Routing broadband source to house

shortys94

Hello

Just wanted some quick advice, will try to make as clear as possible as to what my situation is.
Have a wireless broadband provider coming around tomorrow to look at house with the aim of putting the receiver(??) up. Problem is we have two houses on property as we built a log cabin on site. The log cabin is very close to the main house where the broadband will be needed, well under 100 metres.
We plan to put the receiver on the peak of the main house, but if the log cabin's peak is higher (cabin is in direction of mast) and we need to put the receiver on the log cabin then I just wanted to know what the best way of routing the cable to the main house would be. I know it is best not to go over 100 metres of ethernet cable when wiring, and Im pretty sure the two houses are close enough in order to route the cable across in a concealed manner. But I was wondering what kind of conditions the ethernet cable can withstand, I mean could it be brought in the air from house to house? Could it be brought under the horizontal wooden struts on stud fencing? Is it prone to be bitten by rodents etc? Weather?

Or are there any relatively cheap wireless solutions that would be good, Id prefer not to use wireless though.

Then again we may not have to worry about this at all, but just in case.

Sorry if explanation is unclear, but please try and advise me.

Capt'n Midnight

if you could run a small trench and put wavin pipe in it 1/2" or 20mm
co ax used to suffer in cold weather and in general the drier you keep cables the better.

or just try the cable by itself to see how you get on http://www.connectix.com do relaviely cheap Cat5e - best to put two or three cables as most of the work is in the labour and you can use the others for something else later

shortys94

Yea thanks for the advice, I suppose I should ask the engineer what he thinks if it cant be put on main house, they dont want to be doing too much work.

btw capt'n midnight that link does not work for me.

Bluefoam

Out of interest, why don't you want a wireless network. I've just installed one and the speeds are quite good, so is the access from all parts of the house and garden. I'm surprised how good the signal is because the internal wass are solid block...

I have WPA encryption which is quite a high level.

Capt'n Midnight

Bluefoam wrote:

I have WPA encryption which is quite a high level.

Anything less is an inconvinece rather than secure.


/my bad it's http://www.connectix.ie/

shortys94

Ok, were geoing to buy FTP ethernet cable if we can, or just UTP and water pipe to surround the cable, then put it behind curbing. Then seal ends of water pipe so no moisture can get into pipe.

But can someone tell me this, we are going to use the broadband source for two houses, the log cabin is were the wireless receiver for the bb is and the house is less than 70 metres away. Anyway I have a wireless router in the house and wanted to know that if i put a new wireless router in the log cabin could I put the bb source into the wan port of that router in the cabin and then from the LAN1 port bring the wire accross to the other house and plug it into the wan port of the other router, and then distribute signals from that router also.

Will this work alright?
Basically can I use the signal with two routers,
-source-wan port-lan port to second router into wan port- than distribute signal wirelessly or wired throughout both houses.

axer

shortys94 wrote:

Ok, were geoing to buy FTP ethernet cable if we can, or just UTP

UTP will be fine as long as you are not going paralell with any high voltage cable.

shortys94 wrote:

But can someone tell me this, we are going to use the broadband source for two houses,

Just be aware using broadband in two houses could actually breach the terms of service of your broadband supplier but I doubt they would find out.

shortys94 wrote:

Anyway I have a wireless router in the house and wanted to know that if i put a new wireless router in the log cabin could I put the bb source into the wan port of that router in the cabin and then from the LAN1 port bring the wire accross to the other house and plug it into the wan port of the other router, and then distribute signals from that router also.

You should go from an Ethernet (LAN) port on one wireless router to an Ethernet (LAN) port on the other wireless router as this is the easiest way to do it. If you are using two routers then you must turn off DHCP in one of the routers. Yes, that way you can have two wireless signals (one in the house and one in the log cabin).

shortys94

Thanks axer,

I need just a wireless signal in the log cabin, and then a wireless and wired signal in the house. So could I just put the broadband source into wan port of log cabin router thenfrom LAN 1 bring cable t house router to port WAN and then distribute wirelessly and wired from LAN 1?

Sorry if i am confusing you.

Also if you mean high voltage cable, do you mean esb electricity lines? As theres none on the ground in our area, sorry underground.

We may go for FTP for longevity.

I currently have a buffalo router in the house whch has the ports, wan lan1 etc. But would http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055044407
be a good choice for the log cain, would it have a wan port, lan 1 port etc?

