the DTT trial between now and August 2008.”
In the UK, the industry disagreed with Ofcom’s stance and set up the HD for All Group of broadcasters, manufacturers and retailers to push for spectrum to be held for a free terrestrial HDTV service.
It has just over two months to change ministerial minds – consultation on what to do with the digital dividend closes on March 20.
This week, HD for All launched its consumer campaign, after a successful launch in the trade press through ERT Weekly.
Readers can download a protest letter to sign and send to ministers to demonstrate their support for a high-definition TV service on Freeview, via our website, www.ertweekly.com.

It appears MPeg4 would be used after all on this Irish DTT project

DMC

fta keith, when you get the chance, can you look around the back of your telly and tell us what model it is? Thanks.

fta keith

LC32GD8E 32-inch HD-ready Digital LCD TV (Freeview)

Tom Dunne

Hmmmm. It's interesting how the manual I downloaded from Sharp's website mentions nothing about mpeg4. Download here.

It does however, mention mheg5 (Multimedia and Hypermedia Expert Group). Could this be the source of our confusion?

DMC

MHEG5, of course, is the Digital Text format on Freeview in the UK.

No further questions, your honour... take him down....

byte

fta keith wrote:

Whatever what MPeg2 or Mpeg4 my tv with the digital tv tuner is ready for any diameters

It seems you were quite wrong when you posted this then.

I suggest you refrain from posting this sort of rubbish, and do some research before bragging about stuff you don't really have. It does not help others.

Posting rubbish and misguided information isn't tolerated too well here, bear that in mind as I will not be lenient next time.

fta keith

I am sorry it appears I may have read the manual the wrong way

John Dough

Poor FTA Keith now he has to buy a proper mpeg 4 telly!!!

John Dough

DMC wrote:

How much are you willing to wager on the above?

byte

The End.