Live 1-3 game: Bad turn bet?

Hitman Actual

Live 1-3 game, which plays loose. I have ~€700, and straddle UTG+1 to 6. Pre-flop there are four other callers to me, and I check with Ad6c.

Flop (€30): 278, all diamonds. I check. MP, decent player who has me covered bets 30 (this could be top-pair, two pair, set, maybe a high diamond, but it's not air), Button calls, I call closing the action (other two players fold).

Turn (€120): 8c, pairing the board. I lead for €100. How the rest of the hand plays out doesn't really matter to me, but after the hand I got into a mini-argument with the MP player who bet the flop about my lead on the turn. His opinion was that my turn lead was bad. I disagreed. Who's right?

coillcam

well buddy presume this was @ w.end at home,

really theres not much more info on the player....

anyway you've just bet the pot which to me sells the fact u may have a made the flush from his perspective and are betting for info as to whether you are vs. a house or flopped flush

the bet does really depend on the player u face.

a tight player may have 88 77 22 78 A8 in that sitution (no PF raise),

a looser guy may raise PF w/ 88 77 poss A8 9d9x 10d10x. bet the flop with 6d9d 9d10d

when the flop hits u are against a set, top 2, sometimes 6d9d 9d10d small flush more than likely but you don't know

UTG+1 your bet makes sense on the turn,

you bet you gain info/semi bluff. as a small flush poss Q and below may reraise a tank.

whereas house smooth calls. all others get mucked.

otherwise on the turn you check he pots you scratch ur head............ ?
you check he checks....... you fill up on the river, then bet and get raised a tank Q more head scratchin / poker brat type rant.

by betting the turn you save the money you loose against the house. you must put in a PSB or the info is of no value.

good bet.

5starpool

To be honest I am not sure of this. You are using this as a sort of blocking bet /semi bluff. You are representing either an 8 or a flush here, unless he knows you are the sort to bet made hands which might make him think it was a 'come on, I have a house' bet. Against 2 other opponents though I think this isn't a great move out of position, and most of the time in this hand here I just check/fold.

cardshark202

I prefer b3b the flop.

5starpool

cardshark202 wrote:

I prefer b3b the flop.

you prefer what now?

cardshark202

bet 3-bet the flop

5starpool

cardshark202 wrote:

bet 3-bet the flop

I had figured something along those lines alrigt but couldn't get it to fit in my head.

Hectorjelly

normally it would be good, but given your read its terrible. You put him on top pair, a set, 2 pair or a high diamond. Top pair is now trips, 2 pair and a set are now full houses; and you have the most likely high diamond. Basically his rangs is now killing you. If he had of raised preflop this would of been much better for obvious reasons.

coilcam you have ace high in a multiway pot, and you want to bet €100 for information? lol

Bandana boy

It is always good to mix things up a little and if you feel a greater than say 33% of the time that 100 takes down pot fine bet.
If we think mp will bet with 1 diamond on flop then also fine we could be ahead or against 1 pair and we can make this uncomfortable for villain also good
But
If it never takes down pot and we are never ahead here
then all we are doing is bloating a fd on a paired board then it probably is not the best move in the world

so is this a good move?
Probably maybe

Gholimoli

Hectorjelly wrote:

normally it would be good, but given your read its terrible. You put him on top pair, a set, 2 pair or a high diamond. Top pair is now trips, 2 pair and a set are now full houses; and you have the most likely high diamond. Basically his rangs is now killing you. If he had of raised preflop this would of been much better for obvious reasons.

coilcam you have ace high in a multiway pot, and you want to bet €100 for information? lol

exactly what i wanted to say.
i really like the play but how can you make that play based on the range of hands you put villain on?

Hitman Actual

Interesting replies, they made me think about this hand a lot more. On the MP players range, if i was going to weight his hands then it would be heavily towards him having top-pair on the flop, occasionally two-pair, but hardly ever a set as 77/88 raises preflop in this game, so my OP is a bit misleading.

Dom is right, my bet was made as a semi-bluff/blocking type bet, but even at that it's too high anyway (although the bigger bet makes it less likely that I'll be raised, I think).

I don't like check-fold, as it's the type of game where the nut flush will make a lot of money off trips or a weaker flush. But betting against this guy is a bit contradictory. He's one of the few players who will fold trips here (I reckon he folds 1 in 3, so 33% folding equity). But he's also a player who won't often pay me off when I hit, so my implied odds aren't great (great reverse implied odds, though!). So I'm still not sure.

Anyway, he eventually called in a lot of pain (so I'm almost sure it's bare trips now), and the button folded (with the Kd). A low diamond came on the river, and I think we checked it down, or maybe I check-called a small bet (can't remember which). He had J8 spades. But I think i was a bit all over the place in the hand.

Bandana boy

lenny_leonard wrote:

Interesting replies, they made me think about this hand a lot more. On the MP players range, if i was going to weight his hands then it would be heavily towards him having top-pair on the flop, occasionally two-pair, but hardly ever a set as 77/88 raises preflop in this game, so my OP is a bit misleading.

Dom is right, my bet was made as a semi-bluff/blocking type bet, but even at that it's too high anyway (although the bigger bet makes it less likely that I'll be raised, I think).

I don't like check-fold, as it's the type of game where the nut flush will make a lot of money off trips or a weaker flush. But betting against this guy is a bit contradictory. He's one of the few players who will fold trips here (I reckon he folds 1 in 3, so 33% folding equity). But he's also a player who won't often pay me off when I hit, so my implied odds aren't great (great reverse implied odds, though!). So I'm still not sure.

Anyway, he eventually called in a lot of pain (so I'm almost sure it's bare trips now), and the button folded (with the Kd). A low diamond came on the river, and I think we checked it down, or maybe I check-called a small bet (can't remember which). He had J8 spades. But I think i was a bit all over the place in the hand.

Based on this you 100% have to value bet that river

MrPillowTalk

Yeah I think you have to value bet the river too.

Hitman Actual

Acknowledged. I think mainly playing tourneys on the Dublin scene for years means that I'm often not sure of the best line to take post-flop.