Plagarism

Sawa

Someone told me that there is a device/website the staff have access to that they can enter a sentence and find the same sentence on a website or on web book and then punish you for plagarism. Apparently the results of a search will also contain sentences similar so even if you change the words you will still get caught out. Not planning on plagarising, really just curious to know if this is a myth or is really true and if it is true, do many people go down for it?!

Karoma

With regards to TCD specifically and how many people got caught? Dunno. However, it is true and several tools may be employed by lecturers in all colleges. The tools can analyze more than just one sentence at a time.

http://www.turnitin.com/ is used by several departments.

Karoma

Nothing beats a trained human eye+mind though for detecting plagiarism. you're submitting work to people who know the subject, and what others have had to say about it (I hope!) and will spot more subtle variations in writing style.



... Why do you ask, OP?

BrenC

Yeah my film lecturer mentioned he used turnitin. I'd like to run an essay through he system before I hand it in to be sure. I quote sources usually in my essays

Sawa

Karoma wrote:

Nothing beats a trained human eye+mind though for detecting plagiarism. you're submitting work to people who know the subject, and what others have had to say about it (I hope!) and will spot more subtle variations in writing style.



... Why do you ask, OP?

I had never heard of this- I'm a fresher but it is quite interesting, wasn't sure whether to believe the person who told me, that's good you can run your own essay through it first!
And they use it for every essay, makes sense I suppouse!

Tacitha

Quoting sources should be fine - the system will show up the similarities, but not with a sentence in isolation: it compares full essays. It will bring up other essays/sources with that sentence and, give you 'low/negligible probability' rating. Then it highlights the particular passages, and any lecturer qualified for the job will spot that they're quotations in both essays, or that one is the source you originally quoted - no problem.

Unless they're asking you to submit your work in electronic format, it's unlikely that they're using this: they'd have to transcribe a substantial part of the essay. Footnote, and you'll be fine. In practice, very few plagiarism accusations in college come to anything, and most lecturers aren't keen to make them without very clear cause.

Sawa

Tacitha wrote:

Quoting sources should be fine - the system will show up the similarities, but not with a sentence in isolation: it compares full essays. It will bring up other essays/sources with that sentence and, give you 'low/negligible probability' rating. Then it highlights the particular passages, and any lecturer qualified for the job will spot that they're quotations in both essays, or that one is the source you originally quoted - no problem.

Unless they're asking you to submit your work in electronic format, it's unlikely that they're using this: they'd have to transcribe a substantial part of the essay. Footnote, and you'll be fine. In practice, very few plagiarism accusations in college come to anything, and most lecturers aren't keen to make them without very clear cause.

Thanks, I just went on that website there and is it possible for just anyone to submit an essay to see if it checks out ok, even if you haven't plagarised!
Also about footnotes, does it come across poorly if you have a lot of footnotes/quoted sources? Obviously they would prefer if you had more of your own thoughts, how many on average would some one have in a 1500 word essay. Just want my first essays to be correct in that sense.

Tacitha

is it possible for just anyone to submit an essay to see if it checks out ok, even if you haven't plagarised!

I don't think it is. There is a grader's password which I had at one stage but don't anymore.

does it come across poorly if you have a lot of footnotes/quoted sources?

Not necessarily. What subject is the essay?

Crash

Its very interesting to use turnitin and check, once the lecturer has accepted it, and see just how much of your title turns up as from other sites - very interesting especially when you find paragraphs which you didnt plagarise but happen to be very similar

makes for interesting reading.

John

It is very interesting to use turnitin and check, once the lecturer has accepted it, and see just how much of your title turns up as from other sites - very interesting especially when you find paragraphs which you didnt plagarise but happen to be very similar

It makes for interesting reading especially when it's only a couple of subtle changes

Sawa

Tacitha wrote:

Not necessarily. What subject is the essay?

Biblical and Theological studies. So how does one acquire a password?

Tacitha

I don't think - could be wrong - you can get a password.

The way it works usually is : college buys licence. Staff get staff passwords, which show the originality reports. They give everyone on a particular couse a password and username, and this allows the students either just to submit their essays via turnitin (so the lecturer gets essay and report) or to submit essays and get the report themselves. Most lecturers, though, don't give students access to the reports. That's how it used to be anyway.