THanks again

Jaeger

Can't you use WDS?

The antenna will likely have it's own WRAP, providing an ethernet connection down. Connect that cable to the WAN interface of the router in the house you've mounted the antenna on, then use WDS between the two routers?

For bandwidth reasons tho, cabling would be preferable alright.

axer

shortys94 wrote:

I need just a wireless signal in the log cabin, and then a wireless and wired signal in the house. So could I just put the broadband source into wan port of log cabin router thenfrom LAN 1 bring cable t house router to port WAN and then distribute wirelessly and wired from LAN 1?

You could just plug one end of the long cable connecting the log cabin and the house into LAN1 of each router - that would be the easiest way. You may need to go from the WAN port in the house to LAN1 in the log cabin if you need more security.

shortys94 wrote:

Also if you mean high voltage cable, do you mean esb electricity lines? As theres none on the ground in our area, sorry underground.

I mean any 220v cables i.e. dont run them in the same pipe.

shortys94 wrote:

We may go for FTP for longevity.

I dont think FTP lasts longer than UTP. The difference is there is a foil shielding in the FTP cable to block electromagnetic interference effecting the signal. You would use this if you were running cat5 near machinary, large motors or alongside 220v cables.

shortys94 wrote:

I currently have a buffalo router in the house whch has the ports, wan lan1 etc. But would http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055044407
be a good choice for the log cain, would it have a wan port, lan 1 port etc?

They should be fine. You could just use a access point but they are about the same price as the wireless routers and since you need a 4 port switch aswell. Those two seem fine.

shortys94

Yea, about the linksys router, does that take wireless broadband signals?

Yea thanks, I think Ill go from the LAN 1 port on the log cabin router to the wan port in the house router. Hopefully this wokrs without any complications.

The guy installing the broadband said that FTP has extra layers of coating, so if moisture got in at least another layer would be there, but since we are putting water pipe around the wire and sealing at both ends maybe utp would be fine as you said, Ill just see what the prices are like for the wire today, but the guy said the FTP would be around 80 euro for the roll

axer

shortys94 wrote:

The guy installing the broadband said that FTP has extra layers of coating, so if moisture got in at least another layer would be there, but since we are putting water pipe around the wire and sealing at both ends maybe utp would be fine as you said, Ill just see what the prices are like for the wire today, but the guy said the FTP would be around 80 euro for the roll

When you go to purchase the cable or check the prices - check the make up of the insulation in both. Both will have a PVC insulation and the FTP will have a foil insulation under the PVC also. This "extra layer" affords no protection against the elements. It is there solely to protect the cable against EMI and EMI only. Im not sure that guy you were talking to knew what he was talking about.

You can purchase outdoor/buried rated cat5 cable that requires no conduit at all but it can be very expensive.

shortys94

I think the guy knew what he was talking about, I think he just meant it may help a little if moisture breaks through.

Anyway thanks for mentioning that cable which requires no conduit, store wasnt open yesterday so will try and get that cable if its at the right price because if utp and water pipe cost around the same as the no conduit required cable then theres less trouble involved in setting up the cable which requires no conduit.

Any specific name for the cable that requires no conduit? Will have a look at prices.

Also never heard of this site http://www.radionics.ie/cgi-bin/bv/rswww/home.do?returningUser=N&cacheID=ienetscape

But do you know if they have the cable that you were referring to, which is suitable for burying

axer

It is called direct burial cat5 cable. It comes will a gel filled layer to protect the cable. Radionics have this one which is waterproof but you would need to ask them is it ok for direct burial. It does not seem to be gel filled (I think it is just for outdoor use).

Your cat5 cable run is susceptible to being hit by lighting and frying the routers at each end. You can buy a surge protector if you want to protect your equipment. Not sure who sells them in Ireland though. I see radionics have this which might be suitable. Make sure it can withstand the load.

shortys94

Thanks but the link for the radionics direct burial cable did not work for me....

Would like to see price on the site so I know if Ibm being ripped off when I go to the store

axer

above links fixed.

shortys94

Nearest place doesnt do direct burial cable, they said they have the cable eircom use, whatever that is. Anyway we decided were going to get 100 metres of UTP as its only around 30 or 40 euro and get some piping to protect it. THe guy said ftp does have extra shielding though.

shortys94

Broadband installer said a switch or hub???? might be something to get, any explanation of this? I didnt think these would provide wireless..

