5/10nl, AQ OOP, scary board

willis

5/10nl, 6max, I have 750, villain covers. (Tribeca)

Villain: Limp with any 2. He open limped from Button with 99 in hand right before this. I have seen him limp with J2 suited utg. He is aggressive but not maniacal and bets when he suspects weakness

Hand: Villain limps from CO, sb calls, I make it 55 with AQ, both call. Flop comes Q109 rainbow. (Pot 165)

I bet 95, villain calls, sb folds.( 350)

Turn is another 9, I check, villain bets 160

What’s my move? How’s my play so far in the hand?

lazlo

You say that your foe bets when he senses weakness - why on earth would you check that turn card? You've left yourself with a tough decision here-you cannot just call this bet you have to raise it.... There is a reasonably good chance that you're ahead but you're facing a 500-odd dollar pot and you're looking at betting at least 3/4 of your remaining stack(if not all of it) right here. Being the loon I am (with the knowledge that he leads into signs of weakness) I would probably go for it...

I really think you should have led for about 200$ on the turn though.

robinlacey

why do you think he has to raise here lazlo?
i call this every time

Lafortezza

robinlacey wrote:

why do you think he has to raise here lazlo?
i call this every time

If you call the turn then the pot on the river will be $690, Hero has $350ish left, so you really have to autocall the river too.
Playing TPTK on a scary board for my whole stack isn't fun.

Edit: The alternative of checking the flop doesn't help you out much either given the Villains tendencies.

lazlo

lafortezza wrote:

If you call the turn then the pot on the river will be $690, Hero has $350ish left, so you really have to autocall the river too.
Playing TPTK on a scary board for my whole stack isn't fun. Dunno if I like checking the flop either given the Villains tendencies.

Exactly, why give him a cheap ride with Jx or even a weaker pair? There is more than enough money in the pot to justify moving in heavy if he decides to proceed to 5th street(which again is a very tough move to make).

He didnt actually check the flop, he led for 95 which was too little IMO.

Lafortezza

lazlo wrote:

He didnt actually check the flop, he led for 95 which was too little IMO.

Oops, worded my post wrongly, fixed.

robinlacey

i disagree that you have to autocall the river if you call the turn,maybe in a super agressive full tilt game or something,but at tribeca 5/10 a call here is usually enough to secure a showdown unless you're behind...

robinlacey

also i think the way the hand is going if you push the turn you only get called if you're behind,whereas if you call and do end up calling the river there will be a good chance he is bluffing...

Gholimoli

lazlo wrote:

You say that your foe bets when he senses weakness - why on earth would you check that turn card? You've left yourself with a tough decision here-you cannot just call this bet you have to raise it.... There is a reasonably good chance that you're ahead but you're facing a 500-odd dollar pot and you're looking at betting at least 3/4 of your remaining stack(if not all of it) right here. Being the loon I am (with the knowledge that he leads into signs of weakness) I would probably go for it...

I really think you should have led for about 200$ on the turn though.

rubish.

you played the hand well.
the check on the turn is fine.
you are ahead of his range as i think he would do that with OESD,any T,any Q and also any 9.
if you push he would only call with a hand that beats yours (most prob) so the advice given above is rubish IMO.
check/calling here is perfect as the player is known to have a go when checked to so thats exactly what your doing,winning the most when your ahead and losing he least when your behind blah blah.

the question to ask your self here is:
does he bluff on multiple streets or does he only have a single go and give up?
can you differ between his value bets and bluffs based by size or anything?
but generally i would call his bet and check/river unless there was 4 to str or somthing bad.

lazlo

willis wrote:

5/10nl, 6max, I have 750, villain covers. (Tribeca)

Villain: Limp with any 2. He open limped from Button with 99 in hand right before this. I have seen him limp with J2 suited utg. He is aggressive but not maniacal and bets when he suspects weakness

Hand: Villain limps from CO, sb calls, I make it 55 with AQ, both call. Flop comes Q109 rainbow. (Pot 165)

I bet 95, villain calls, sb folds.( 350)

Turn is another 9, I check, villain bets 160

What’s my move? How’s my play so far in the hand?