But you really should have no problem if you're footnoting and where you're paraphrasing, paraphrasing well. On the number of footnotes, for a 15000 word essay, it'd be very unusual to have more than forty, and unusual to get up to twenty. They won't tend to mind how many you have so long as they're not all from the same one or two books. Original observations should be necessary to get a very good grade, but you will get a respectable grade without them if your work is relevant and well-organised, I'd say.

Attractive Nun

Tacitha wrote:

a 15000 word essay

I hope you mean a 1500 word essay, or else I've gone way overboard with my first attempt at an essay.

Tacitha

Well, that would impress them ... go straight to the dissertation stage.

(I did mean 1500, of course)

ZWEI_VIER_ZWEI

BrenC wrote:

Yeah my film lecturer mentioned he used turnitin. I'd like to run an essay through he system before I hand it in to be sure. I quote sources usually in my essays

Hmmmm....I wasn't aware of that. Very hmm. I don't particularly like being forced to do a course and then have the lecturer automatically assume that the ****ing essay I took the ****ing time out to write rather than actually doing something useful/interesting to me is plagiarised rather than I don't know -SCARY CONCEPT- being a bit trustful in his students instead of automatically assuming they're all plagiarising scum. You know if you don't give your mother****ing students respect you oughtn't expect it in return.
I take every essay of mine passed through this turnitin system as a personal insult and an affront to my dignity as a student.

ApeXaviour

ZWEI_VIER_ZWEI wrote:

Hmmmm....I wasn't aware of that. Very hmm. I don't particularly like being forced to do a course and then have the lecturer automatically assume that the ****ing essay I took the ****ing time out to write rather than actually doing something useful/interesting to me is plagiarised rather than I don't know -SCARY CONCEPT- being a bit trustful in his students instead of automatically assuming they're all plagiarising scum. You know if you don't give your mother****ing students respect you oughtn't expect it in return.
I take every essay of mine passed through this turnitin system as a personal insult and an affront to my dignity as a student.

Yes, it's an outrage. Personally I'd prefer to have my mother be raped and hung than to go through this blatant atrocity.

Had a few drinks there Zwei?

Crash

And Barnaby doesn't use turnitin, iirc. you just fling your printed out essay into the sam beckett. Unless he's gone all technological.

ZWEI_VIER_ZWEI

Lecturer: Barnaby Taylor
Michaelmas Assignment 2006

You should also ensure that you keep a copy of the final submitted essay. In addition, an electronic copy of the essay MUST be submitted via Turnitin.com.
ESSAYS WITHOUT AN ELECTRONIC VERSION SUBMITTED
IN THIS WAY WILL NOT BE ASSESSED.

So yeah, he has gone down the techno-paranoia road.
From the e-mail containing the essay questions. Personally I think it's ****ing disgraceful that he treats his students with this kind of ****ing attitude.

Crash

Oh grow up and stop acting like an petulant child. and please, make a post where half of it isn't **** for once? its really a pain in the hole to read.

ZWEI_VIER_ZWEI

Yeah, there's nothing more childish than wanting to be treated like an adult with dignity and respect by your lecturers. I think it's pretty ****ing arrogant of you to equate childishness to the fact that I resent being assumed a cheater by my lecturers.

Also it's not my fault that the ****ing word filters destroy the flow of my sentences. Take that up with the boards admins. I'm not going to write in a different style than that which I always write in because the admins have decreed that on the off chance that some four letter word is going to offend some innocent soul they must all be replaced with delicate stars. **** that ****.

Crash

personally its an affront i'm well happy to go through with to catch the ****s who do plagarise, and get a great mark but don't ****ing deserve it. *** that ***.

Nietzschean

Ahhh i love not being a mod anymore!


Your lecturers want an easy way to check for cheating, i don't see how checking to see if students are cheating assumes they are? You've nothing to hide unless your cheating..........

