Horses given poor rides

BobbyD10

Just wanted to talk in general and not specific, but what annoys me more than a horse performing under par is a horse given a poor ride.

How often do we say I could have done better when watching a bet going down the pan, maybe we just notice the losers and pick up on any faults, but winners can be given poor rides too.

In particular what frustrates me in a jump race in a close final couple of furlongs the jockey stops hitting the horse and slows nearly completely too jump a fence rather than looking for a good jump to keep momentum going.

Has anyone else anything which pains them when watching races...?

keepitquiet

wat annoys me is when ive bet on a horse and it runs all the way round the outside to get 'better ground' and ends up being pulled up. has a horse ever benefited from this? timmy murphy seems to do it now and again but it rly annoys me. i think if ur horse cant run on the ground dont run. this better ground stuff rarely works.

as far as poor runs i dont mind them too much(unless i have a big wager) cas if there not to obvious u know the horse should be gd next time out. one race tht i thought was run poorly by the jockey recently tht i was pleased about was ikitaaf as i had no wager on the horse and felt tht the jockey rode him bad. he left the horse with no chance to challenge at the end. we shall probably see at leapordstown but i will be backing the horse before this race for cheltenham with 9/1 availiable.

fade2black

Holding up horses in bottomless ground will always annoy me.

wb

I hate it when a jockey does not race for a place. I've often backed horses to be placed/each-way only for them to be eased up as soon as the winner crosses the line.

keepitquiet

wb wrote:

I hate it when a jockey does not race for a place. I've often backed horses to be placed/each-way only for them to be eased up as soon as the winner crosses the line.

this is why i prefer betting on big races. more anticipation and excitement as you feel like you know the horses as celebrities and therres thousands of pounds difference in prize money between coming 3rd and 4th.

Morgans

Note the jockeys that give horses bad rides and factor it into your betting beforehand. Note which jockeys who make the least mistakes and use the information the next time you bet. There is no point whining afterwards.

masterK

Obviously jockeys do give horses poor rides but a lot of the time it's people talking through their pocket and it wasn't that poor at all. Quite often the jockey will know a horse has had it and that there is no point hitting it any more and will ease the horse home, but many people would say he gave the horse an awful ride.

I agree with Fade my pet hate is holding horses up on heavy ground and then making a move half a mile from home expecting the horse to fly. One such example was Niall Maddens ride on Jaamid in the Pierce on Sunday (I'm talking through my pocket btw.). As the race started he make no effort to get any sort of position and quite happily settled the horse in last of 30 runners, he hadn't moved a muscle a mile out, the horse was still last. He eventually flew home to finish 5th, couldn't help thinking if he'd taken a better position from the off he would have been at least placed.

It can be very annoying with jockeys that think they can do a Ruby Walsh or Timmy Murphy and sit off the pace only to cruise through the field to get up on the line making them look great in the process, it rarely happens.

Bluetonic

BobbyD10 wrote:

In particular what frustrates me in a jump race in a close final couple of furlongs the jockey stops hitting the horse and slows nearly completely too jump a fence rather than looking for a good jump to keep momentum going.

Any decent jockey will know that no world of hitting a horse will make it do something that it doesn't want to do. Personally I would like to see the whip banned.

masterK wrote:

One such example was Niall Maddens ride on Jaamid in the Pierce on Sunday.....He eventually flew home to finish 5th, couldn't help thinking if he'd taken a better position from the off he would have been at least placed.

For a big race like that you should be really looking at a bet in the bookies for the 5th place, Powers and Boyles both paid to the 5th horse.

Morgans

I agree to an extent, but it is harder to judge in heavy ground, and I understand that making up ground is harder in heavy ground, but its a fine balance. It is probably the lithus test of a jockey. Ruby's ride on Ladalko at Warwick last week is about as good a ride as you will see all year.

THe temptation is to take it easy in heavy ground. For instance, at Christmas, Nickname was given a brilliant waiting ride in the Dial A Bet Chase. In stark contrast to Central House who was given little chance of winning the race by Roger Loughran by going too quick in the ground. It wouldnt surprise me if Central House takes longer than normal to recover than the winner from the race.

It could just be that 5th was as good as Jaamid was and those who he flew past in the final furlong may well have benefitted from being held up more. Of course, maybe not.

My pet hate with regard to poor jockeyship is jockeys who travel well in front (or just off the pace) and are done by possibly a poorer horse getting first run on them from behind by being galvanised earlier and having the momentum to go clear before the other jockey can react.

masterK

Bluetonic wrote:

For a big race like that you should be really looking at a bet in the bookies for the 5th place, Powers and Boyles both paid to the 5th horse.

Ye, Ye, I know. I thought I was being clever taking the much better prices on Betfair.

Colonel Sanders

masterK wrote:

Ye, Ye, I know. I thought I was being clever taking the much better prices on Betfair.

You should always go for the bigger price. IF you're backing according to the place terms then surely this is an admission that your horse is not good enough to win but you feel he might get placed? In this case you are throwing away the win part of the bet and are much better off betting place only on betfair.

scojones

Jockeys do give poor rides; they're only human. We've all seen jockeys going for gaps that didn't exist, looking around them and not seeing something flying up their inside so they ease off and lose (a certain ride on Carthalawn comes to mind).

As has already been said in this thread, you have to factor this in to your future selections.

To go on a slight tangent for a second, my pet hate about this sport is muppets in the bookies who threw a few hundred on Ruby just because he was on an evens favourite and when he doesn't win they say "I'll never back that fcuking Ruby Walsh again"... yet two days later they do the exact same thing.

They can't distinguish between a bad ride, and the horse not being good enough so they blame the jockey anyway - if they blamed the horse they are admitting they're wrong, and this happens every day in every bookies in the country, and it's a farse.

Sometimes you need to give the jockey the benefit of the doubt. I try to picture the race beforehand, to get a better picture of how I think the horse should be ridden. If a jockey lets you down, it's time to rethink things. As said above, jockey's easing up when they know they can't win is really annoying when you have a place bet. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think Lester was reknowned for this.

Morgans

Lester was. Pat Eddery another culprit, and Richard Hughes does it a good bit among jockeys that are still riding.

fade2black

Regardless of whether he would've won or lost on Sunday (He wouldn't have won but the point is still valid) Dosco was given a ride that I believe gave the horse little chance. He was travelling sweetly and then Maxwell seemed to panic and push and shove away. So often we see horses canter around and still get beaten by the horse who's been driven behind him and given more time reach his potential for the race. Anyway, I agree, this is something that irritates me too.

Sometimes jocks like to do it as stylishly as possible and this will often endanger their chances of success. George Baker is a jock that I rarely back....although he's many people's fav (or top 10) I don't like his constant hold up tactics.

BobbyD10

Bluetonic wrote:

Any decent jockey will know that no world of hitting a horse will make it do something that it doesn't want to do. Personally I would like to see the whip banned.


No one is talking of over hitting or even hitting at all, just observations of poor riding, which other posters have mentioned can be avoided in future by not backing these jockeys.

I would agree the the whip is not a pretty thing to see when horses are tired, and probably should be avoided, that could be another debate in itself.