An attempt at floating

NickyOD

Thoughts on this attempt at a delayed bluff?

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Party Poker ($1 no limit). Hand converted by Check Raised hand converter

BTN ($99.15) (BTN)
HERO ($102.70) [ ] (BB)
UTG ($110.40) (UTG)
SB ($130.54) (SB)

Preflop (4 players):
2 folds.
SB raises $4.50.
HERO calls ($4.00) [2.5:1].

Flop (10 bets ($10) in pot, 2 players):

SB bets $7.00.
HERO calls ($7.00) [3.43:1].

Turn (24 bets ($24) in pot, 2 players):

SB checks.
HERO bets $14.00.
SB calls ($14.00) [3.71:1].

River (52 bets ($52) in pot, 2 players):

SB bets $20.00.
HERO raises $76.70.all in

Hectorjelly

what your representing to me is a missed flush draw.

I think that you should only call the flop if you have some piece of the board or draw and then also plan to represent the most obvious draw if it hits. What you are really doing here is making it look like you have a flush draw - calling here with a real flush draw would be marginal; faking it is going to be a losing play.

If you dont put the pfr on an overpair its slightly better, but when he calls the turn he has one (or a flush draw/straight) so I think you should give up on the river.

careca

I don't mind it as you raised preflop, then bet the turn which could have given you the wheel. The bet on the turn was the one that could clinch it. Course it would depend on how good the other player is. If he's good enough he'll give you credit for the A but I wouldn't guarantee it.

Lol, ignore all that. He raised. back to sleep with me .

Jaden

He might fold an Ace, (I wouldn't)- in this regard it's a good play. Given the preflop action, he can't really put you on a flush or a 6. He has to call this. Deeper stacked it might work.

Hectorjelly

Also the back door flush being possible makes your action look less believable

cardshark202

Looks very spewy to me.

Bandana boy

he is defo not folding an ace but he is also not leading the river with it either

His leading the river with an over pair would seem foolish as well unless you have run into a big straight or the backdoor flush I think this might work
but i would want to have seen villain making a move with air or laying down a hand before attempting this

NickyOD

lol. Yeah its looks pretty bad. I didn't mention how long it took him to make the turn call and the river bet (a long time).

It just didn't make sense to me that he had an ace and if he has one one there is still a chance he will fold it. I didn't think it was likely he had a flush either. If he does I think he bets more on the river since I can easily have an ace or a six and will call a larger bet.

I wouldn't always bluff the river but his small bet sealed the deal for me. It just looked like he was betting the minimum amount he was willing to call should he decide to check, so I put him on an overpair and jammed. He folded instantly.

I'm not saying it was a very clever play on my part, probably closer to insane but I think its a good example of when to float. You need position, the right oponent and most importantly the right kind of board.

Hectorjelly

I think this was a bad board to do it on and it only worked because the villain was a timid unthinking opponent who is bad at poker

NickyOD

Hectorjelly wrote:

I think this was a bad board to do it on and it only worked because the villain was a timid unthinking opponent who is bad at poker

Why is it a bad board?

Hectorjelly

NickyOD wrote:

Why is it a bad board?

Firstly the flush draw missed. That is always a bad thing when attempting a bluff. Secondly a back door flush is now possible, that means that most players would not raise on the river with a straight. So your asking him to believe that you have a backdoor flush.

Also an ace would not raise that river for value, it would just call, and its nearly impossible for you to have a 6 in your hand.

NickyOD

Hectorjelly wrote:

Firstly the flush draw missed. That is always a bad thing when attempting a bluff. Secondly a back door flush is now possible, that means that most players would not raise on the river with a straight. So your asking him to believe that you have a backdoor flush.

Also an ace would not raise that river for value, it would just call, and its nearly impossible for you to have a 6 in your hand.

All of this does make sense, I can't deny that, but regardless of what I'm asking him to believe I have he still needs a hand to call me with. I'm not really asking him to beleive I have a flush but a 6. I would play any hand with a six very similar to the way I played this hand. I would rarely push the river but I might push sometimes since it's so unlikely he has made a flush.

marius

Nicky - dont know if im on my own here - but the images you are using to display the hands are not rendering on either (IE or Firefox) browser im using so for the last few hand histories you have posted I have no idea what hands you have......just thought i'd let you know...

cardshark202

NickyOD wrote:

All of this does make sense, I can't deny that, but regardless of what I'm asking him to believe I have he still needs a hand to call me with. I'm not really asking him to beleive I have a flush but a 6. I would play any hand with a six very similar to the way I played this hand. I would rarely push the river but I might push sometimes since it's so unlikely he has made a flush.

You're hoping he puts you on 6dXd?

NickyOD

cardshark202 wrote:

You're hoping he puts you on 6dXd?

christ yeah, otherwise it would mean I called him on the flop with a gutshot. Jesus I'm really sick.

marius, I don't know what the problem is. Maybe try clearing your cache.

Hectorjelly

images are fine for me. It doesnt matter how you would play a hand, only how the villain would think you would play it. After some thought I think this isnt as bad as I first though, the call on the flop is definitely a loser though, and its only going to work against a paticular type of timid fish

ocallagh

marius wrote:

Nicky - dont know if im on my own here - but the images you are using to display the hands are not rendering on either (IE or Firefox) browser im using so for the last few hand histories you have posted I have no idea what hands you have......just thought i'd let you know...

you going thru a proxy server from work? i imagine the site http://www.checkraised.com which the images are hosted on is on the blocked list!

5starpool

Yep, I can't see from work either so I have to wait until I get home to see them. It's fine from here though.

RoundTower

you have no read on your opponent, so I don't like you bluffing him. the cards, action, etc, are less important.

mickste

wow op, how many pats on the back do you want in one day?

two seperate hands and if people disagree their wrong?
You won but i can clearly see hj's point.

I dont think your play is particular good or bad ,but i feel you could lose in this situation a lot more than winning.

NickyOD

RoundTower wrote:

you have no read on your opponent, so I don't like you bluffing him. the cards, action, etc, are less important.

I never said whether I had a read on him or not before the hand, but sometimes you don't need to have played a hand with someone in order to make a guesstimate at what he will do because he is giving you information about his hand all the time.

If a new player sits down at your table and check min raises you what do you put him on? Obviously you draw from past experience from similar plays and make a decision based on those experiences, otherwise how can you have a plan for how to paly your hand against an unknown villain? In this case my reads were based on his timid manner and his bet sizing. I'm not saying the play is anything special, but I am saying there is a logical reason for playing the hand the way I did. I read his river bet to be a stopper bet to try and stop me forcing him into calling more than he wanted to so I pushed.

RoundTower

NickyOD wrote:

I never said whether I had a read on him or not before the hand

why not? Surely if you had a read on him you would have mentioned it, assuming you were really looking for advice on your play here. So I took it he was unknown to you.

marius

ocallagh wrote:

you going thru a proxy server from work? i imagine the site http://www.checkraised.com which the images are hosted on is on the blocked list!

Ah ha....ty.

On a side note, do you know a guy called Rob Murphy by any chance?