The simple fact in this hand is that you do not know where you are at... this hand could get very costly unlees the hero assume the betting lead. It seems inevitable that he will stare down a bet on 5th street by merely calling. The villains range is so wide(he could easily have a house, trips or a made str8 as well as weaker holdings like a pair and str8 draw, oesd or qx, tx and AJ. The range is far too wide to check that turn a lead is really the best move IMO. If raised he can release the hand losing less than he otherwise would

robinlacey

lazlo wrote:

You say that your foe bets when he senses weakness - why on earth would you check that turn card?

only skimmed the thread so i missed this beauty first time around...
this makes no sense...
why on earth wouldn't you?

lazlo

Well because of the texture of the board - ordinarily you would happilycheck to such a player but again given the pot size and board in front of you, you're only gonna check if you're happy enough to stick it in. Personally I don't think that a paired, 3-straight board is a situation where you want to pot build with TPTK when you have virtually NO idea what your opponent holds.

robinlacey

no one is trying to build a pot here

Gholimoli

lazlo wrote:

Well because of the texture of the board - ordinarily you would happilycheck to such a player but again given the pot size and board in front of you, you're only gonna check if you're happy enough to stick it in. Personally I don't think that a paired, 3-straight board is a situation where you want to pot build with TPTK when you have virtually NO idea what your opponent holds.

your posts are quit funny man.

so you say pot building here is bad(even tough no one suggested to build the pot) but your solution to stop the pot from building is to bet more on the flop,bet the turn or shove it and shove on the river???
brilliant technique for stop the pot from building...
i should practice this kind of pot control more often.

MrPillowTalk

Robin has it spot on here imo.

Against this type of villain check calling the turn is the best play, if you lead the turn then you probably only get played with if your beat, if you checkraise the turn you DEFINATELY only get played with if your beat, but if you call and check the river there is a decent chance he will check behind or else try to bluff with the worst hand.

When he has us beat he has us beat, against an aggro opponent Im not folding to a turn bet thats for sure.

MrPillowTalk

Who was the villain anyway? might be able to give you better advice if i know him.

willis

Circus777 i think is villain or somethin similar

Ok guys so i follow your advice and check/call...am i calling an allin bet on the river? The villain probably does have ability to fire that river shell bluff, especially as i have now played it like a AJ/JJ imo.

Lazlo, if you lead the turn, how much, and if so how do you play a brick on the river? Also if u lead more on the flop, your lead on the turn is going to have to be very big due to potsize

MrPillowTalk

willis wrote:

Circus777 i think is villain or somethin similar

Ok guys so i follow your advice and check/call...am i calling an allin bet on the river? The villain probably does have ability to fire that river shell bluff, especially as i have now played it like a AJ/JJ imo.

Lazlo, if you lead the turn, how much, and if so how do you play a brick on the river? Also if u lead more on the flop, your lead on the turn is going to have to be very big due to potsize

If youthink he is capable of bluffing the river then yes you have to call.

I dont know him which would suggest he is probably a donkey.

Gholimoli

TBH i think alot of hands that have show down value would check behind on the river here so an all in bet is more than likely to be a bluff specially the way you have played a hand so i think you should call.
im not saying a strong hand would not go all in here but i think given the description of villain ,the passive way you have played the hand to induce a bluff ,will induce a bluff wich you should call IMO.

willis

Results:
I check-raised allin...yuck! He insta-called with KJ for the flopped nuts

My turn play is wrong and thats why i posted, tbh i dont think i could find a fold on the river if i just called the turn but at least i woulda had the option

Ty for replies

lazlo

Gholimoli wrote:

your posts are quit funny man.

so you say pot building here is bad(even tough no one suggested to build the pot) but your solution to stop the pot from building is to bet more on the flop,bet the turn or shove it and shove on the river???
brilliant technique for stop the pot from building...
i should practice this kind of pot control more often.

I think he could have gotten away from this hand if he had had bet a bit more on the flop, maybe 125 and led the turn again for about 200, if the villain calls the turn he can release his hand on 5th street after a check. I wouldn't be putting ANY more money in on the river if this guy is happy to smooth call those bets.

The only circumstances i would have considered shoving was if by some chance i happend to accidentally click check check on the turn. And even then its a close one between that and a fold.

With zero information on your opponent(aside from the fact that he bets into weakness-who doesn't) why on earth would you play this hand so passively that you may end up calling off all your chips? Its ludicrous to say the least. Well I seem to be alone in thinking that taking the lead in this situation was wrong but hey, what new?