Anyway any recommendations on easy routers to set up and will work with my current buffalo router.

Set wanted:

Wireless receiver--wan port on router1 and from lan port 1---to wan port on router 2 and distribute wirelessly and wired(both needed on second router)

Thanks. Note already have router 2, buffalo,

axer

shortys94 wrote:

Broadband installer said a switch or hub???? might be something to get, any explanation of this? I didnt think these would provide wireless..

You would get a wireless router with a 4 port switch built in.

shortys94 wrote:

Anyway any recommendations on easy routers to set up and will work with my current buffalo router.

I have used linksys wireless routers before and they worked fine.

shortys94 wrote:

Set wanted:

Wireless receiver--wan port on router1 and from lan port 1---to wan port on router 2 and distribute wirelessly and wired(both needed on second router)

Thanks. Note already have router 2, buffalo,

You could just go from lan1 on the buffalo to lan1 on the linksys router if you wanted. Would work fine that way and would be by far the easiest way but it would put everything on the same network.

shortys94

Thanks but would I not go from the lan port of the first router to the wan port of the scond router? Or no? Sorry

Also is the wireless router with a 4port switch built in just the 4 lan ports?

axer

shortys94 wrote:

Thanks but would I not go from the lan port of the first router to the wan port of the scond router? Or no? Sorry

You dont actually need to. You can go from one Ethernet (LAN) port to another Ethernet (LAN) port using a cross-over cable or you can go from the WAN port of the router in your house to the Ethernet (LAN) port of buffalo router. The first method is the easiest while the second method allows you to split up the network (so anyone connected to the buffalo router is not directly connected to those connected via the router in the house.

shortys94 wrote:

Also is the wireless router with a 4port switch built in just the 4 lan ports?

I believe the router has 4 Ethernet (LAN) ports and 1 WAN port.

shortys94

Thanks axer for help, much appreciated.

The only thing Im not sure of now is when buying the router how does ADSL,DSL and CABLE differenciate, I mean do they all have the 4 LAN ports and LAN port.

Planning to buy in argos, a netgear, as its conveniant. 54mbps.
I think its 74 euro for the cable version of the router...good choice?
They also have one which is 120 euro but says its if your going from the phone line into the router.

axer

shortys94 wrote:

The only thing Im not sure of now is when buying the router how does ADSL,DSL and CABLE differenciate, I mean do they all have the 4 LAN ports and LAN port.

You want a DSL router with an ethernet (RJ45) WAN port. ADSL and DSL are all the one when it comes to routers. A cable router is different and not what you need.

shortys94 wrote:

Planning to buy in argos, a netgear, as its conveniant. 54mbps.
I think its 74 euro for the cable version of the router...good choice?

The dlink or linksys routers would be better but I do not know much about netgear. Im sure it would be fine - at least you can bring it back easy enough. Maplin sell linksys routers if you are near any stores - they are handy to bring stuff back to too.

shortys94 wrote:

They also have one which is 120 euro but says its if your going from the phone line into the router.

You would use that type of router if you were getting your broadband via a telephone line which you obviously are not.

shortys94

Yea lol sorry for all the questions but referring to the cable type of router, I think argos sell two types only, phone line or cable, when they state cable is there an ychance its DSL? Sorry just dont have catalog on me, its in car and its snowing.

JohnnieM

If its broadband from a wireless provider you ideally need a wan router. get a four port with around €69 .something like .d link di 604 ..It is possible to use a dsl router but thet are more suited to digital subscriber line..(DSL)

shortys94

Thanks JohnnieM, Just having a look at argos catalog and they diversify the two types of router with phone line or cable.
For example they have this d link model and they categorize it under the phone line type: http://www.expansys.ie/p.aspx?i=137795
Is this the kind of router I should be looking for or is it the router they classify as a cable router : http://www.dlink.com/products/?pid=316

So is it the adsl or cable router I should be looking for in Argos? I think its the routers classified as phone line routers in argos I should be looking towards? As they state they are ADSL, anyway any advice?

JohnnieM

Yeah that DI-524 is exactly what you need four ports and built in wi fi..

shortys94

O ok, thanks, I just thought cable meqant the wan port was an input for a coaxial plug.