Creative Writing Class - A Rant!

MsFifers

:mad: Me so mad!
Signed up for a creative writing evening class with the local VEC - good lord its a trial! What do you think of this?

A guy read out a really nice piece - very brooding - about a guy walking down a hill towards a house at sunset. It was all very ominous and atmospheric. Just a part of a bigger story, and I think he wanted some encouragement to keep at it.

Then the tutor starts making some point about keeping language grounded, and that there is a trend towards using anglo-saxon words, and that latinate words aren't as good. So, everyone looks blankly at her, and someone asks for further explanation and an example of what she is talking about. She picks on one word used in the piece - descended - and blabbers on about it, suggesting using 'walked down' instead.

A few people are challenging her at this point - and I join in to ask if she is suggesting that we follow "trends" or "fashion" in our writing. She rears up then, shouting at me "DO YOU READ???!!!", then asking me to repeat what she had previously said - like teachers of primary-school children do! She was so angry she nearly knocked over her flip-chart!

She then made us to 20 min of free writing, followed by a 20 min break. This is in a 2 hour class! She then spent time flipping through various books and reading out bits of advice at random.

Apparently, at another class she verbally attacked two people for talking, even though she having a private conversation with an individual class member at the time.

Anyway - first of all - does anyone know what the hell she was talking about? Whats wrong with latinate words? (And what are they anyway???!!!)

And - do you think I would be entitled to ask for my money back as this woman seems to me to be unsuitable (to say the least) for teaching adults? Does anyone know what kinds of checks the vEC's do on people's qualifications etc.

Really annoyed about it. And whats worse is that I think she really upset the guy who read out the piece in the first place. You know how hard it is to be confident about reading out your work to people you don't know very well?!

Anyway - had to get that out! Thanks!!!

silvine

MsFifers wrote:

:mad: Me so mad!

Anyway - first of all - does anyone know what the hell she was talking about? Whats wrong with latinate words? (And what are they anyway???!!!)

http://www.google.ie/search?hl=en&lr=&defl=en&q=define:latinate&sa=X&oi=glossary_definition&ct=title
"derived from or imitative of Latin"

That class sounds like a complete pile of pants to me. The 'teacher's' attitude is unbelievable, arrogant, self serving and all in all a general BITCH. I'd be looking for my money back. Maybe you could write a creative piece about a bitchy teacher who undermines her students and read that out. You should tell her to take her flip board and descend it up her ass.

DublinWriter

Don't they vet people for these jobs anymore?

Sweet Jesus the woman sounds like a complete loon. I'd quit and ask for my money back. If I were you I'd also even suggest to others in the class to do the same.

...and just for the craic, ask her how many pieces of hers have been published.

lukegriffen

Yes you should ask for your money back.

It's important that people complain if a teacher isn't up to scratch, but you'll (most likely) need to write a letter explaining why you want your money back (more creative writing!). One isolated complaint won't get the teacher kicked out, but if several complain the school won't rehire them. If the school is worth its salt, it will refund if it thinks it's a genuine complaint.

By the way, the teacher is giving you lots of writing material. To accelerate her nervous breakdown you could write about a part-time teacher who's spouting "latinate" nonsense.

Also, this topic might be a good place if anyone has any recommended courses for creative
writing ?

clearbear06

That women sounds like a complete bitch, You should definitly cmplain about her.
In the VEC near me some of the tutors are the excate same you'd swear that they pick these people of the street too come in and teach us. :mad:

Blush_01

If you took every loanword out of the English language, you'd be left with very little.

Ask for your money back, lodge an official complaint and get others to do so too. Does she have a Nobel prize for Literature? Are you taking the course with following today's limited trend in mind, or to write? Talk about in the wrong profession!

jrey1981

sorry to hear of your offputting experience OP.

I attended a creative writing workshop last saturday and it was very interesting with a wide range of people in attendance who all seemed very talented from what I could tell, and with talks and advice from well-known writers.

Thing is it cost a few bob too, so as elsewhere in life, you get what you pay for.

MsFifers

Thanks for the feedback - I had a number of anglo-saxon words in mind to mention to her at the time - all four letter!
I'll give the VEC a call and see what they say.

