Kerosene Boiler Problem

dingding

I have an indoor kerosene boiler. I started it up after the Summer and the red light lit and it cutout.

When examining the burner I noticed that the motor and fan was not running.

I opened up the cover on the fan to find that it was a bit stiff to turn. If I pushed the fan with a screwdriver it started to turn slowly.

The motor is giving 50 Ohms on one winding and 30 Ohms on the other. There is no burning smell that you get when the motor burns out. Also the capacitor seems o.k. So the motor and capacitor are probably o.k.

Is it just something is gone stiff on the motor and some WD40 will fix it or is there a bigger problem.

Any advice appriciated.

JamesM

dingding wrote:

I have an indoor kerosene boiler. I started it up after the Summer and the red light lit and it cutout.

When examining the burner I noticed that the motor and fan was not running.

I opened up the cover on the fan to find that it was a bit stiff to turn. If I pushed the fan with a screwdriver it started to turn slowly.

The motor is giving 50 Ohms on one winding and 30 Ohms on the other. There is no burning smell that you get when the motor burns out. Also the capacitor seems o.k. So the motor and capacitor are probably o.k.

Is it just something is gone stiff on the motor and some WD40 will fix it or is there a bigger problem.

Any advice appriciated.

Sometimes, if you get it spinning, it will keep going and loosen off.
If it stays stiff then you cannot do any harm with a bit of WD40. The old Minor 1 often gave this problem and sometimes the Riello G3. If it's a G3, loosen off the 2 allen screws holding on the oil pump, undo the nut holding the oil pipe at the back of the pump. There is a thin oil pipe still connected, but if you are careful you need not disconnect it. If its a Minor 1 there is no thin pipe. Ease the oil pump away from the motor. Do not loose the coupling. Squirt some WD40 into the end of the motor and flick on the burner to work the WD40 into the bearing. That should free the motor. If the motor is free when you take off the pump, check that the drive shaft on the oil pump is free. If it is stiff, things could be more serious. Try to turn it a few times to loosen it off. There is a lot of moisture in kerosene and this can corrode the gears of the oil pump. Also, sometimes a worn coupling can stiffen things up. It is very difficult to diagnose without seeing the burner.
Jim.

dingding

Thanks Jim,

I was thinking it was either the oil pump siezed or the motor bushings. I will get some wd40 today and carry out your suggestions. Can anything be done internally to the oil pump. Any point in trying to take it apart if the problem is there.

I will have a go this afternoon and post how I get on.

Cheers

Lex Luthor

Have you separated the pump from the motor?
If so, then turn on the boiler and if the motor spins on its own, then you can rule that out.

Check the coupling between the motor & pump if there is one. If its in good condition, then attach the pump to the motor and turn on again and see if the motor spins freely with the pump attached. Its basically a process of elimination. The pump shaft should move freely by hand, so if its stiff detached from the motor, then the pump may need replacing. I had to replace the bearing in my motor before because it was about to seize.

dingding

Thanks very much for all the help. I tried Jim's solution and it worked. The bearing on the pump end freed up with some WD40. There may be an issue with the bearing on the pump endbut I could not decouple the pump from the motor. I could loosen it but I was afraid to force it. I will leave it and see how it goes.

I was not able to get the fan off the shaft either, it seemed to be siezed on. If it stops working again I will probably have to do a full overhaul of the unit and replace the motor bearings.

Many thanks for all your help.

Cheers

Lex Luthor

dingding wrote:

Thanks very much for all the help. I tried Jim's solution and it worked. The bearing on the pump end freed up with some WD40. There may be an issue with the bearing on the pump endbut I could not decouple the pump from the motor. I could loosen it but I was afraid to force it. I will leave it and see how it goes.

I was not able to get the fan off the shaft either, it seemed to be siezed on. If it stops working again I will probably have to do a full overhaul of the unit and replace the motor bearings.

Many thanks for all your help.

Cheers

Motor bearings are not that expensive. When mine needed replacing, I went to Heatmerchants to get one and they told me that I needed to replace the complete motor. :rolleyes:

So I took out the bearing and it had 'SKF' stamped on it. Apparently, a fairly standard size bearing type 6202. Went to SKF Bearings in the JFK Ind Est off the Naas Rd., and bought one for about £5 at the time. This was about 7yrs ago. Probably replace it again next year, but the original bearing only lasted 3yrs and the one I installed has lasted 7.

dingding

It stopped working so i stripped the pump of the fan and motor. The problem was in the pump. When you turned it it by hand it would jam occasionally.

I opened up the pump and i found that there was a smaller gear running inside a bigger gear. The problem was that the gear wheel was loose on the shaft and the small gear wheel seem worn. There was also a problem with the key that locked the small gear on the shaft.