ZWEI_VIER_ZWEI

OK it seems that you love being presumed guilty while I dislike it. I bet you love it when you get searched at airports "because it helps stops terrorism." It's attitudes like this why the world's descending into a global police state.

Crash

so let me get this straight, you also have issues with being searched at airports? I'm not the biggest fan of it, but I can see security reasons making absolute sense. having been searched going into various parliamentry buildings also, dont find it that big a deal.

TYou seem to just take everything as a personal affront to you, which to me seems to be your problem. in fact its also why you've been banned from here previously, and unless something changes I can see it happening again, to be honest.

Plagiarism happens, and is a problem. They check everyone. I really fail to see the problem.

ApeXaviour

Myth wrote:

Plagiarism happens, and is a problem. They check everyone. I really fail to see the problem.

&#231 wrote: »

in fact its also why you've been banned from here previously, and unless something changes I can see it happening again, to be honest.

Ditto, on both counts

Take a chill pill zwei.

John

He does have a point, what happened to the honour system? The vast majority of students don't cheat. Only when the corrector has read through the papers should they submit a suspect paper for examination.

Time Magazine

John wrote:

He does have a point, what happened to the honour system? The vast majority of students don't cheat. Only when the corrector has read through the papers should they submit a suspect paper for examination.

What if they miss someone cheating? It's certainly possible; especially considering the explosion of knowledge globalisation is creating, the chances of a lecturer not being familiar with the copied piece are increasing. And what if that cheater gets first in their class over, say, a koala bear? Why do you want to deprive the cute koala bear of his gold medal? It's all he ever wanted.

I've no problem with it whatsoever. Unlike airport security checks (I mean seriously, what use are they? :rolleyes:), it's no inconvenience to me if my lecturer runs my paper through a program. And assuming the program is not faulty, I'm not going to get pulled up on plagarism grounds either. Of course if the program is flawed that causes problems, but the lecturer could make the same mistake.

It's all good.

Sawa

Does one count footnotes and/or bibliographies as part of the word count in an essay?
Thanks

Tacitha

Technically yes, usually, but I would email whoever set it.

It's a bit worrying because I tend to remember things freakishly well months after reading them and I'm sure I write passages that I once read in a book, thinking I'm being original. But I'll be happy if a few of the jammy plagiarising feckers in my year get caught out by that system.

gymrabbit

I know someone on my course composed an essay heavily composed of wikipedia articles and "got away with it". I don't care like, it's no skin off my nose. I don't look at college like, I better do better than the person beside me because we're both competiting for the same limited resource.

I don't like people lying though or ripping other people's ideas off and plagarism is very dishonest.

Nietzschean

alas some courses are done on a sliding curve to an extent tho kev, so people cheating really can piss people off. It ****s up moving grades due to external examiners and so on...

Tacitha

College policy is not to curve, so most courses don't, but I know that many in BESS do. I think its worth being aware of the possibility of plagiarism: if people are plagiarising, they may be lazy, or they may have serious problems and need help. It certainly doesn't mean you have to suspect everyone, or that you aren't treating them as adults - adults plagiarize too. If an accusation is actually made, the lecturer will need very solid evidence: they don't want a lawsuit on their hands.

BessBoy

Tacitha wrote:

College policy is not to curve, so most courses don't, but I know that many in BESS do. I think its worth being aware of the possibility of plagiarism: if people are plagiarising, they may be lazy, or they may have serious problems and need help. It certainly doesn't mean you have to suspect everyone, or that you aren't treating them as adults - adults plagiarize too. If an accusation is actually made, the lecturer will need very solid evidence: they don't want a lawsuit on their hands.

Who curves? I never heard of it....which just could mean i wasnt listening..

I know someone on my course composed an essay heavily composed of wikipedia articles and "got away with it". I don't care like, it's no skin off my nose. I don't look at college like, I better do better than the person beside me because we're both competiting for the same limited resource.

Yeah but even though the lecturers might not officially grade on a curve, they definitely compare your essays with others, at least on my course. They don't like to give too many firsts, so they'll pick the best 2 or 3 essays. If lots of essays are exceptional, an essay which would usually get you a first will get you a 2:1 for example. They definitely take other peoples' work into consideration.