Test Dial up with NTL connection

kippy

Howdy,
Right, to settle an argument.
A friend of mine has an NTL DSL connection at home.
He is adament that he can use this to test a standard analog connection (dial up) from a laptop. I am 99% sure that he cannot.
He reckons it will be possible to purchase some sort of converter:
Like this:
http://www.komplett.ie/k/ki.asp?sku=316210&view=detailed
Which will allow him to plug his laptop modem into it and dial up to eircom.

Even if the device above performs miracles, I do not believe it is possible to do this with an NTL connection (IE connect it to an analogue modem and "split" for use as dial up.)

Clarification required.
Cheers,
Kippy

Static M.e.

Im with you Kippy, I dont see how he can Dial up using an NTL DSL.

By its defination Dial Up uses an Telephone line to connect. Using a telephone over the internet is not the same as "Connecting to a telephone line"

From Wikipedia

Dial-up access is a form of Internet access through which the client uses a modem connected to a computer and a telephone line to dial into an Internet service provider's (ISP) node to establish a modem-to-modem link, which is then routed to the Internet.

He is assuming that NTL will have a modem ready to answer his modems call?

Also NTL uses Analogue Cable so Im presume he is at least trying to connect with an Cable modem

kippy

He intends to attach the internal modem in his laptop to some "device" which will in turn connect "somehow" to the NTL modem and dial out through this method.

Static M.e.

Let us know how it turns out

fatherdougalmag

An Analog Telephone Adapter (ATA) takes, as input, an ethernet connection. The ATA will typically connect to a SIP VOIP provider. The ATA will then have one or more analog telephone (POTS) ports. If you plug a phone into it and go off hook you will hear a dial tone. In theory you can plug an analog modem or fax machine into the POTS port and use it as normal. In practice this is not always workable due to the nature of the Internet connection to the SIP/VOIP provider (e.g. packet loss, latency, etc.) There has been some discussion elsewhere on boards (VOIP?) where people have ditched their landline and gone with NTL or wireless Internet provider and subsequently had Sky digital installed. Sky requires you to connect your digibox to a phone line for the first 12 months (it has an internal modem for connecting to services). Some people have reported failure and some have reported success when they plug their digibox into their ATA.

kippy

Thanks for the replies.
What if there is no SIP or VOIP provider configured at the far end? Or if you havent gotten a "phone number" as would be the case with NTL.
I am surprised that an analog modem would work with an NTL connection at all, considering that there isn't a "telephone" signal on the NTL connection at all.
Thanks for clarification thus far.
Kippy

fatherdougalmag

The ATA emulates a phone line. It generates the dialtone itself. The dialtone doesn't come from the NTL cable. You will need an account with a SIP provider (assuming it's a SIP-based ATA). You can sign up with a free SIP provider (e.g. www.freespeech.ie) and some of them (e.g. freespeech) will assign you a phone number (in Ireland this means an 076 number).

kippy

Okay then.
This is something that I didnt think was possible.
Will the device I have linked to from Komplett be of any assistance to the setup?
Can I use my digweb metro with my standard integrated modem on my laptop if I connect the laptop to the phone port on the digweb modem?
Apologies for the questioning-its just something that I cant get my head around.
Kippy

fatherdougalmag

Yes. The Handytone (or any ATA e.g. Sipura) can do this in conjunction with a SIP account. Can we ask why you would want dial-up access over a broadband connection? Just curiosity?

kippy

Its for testing modems and setting up and testing dial up connections on laptops and desktops which may not have access to BB normally.
Kippy

fatherdougalmag

I'd be inclined to either get a proper phone line for that kind of thing (especially if a commercially based service) or a PSTN line/network simulator. You might have some luck in finding a redundant analog/POTS PBX. If he insists on going down the ATA route, he should probably look at setting up his own SIP server (e.g. asterisk) so as to minimise things like packet loss and latency.

kippy

Cheers for the feedback.
If he had his own ATA such as the one on Komplett, would he be able to (without spending any further money) use his analog modem to connect to a service such as eircomnet?
This is basicilly the brunt of the argument.
Kippy

fatherdougalmag

It would be difficult to say. It all depends on his underlying broadband connection performance. You can imagine that, with a regular phone line, the connect speed (or even the ability to connect) will depend on the physical condition of the line. Translating that to a SIP-based connection you will be subject to packet loss and latency (especially since the NTL routing is still going through Amsterdam et al.) So no guarantees can be made in advance.

You might be better off asking these questions either over on the VOIP forum here on boards or the forums over on www.blueface.ie. They have a utility which measures the quality of your connection to their SIP server. Based on it's output, they might be able to give you a more authoritative answer.

Static M.e.

Hey Kippy,

Just wondering how your friend got on?

kippy

Well, there were a few things he failed to mention to me.
In his place of work they have a SIP server. Once he was able to get the ATA speaking to this he had no problems in getting the device working.
What he wasnt able to do was to convert his DSL to PSTN (which was the main technical point of the argument)
But other wise he was able to use his NTL connection with his modem but needed to have his own (or a paid subscription to ) a SIP server as mentioned above.
Kippy