Advice for Poker Novice

TangledUpinBlue

A few queries from a 3 month novice of online STTs on PPP

What is a good benchmark for in the money % for 6 & 9 seaters?
What is a good benchmark for ROI?
How many hands/games need to be played to eliminate the impact of short term variance?

Just for info, I have moved up quickly through the different levels once I was making a profit as I felt the best way to learn the game was to play the better players. I am currently just below break even on $20 games (not a lot of games)

I am also a boards novice so go easy on me!!

Ste05

TangledUpinBlue wrote:

I am also a boards novice so go easy on me!!

You've nothing to worry about, this is a well structures and informed question. If I wasn't hammered I'd respond helpfully, but I'm sure you'll get the answer you require.

One thing though about moving up, I hope you are exercising some sort of BankRoll management, or you have additional money to re-invest, because if not, then this is a sure fire way to bustoville, consistently beat a level (at least 50-100 honestly recorded STT's) then move up. Although maybe this doesn't strictly apply to $1 STT's then $2 STT's, then $5 STT's, these are all basically the same, but from $10 - $20 - $30 STT's there's a slight increase in standard. Work to a set number of buy-in's (say 10 - 20) and move up as soon as you have enough for the next level. A period of good variance and you could be easily playing $50 STT's before you know it...

ArmaniJeanss

Hi, Welcome to boards.
I'll answer for 9seaters as I don't do 6h.

The first benchmark is 33% for ITM in 9seaters, coupled with a -10% ROI, that would mark you down as an average (or mean average) player.

Obviously you are above that, which is great !.

A good player can attain 40% ITM at up to $25, a very good player can go 45%, much higher over 100s of games would be fairly sensational imho.

These should roughly translate at ROI of 20% for 40% ITM, and 25-30% ROI for 45% ITM.

I'm a little like you I think in that I started very low at $2 games, and worked myself up slowly, playing ~100-200 at each level (which is the minimum I think you need to play to know if you are beating a level).

Here are my figures if they are any help (they are good, but a little misleading as I generally play 1 at a time whereas most people here multi-table, which would affect the achievable rate).

$3. 248 STTs, ITM 53%, ROI 47%.
$5. 113 STTs, ITM 47%, ROI 23%.
$10 93 STTs, ITM 49%, ROI 34%.
$15 96 STTs, ITM 44%, ROI 21%
$20 140 STTs, ITM 42%, ROI 20%.

Hope that helps a little.

dvdfan

Whats ITM???
Edit/

Doh,it came to me, In the money

dvdfan

ArmaniJeanss wrote:

Hi, Welcome to boards.
I'll answer for 9seaters as I don't do 6h.

The first benchmark is 33% for ITM in 9seaters, coupled with a -10% ROI, that would mark you down as an average (or mean average) player.

Obviously you are above that, which is great !.

A good player can attain 40% ITM at up to $25, a very good player can go 45%, much higher over 100s of games would be fairly sensational imho.

These should roughly translate at ROI of 20% for 40% ITM, and 25-30% ROI for 45% ITM.

I'm a little like you I think in that I started very low at $2 games, and worked myself up slowly, playing ~100-200 at each level (which is the minimum I think you need to play to know if you are beating a level).

Here are my figures if they are any help (they are good, but a little misleading as I generally play 1 at a time whereas most people here multi-table, which would affect the achievable rate).

$3. 248 STTs, ITM 53%, ROI 47%.
$5. 113 STTs, ITM 47%, ROI 23%.
$10 93 STTs, ITM 49%, ROI 34%.
$15 96 STTs, ITM 44%, ROI 21%
$20 140 STTs, ITM 42%, ROI 20%.

Hope that helps a little.

Hi, was hoping to make money doing these STT's but if 20% ROI is a good level thats only €4 on average a game your making. Not saying that isnt a good record im just surprised that a good player cant make more. So maybe STT's arent the best way to go to make a nice side earner??

I must go back through my account and see what my returns are

Ste05

Variance can be a bitch....

TangledUpinBlue

Thanks for the stats. I was thinking that I'd need to be playing 100+ games to get any sort of sensible long term view. If the questions related to MTTs what would the benchmarks be?

Daithio

dvdfan wrote:

Hi, was hoping to make money doing these STT's but if 20% ROI is a good level thats only €4 on average a game your making. Not saying that isnt a good record im just surprised that a good player cant make more. So maybe STT's arent the best way to go to make a nice side earner??

I must go back through my account and see what my returns are

That's why you multi table and move up the stakes.

dvdfan

Daithio wrote:

That's why you multi table and move up the stakes.

Ive tried multitabling and damn when it gets to stage you have one or two games in the final stages and they all keep popping up one after the other, you barely have a second to review what position your in, what the cards are etc and when you go to click on check or raise the other screen pops up and drives me mad

Does this not lead to losses in the long run or do you find that the extra games make up for the losses

bohsman

dvdfan wrote:

Ive tried multitabling and damn when it gets to stage you have one or two games in the final stages and they all keep popping up one after the other, you barely have a second to review what position your in, what the cards are etc and when you go to click on check or raise the other screen pops up and drives me mad

Does this not lead to losses in the long run or do you find that the extra games make up for the losses

Phase them in, try starting a new one every 15 to 20 minutes

Your roi will reduce slightly but the extra games will make up for it

fobster

dvdfan wrote:

Ive tried multitabling and damn when it gets to stage you have one or two games in the final stages and they all keep popping up one after the other, you barely have a second to review what position your in, what the cards are etc and when you go to click on check or raise the other screen pops up and drives me mad

Does this not lead to losses in the long run or do you find that the extra games make up for the losses

Yeah that tends to happen, you have AA in one game and Q4o in the other, and you go to raise the aces but end up raising the Q4o and folding the aces

Of course there's an option to stop this, under the options tab near the bottom there's an option "Enable table pop-up to front" it should be ticked, just click it to untick it.

