Self-protection for my 75 year old uncle...

Baggio...

Top of the morning,

I was asked a question by my uncle the other day.

He wanted to know a few good physical skills for someone like him - basically he's in his 70's and he's pretty rickety at this stage (his words not mine ).

So obviously I told him about the soft skills - but he's more interested in the physical side of things. So I advised - eye/throat shots, possible knee to the groin (obviously you would follow that up), gouging, etc. Showed him a chin jab - but I don't think he's got the power to do any real damage.

Basically I advised him to strike vulnerable areas as many times as he could while calling for help (assuming he could not avoid or escape). Could he pull it off? Can't say that he would, but it might be useful against a jittery type of attacker who was not expecting any resistance.

Anyone got any other ideas or another perspective?

Ta',

Bagg.

PS - obviously I told the unc. to give up the wallet or whatever the attacker wanted in the first place. But lets assume the atacker is going to put the old guy out of commission so it's safe for him to grab the wallet.

walt0r

He needs to have some strength to pull off nearly all self defence moves on any sort of half arsed attacker. Tell him to start taking steroids and bulk up and he'll be an animal by 80!

Millionaire

Hi Rob

Thats a good question.

When I was teaching KM/Combatives in Rathmines last year, and very old man came to me for training. He said he was 65 on the phone, but when he came down he had to be 75.

This is true... he wanted to learn some SD, as he wore a wig (i told him to leave that at home for training0, and young pricks were slagging him about the wig, so he was scared, and wanted some confidence.

So I took him and I trained him in basic KM, mixed with Basic combatives. He trained with me for 3 months, and recognising he was 75 and not a young athlete and he would not have the ability.... he attitude wise was one of the best students and he gave ot 110% with his ability.

He was well able to work from a Fence, and he could throw a powerful palm shot and open handed strike, pretty much as good as any of the 30 year olds I had. He could also elbow, and knee too.

He was very interested, did not miss one class, and I am confident if anyone got physcial he, would have been well able to land and young prick on his butt.

Could you imagine the shock a young prick would get if and old guy floored him with a Palm shot.

Of course I covered all the Advoidence etc etc too with him.

I made no real exception for him, and he learned and did drills just the same as everyone else... of course as instructor I did keep an eye on him to stop him over doing it!

Dyr

in terms of pragmatsim think otu of the box....big heavy walking stick, nice brass top. A big f*** off dog can work wonders too.

Roper

Hey,
Who among you would mess with Charlton Heston, and he must be 80 plus by now? I wouldn't, he was Ben Hur ffs. And he fought off a whole bunch of monkey-men.

I don't know what I was getting at there, eh let me see... maybe your uncle should get an acting career?

Quillo

Legal issues aside...

His best best is a weapons based approach. Something, anything, that can help even out the physical differences between a 75 year old and someone, probably, in their 20's.

And Bambi's dog suggestion would certainly help too.

Is your uncle concerned mainly with safety in the home or both inside and outside ?

Baggio...

Millionaire wrote:

Could you imagine the shock a young prick would get if and old guy floored him with a Palm shot.

Hey Mill,

That's exactly what I was thinking... My Unc. a bit of a psycho too and he's definitely give it a try. Good story about that student you had. Just shows anything is possible.

That's a good idea from Bambi - a dog or walking stick, etc.

Quillo,
He's more interested in a bit of safety walking down to the shops. He's a bit concerned with all the hoodies around:mad: .

Cheers guys,

B.

Dragan

Baggio... wrote:

He's a bit concerned with all the hoodies around:mad: .

Cheers guys,

B.

I'm sitting here wearing a hoodie right now....can i go mug people?

Quillo

Baggio... wrote:

Quillo,
He's more interested in a bit of safety walking down to the shops. He's a bit concerned with all the hoodies around:mad: .

Dog & stick definitiely the way to go so ......

gymrabbit

Dragan wrote:

I'm sitting here wearing a hoodie right now....can i go mug people?

me too.

i've never actually come across a menacing looking hoodie wearing person.

Khannie

I know it doesn't really answer the original question, but......I agree with the others......A big dog would work wonders tbh. German shepherd. A dog like that would put off any potential attacker(s) before it came to a physical confrontation. Everyone knows the kind of damage an angry dog can do.

Baggio...

Dragan wrote:

I'm sitting here wearing a hoodie right now....can i go mug people?

I wear hoodies as well... Alas a lot of scummers wear 'em also.

Baggio...

Khannie wrote:

IA big dog would work wonders tbh. German shepherd. A dog like that would put off any potential attacker(s) before it came to a physical confrontation. Everyone knows the kind of damage an angry dog can do.

Big dog is always a good one. But he's already got a staffy, so I doubt he'd want another dog.

Problem with Staffs is there are so damn human friendly (I have two of 'em). Ironically people think they are really vicious - But they are not at all (which is a good thing, but talk about a big misnomer ).

paxo

Bambi wrote:

in terms of pragmatsim think otu of the box....big heavy walking stick, nice brass top. A big f*** off dog can work wonders too.