Its probably true that you get what you pay for - the course was v. cheap. I did an evening course before in Dun Laoghaire College of Art with Catherine Phil McCarthy and it was really excellent. It was aimed at beginners and she was very encouraging.

I've moved "down the country" now so it isn't so easy to access classes, but I'll keep writing away on my own anyway!

Blush_01

Well I attend a free creative writing workshop on a weekly basis. Granted, it's run by students, but while it's not very indepth, it does give you a kickstart if you need it.

I put details about it up here last year, if anyone is interested, it's in Dublin 4, just PM me.

Matt Holck

just take it at face value
at least she considers the idea of what currently sells
she may be entirely wrong but she's not afraid to breach the subject
"constuctive critism" is a bitch

Lennon

Imagine there's no heaven
It's easy if you try
No hell below us
Above us only sky
Imagine all the people
Living for today...

I think words like heaven and demon invoke a vague ideal
don't tell me of heaven show me heaven

Thursday*

I would agree that she sounds pretty bad.

But I think I can tell what she was talking about with the latinate and anglo-saxon words.

Anglo-saxon words are short and blunt. Lots of four-letter words are anglo-saxon. Anglo-saxon poetry used the technique of, instead of using the noun for something, say 'gull', using a made-up descriptive phrase, like 'windhover'. This comes from two plain bread-and-butter words. (I have no idea if those are anglo-saxon words or not, that's just an example.)

Many or most of the words we use are Latin-derived, including 'anglo-'.

I imagine her point was that in our times, what is in favour in terms of literature, not just what sells but what people like and what sounds good, is to tend towards anglo-saxonish words rather than latinate ones - that is, to say 'come back' rather than 'return', 'go down' rather than 'descend'.

This may well be a valid point but you could be a little more delicate if someone has stood in front of the class to read out their work!

Frankiestylee

I can see what she was getting at, but that was a totally unsuitable way to act. Poor form.

tonyinuae

Although it's true that shorter, Anglo-Saxon words are more fashionable, that's no reason not to use the other, Latinate kind, also. If the effect of the guy's reading was a good one on the audience, then he was doing something right. She should at least have acknowledged that fact. Plus, it's up to a writer what style he chooses, he can say 'descend' or 'go down', that's called artistic freedom.

JumpJump

Matt Holck wrote:

Lennon

Quote:
Imagine there's no heaven
It's easy if you try
No hell below us
Above us only sky
Imagine all the people
Living for today...


I think words like heaven and demon invoke a vague ideal
don't tell me of heaven show me heaven

In all fairness, what the hell are you on about?

MADPhil

Meself and herself signed up for Irish evening classes at Liverpool University a few years ago. The young woman instructor told us that she also ran a sports injuries clinic, and her mobile phone could go at any time, for which she apologised in advance. We took the view that, in light of the considerable cost of the course, we should all have her undivided attention for the full two hours once a week. We dropped out and were in time to stop payment of the cheque. I suspect there are a lot of adult education tutors like that - her Irish was a bit dodgy as well.

DublinEvents

Doesn't sound like your teacher is really qualified for teaching creative writing. I mean, she sounds like someone who doesn't have any passion for teaching and she is just biding her time. Just coz you don't know your stuff well doesn't mean you should harass your students to cover up your incompetence. Being nice always works. She could get in serious trouble if she pisses off enough students. They could then ask the principal or dean to have her removed. You could do her a favor by anonymously dropping a note telling her what her students think about her teaching methods. If she is sensible, she might decide to mend her ways.

Jermiah

As a 60+ years writer of ten years or more I remember the early stages well.

Other contributors have picked out the key elements of this situation accurately.

This "teacher" is undoubtedly insecure. It is said that you cannot teach adults but can only share experiences. This is the best form of teaching. It involves the giving of oneself that creates the trust to allow others to contribute. The courage to contribute must be rewarded not criticised. The work may be criticised but sympathetically. This person lacks that ability. Have a quiet word with the course organiser.

A teacher whether they know it not should do three things at once. Teach the subject under investigation; the art of investigation and the art of teaching. An ordinary teacher weighs and bags ideas likes potatoes; a skilled teacher makes them open up like flowers from a bud.

A bit of practical advice about courses, if a bit late, get a reference from someone on the tutor be it for, golf lessons, painting or creative writing.