I think I now need a pump for the burner.

the pump appears to be a Riello Oil Pump - 2037 which is on a Riello G5X burner. I sourced one here
http://www.onlineplumbingsupplies.co.uk/acatalog/Riello_Pumps.html for about £100.

Is this a good price for this, any other ideas. Can this be got in a builders providers or in Ireland

Thanks

JamesM

dingding wrote:

It stopped working so i stripped the pump of the fan and motor. The problem was in the pump. When you turned it it by hand it would jam occasionally.

I opened up the pump and i found that there was a smaller gear running inside a bigger gear. The problem was that the gear wheel was loose on the shaft and the small gear wheel seem worn. There was also a problem with the key that locked the small gear on the shaft.

I think I now need a pump for the burner.

the pump appears to be a Riello Oil Pump - 2037 which is on a Riello G5X burner. I sourced one here
http://www.onlineplumbingsupplies.co.uk/acatalog/Riello_Pumps.html for about £100.

Is this a good price for this, any other ideas. Can this be got in a builders providers or in Ireland

Thanks

I would think that it is a 7811 which you will get from this guy: www.boilercare.ie Or any Heatmerchants branch: www.heatmerchants.ie Should be about 100 euro.
Jim.

dingding

JamesM wrote:

I would think that it is a 7811 which you will get from this guy: www.boilercare.ie Or any Heatmerchants branch: www.heatmerchants.ie Should be about 100 euro.
Jim.

Thanks Jim, Got it from Boiler Care. 70 for a second hand one, Heatmerchants was 150+vat according to their site.

Many thanks for your advice.

dingding

I fitted the pump. is their any adjustment necessary on the burner, i.e. the adjusting screw on the side of the pump, or the air intake.


Thanks in advance.

JamesM

dingding wrote:

I fitted the pump. is their any adjustment necessary on the burner, i.e. the adjusting screw on the side of the pump, or the air intake.
Thanks in advance.

It is most likely, if you have only changed the pump, that the pressure setting on it is OK and that the other burner settings have not been changed, and also OK.
For kerosene, the adjustment screw should be about halfway in.
Jim.

MikeOis

Please, If could somebody could help.I have a Riello Oil Burner.
When power is applied to the burner, the fan motor is continously running and the burner is not firing at all. Only when you press the Reset Switch, that the fan motor stops.I have checked the Capacitor and cleaned the photo sensor all OK.

When I disconnect the photo sensor from the control box, the burner will fire and ignite, only for 5 seconds. It will then cut out.I can press the the reset button and it will do this again (But with the photo sensor diconnected the fan motor is not running continously)
I checked the photo sensor, and its seems to work properly when I restrict the light getting to the sensor, the resistance increases. Help Thks!

dingding

Mike,

I noticed this when I was fixing mine. If the fan is running continuously and the burner does not try to ignite, the photo cell is either faulty or it thinks that it has light on it.

You can get this to happen under test conditions in a well lit room, If you have the burner off and the nozzel exposed the ambient light will give this effect.

You could probably check the photocell by means of an ohmmeter if it is a photo resistor.

I think in any event the problem is with the photo sensor if light is not hitting it.

Hope this helps and thanks for all the help so far with the burner.

My luck the weather picks up as I get the heating to work.

JamesM

MikeOis wrote:

Please, If could somebody could help.I have a Riello Oil Burner.
When power is applied to the burner, the fan motor is continously running and the burner is not firing at all. Only when you press the Reset Switch, that the fan motor stops.I have checked the Capacitor and cleaned the photo sensor all OK.

When I disconnect the photo sensor from the control box, the burner will fire and ignite, only for 5 seconds. It will then cut out.I can press the the reset button and it will do this again (But with the photo sensor diconnected the fan motor is not running continously)
I checked the photo sensor, and its seems to work properly when I restrict the light getting to the sensor, the resistance increases. Help Thks!

It is likely the photocell - Make sure that the eye is clean and try cleaning the contacts where it slides in under the control box.
Jim.

MikeOis

Thanks for the help.
I have checked the Photo diode with an Ohm meter and its seems fine. When the diode is covered the resistance drops and when exposed to the light the resistance increases. My only fear that it is not the photo diode but the controller box. I will have another blast of it, either it gets me or it goes in the bin. Thks

JamesM

MikeOis wrote:

Thanks for the help.
I have checked the Photo diode with an Ohm meter and its seems fine. When the diode is covered the resistance drops and when exposed to the light the resistance increases. My only fear that it is not the photo diode but the controller box. I will have another blast of it, either it gets me or it goes in the bin. Thks

I have to admit that I don't even get that technical, It is quicker to just stick on another box or photocell and see which is at fault
Jim.