I agree look for a stick with a bit of heft, white oak, hickory and blackthorn are good. Train to use it like a bayonet / spear / quarter staff. ie two handed point attacks and butt strokes. This way is easier to maintain balance and retain the weapon.

In regard to dogs Best bets are, in my order of preference, Doberman, Rotweiler,Boerboels, German Shepard, Bull Mastiff. All these dogs have presence

For H2H I would teach him palm strike, elbow strikes. If he is "rickety" I would not consider kicks apart from a knee strike to the jacobs

Paxo

Cake Fiend

paxo wrote:

... and butt strokes...

That would scare me off alright!

catmad

An elderly person will suffer greatly from such an attack no matter how well you think they can defend themselves. They will lack self confidence to go out again and their trust in their fellow human beings will be gone. If this post was a joke originally - shame on you - and if not, the replies are a disgrace and a dishonour to old age.

paxo

catmad wrote:

An elderly person will suffer greatly from such an attack no matter how well you think they can defend themselves. They will lack self confidence to go out again and their trust in their fellow human beings will be gone. If this post was a joke originally - shame on you - and if not, the replies are a disgrace and a dishonour to old age.

Catmad
I disagree. Credit to Baggio for helping his uncle.
The fear of potential assualt can be more debilitating that the experience of a personal attack
I can not speak for Baggios uncle but in my experience most 75 YO have a very realistic view of life and of their fellow man and any trust they had in their fellow human being is often tempered by a large degree of reasonable suspicion
Paxo

paxo

Cake Fiend wrote:

That would scare me off alright!

Hey if it works, use it
Paxo

Clive

Not knowing the uncle in question and his physical capabilities, I can only recommend a panic alarm in the house and a personal attack alarm day to day on top of anything else he may learn.

Also some good neighbours!

Millionaire

catmad wrote:

the replies are a disgrace and a dishonour to old age.

I think if you called up the elderly gentleman that came to train with me, you will find that he was delighted with his training, and indeed if I did not move to Asia to further my own training, he would still be taking classes form me.

paxo

Not quite as old as Baggios uncle or Millionairs student.

Paxo


http://www.maximumg.com/oldMan4Attackers.cfm

yomchi

paxo wrote:

Not quite as old as Baggios uncle or Millionairs student.

Paxo


http://www.maximumg.com/oldMan4Attackers.cfm

sure no wonder he was able for the muggers he spent years fighting with gorillas..

Baggio...

catmad wrote:

If this post was a joke originally - shame on you - and if not, the replies are a disgrace and a dishonour to old age.

I ain't joking with this post...:mad: .He asked me advise so I gave it to him.

Maybe you should leave the forums if you can't handle people talking about different issues.

Time to chill out mate...

yomchi

Shame on you Rob, infact shame on all of you for offering advice, especially big shame on those who advised to get a dog for added security... bloody MMAers

Dave Joyce

An elderly person will suffer greatly from such an attack no matter how well you think they can defend themselves. They will lack self confidence to go out again and their trust in their fellow human beings will be gone. If this post was a joke originally - shame on you - and if not, the replies are a disgrace and a dishonour to old age.

For fuvks sake, don't tell me you're another of the "turn the other cheek" brigade. Try living in the "real" world where unfortunately the elderly are ideal targets for the scum.

Baggio, if you don't mind me saying, I personally think its great that your uncle has such an atitude, fair play to him. As regards advice I have to go with what Bambi (good man Ush) and others have said and suggest he get a decent heavy walking stick. I remember reading about John La Costa (Guro Dan Inosanto's main FMA instructors) been attacked in his eighties and although he had slowed a lot, and didn't move great, beat the crap outta 3 little ****s who tried to mug him. Weapon of choice, (granted he had an FMA background all his life), a stick.

Baggio...

Jon wrote:

Shame on you Rob, infact shame on all of you for offering advice, especially big shame on those who advised to get a dog for added security... bloody MMAers

Hah! We should all be put in front a firing squad for our blasphemous words.:D

Dave Joyce wrote:

Baggio, if you don't mind me saying, I personally think its great that your uncle has such an atitude, fair play to him.

Ta' Dave, that's what I thought too. He seems well up for trying to defend himself. Although I did impress the whole "avoid and escape" thing before any physical option. I liked Bambi's ideas of a walking stick also. Nice heavy brass handle...

hartytkd

How about an umbrella? Seriously, one of the large (golfing) types, they are reasonably light and would be perfect for weilding. You can bring it anywhere without anyone batting an eyelid. You can board a plane with one! There's even a nice sharp point on the end of it too. Not to mention the obvious dual-purpose aspect of carrying such an item in a country with a climate like Ireland.

Gavin.

yomchi

hartytkd wrote:

How about an umbrella? Seriously, one of the large (golfing) types, they are reasonably light and would be perfect for weilding. You can bring it anywhere without anyone batting an eyelid. You can board a plane with one! There's even a nice sharp point on the end of it too. Not to mention the obvious dual-purpose aspect of carrying such an item in a country with a climate like Ireland.

Gavin.

And you could take a leaf out of the KGB's book and dip the tip in polonium