Edit: What is a good percentage of wins if flop to have on the tribeca stats for normal stts?

Backstreet Moyes

Jus wondering i play on PPP too and worked up too was up on 10 dollars but a series run of bad luck damaged my balance and forced me back down to 5 dollars to try build it back up so i was wondering how too check out these stats if anyone could explain please

bohsman

Keep a spreadsheet and fill it in yourslelf...

Dub13

You could also invest in a second monitor,I normally play 5/6 tables a time and use the monitor to the left for Levels 1,2,3 and play tight.Then once one hits level 3 I move it over to the main monitor and pay it a lot more attention.

Its kind of like my own little production line,this system works for me.

dvdfan

So would anyone like to share what they make on average per day or session, would be interesting to compare to what you make just playing 1 or 2 tables

ArmaniJeanss

My ~20% ROI gives me an average return of $4.40 per game.

I am always clearing either a VC or PPP etc bonus when I play which gives me another $1.60 per game. So $6 per game.

I play 1 table about 75% of the time, 2 tables about 25% of the time.

Average time in a game is about 35 minutes I think (I'm guessing here, some games last an hour+, some I exit at level1)

So by my maths its about $12 per hour.

Its only a hobby though,with the intention of playing at as high a standard as possible, hourly rate doesnt really bother me.

dvdfan

ArmaniJeanss wrote:

My ~20% ROI gives me an average return of $4.40 per game.

I am always clearing either a VC or PPP etc bonus when I play which gives me another $1.60 per game. So $6 per game.

Whats this bonus about on PPP, i play there??

fobster

dvdfan wrote:

Whats this bonus about on PPP, i play there??

It was an stt bonus that you won if you placed first or second in five consecutive stts within the month of september, still an hour left! Of course there was all sorts of ts & cs involved.

Nearly managed to do this, with 2 wins and 2 seconds, but missed on the last game when I finished third after getting outdrawn.

sikes

i think AJ is referring to a deposit bonus.

ArmaniJeanss

dvdfan wrote:

Whats this bonus about on PPP, i play there??

Sikes is right.

PaddyPower, VCPoker and most of the Tribeca skins do regular reload bonuses.
VC is monthly up to $150 dollars, PPP is bi-monthly up to $100, check their respective websites for codes, t&c's etc.

In order to meet the terms of the deposit you have to rake (i.e the fee) 125% of the value of the bonus.

In other words to clear $100 bonus I have to play STTs to the value of $1250(+$125 fee) in the month (or bi-month).
Therefore if I play 63 $20 STTs it costs me $1260 (+$126 fee) and I get $100 back in bonus (~ $1.60 per game as I stated above).

I try to thread a line of making sure that I deposit enough so as to clear the bonus comfortably as you get nothing if you fail to clear it, whilst not depositing too little and clearing the bonus too quickly.

Hope that helps, but feel free to ask for more info if its not clear.

sprocket1

try www.bet-the-pot.com

willietherock

ArmaniJeanss wrote:

Sikes is right.

PaddyPower, VCPoker and most of the Tribeca skins do regular reload bonuses.
VC is monthly up to $150 dollars, PPP is bi-monthly up to $100, check their respective websites for codes, t&c's etc.

In order to meet the terms of the deposit you have to rake (i.e the fee) 125% of the value of the bonus.

In other words to clear $100 bonus I have to play STTs to the value of $1250(+$125 fee) in the month (or bi-month).
Therefore if I play 63 $20 STTs it costs me $1260 (+$126 fee) and I get $100 back in bonus (~ $1.60 per game as I stated above).

I try to thread a line of making sure that I deposit enough so as to clear the bonus comfortably as you get nothing if you fail to clear it, whilst not depositing too little and clearing the bonus too quickly.

Hope that helps, but feel free to ask for more info if its not clear.

I play on PP. I was under the impression that that there was only an initial deposit bonus. I play stts and have built up a sh1t load of Paddy pts. What are " reload " bonusand how do I apply?Do PP do rake back deals?

ArmaniJeanss

willietherock wrote:

I play on PP. I was under the impression that that there was only an initial deposit bonus. I play stts and have built up a sh1t load of Paddy pts. What are " reload " bonusand how do I apply?Do PP do rake back deals?

Heres the latest PaddyPower one, its 'ioreload' halfway down the page. Unfortunately you had to register by 30th Sept so you've missed it, there'll be another one due at the start of November I think.
http://www.paddypowerpoker.com/newsletter/newsletter_2006.08.25.html
(Hint, subscribe to their newsletter and you get kept up-to-date with their wonderful offers like this one!).

ArmaniJeanss (backer of RailLink on the pmu).

willietherock

What is meant by a reload bonus? Do I have to empty and them top up my account before I qualify?