new pub/club/similar?

trixter

I am asking out of curiosity, given the quantity of places to go already, I question the need for yet another place ... I am asking about the city centre, certainly walking/stumbling distance from oliver-plunkett somewhere. I personally see where some people are doing it wrong in my opinion, yet they are wildly popular, so I am trying to get a feel for what makes the nightlife scene in cork tick.

Does cork need yet another club?

If they got another one what would make you go (music genre, atmosphere, air cooling, etc - the more specific the better)?

Is price that important?

If the price was less for drinks, no door fee, how important would location be?

How far is too far from oliver-plunkett?

Is there a better area than oliver-plunkett?

I would greatly appreciate any insight you can give me on this

Thanks in advance for all replies.

Balmed Out

Does cork need yet another club? YES - non pop for non teenagers

If they got another one what would make you go (music genre, atmosphere, air cooling, etc - the more specific the better)? music 25+ agegroup

Is price that important? not really

If the price was less for drinks, no door fee, how important would location be? as long as central

How far is too far from oliver-plunkett? as long as between Mccurtain street and the mardyke

Is there a better area than oliver-plunkett? YES What makes you focus on op street Washington street has far more nightlife around it, as does McCurtain street. Do you know cork at all!

I would greatly appreciate any insight you can give me on this

Thanks in advance for all replies

trixter

Balmed Out wrote:

Does cork need yet another club? YES - non pop for non teenagers

what genre then? Classic rock? traditional irish? ... Dead silence would suck at the very least

Balmed Out wrote:

Is there a better area than oliver-plunkett? YES What makes you focus on op street Washington street has far more nightlife around it, as does McCurtain street. Do you know cork at all!

Not really, I moved here a month ago from california.


Thanks for your answers.

Faith

Does cork need yet another club? No, but another decent late night bar wouldn't go astray. One that has decent music from the rock genre (nothing too heavy though).

If they got another one what would make you go (music genre, atmosphere, air cooling, etc - the more specific the better)? A nice big smoking room, good atmosphere, not having to queue for hours at the bar, air conditioning and something to remove the funky smell that bars now have.

Is price that important? If it was a late bar, it should have free entry. But yes, I think price is important.

If the price was less for drinks, no door fee, how important would location be? Not massively, as long as it was in Cork City or somewhere like Douglas. Particularly not important if it was somewhere you would want to stay all night, without moving to a different bar/club.

How far is too far from oliver-plunkett? Within walking distance is fine, or like I said, somewhere like Douglas would be good.

Is there a better area than oliver-plunkett? Yes

trixter

Faith wrote:

Does cork need yet another club? No, but another decent late night bar wouldn't go astray. One that has decent music from the rock genre (nothing too heavy though).

Thati s more of what I had in mind, although there may be nights when its harder since I personally like that

Faith wrote:

If they got another one what would make you go (music genre, atmosphere, air cooling, etc - the more specific the better)? A nice big smoking room, good atmosphere, not having to queue for hours at the bar, air conditioning and something to remove the funky smell that bars now have.

The high heat levels in most places is something that drives me nuts. Who wants to go into a VERY crowded room with everyone sweating cause its a million degrees? That by itself tends to create a funky smell, not to mention I question some of the cleanup in places, gotta mop with hot water and a disinfectant every night, and something very lightly scented about 1-2 hours before you open so that its fresh every day.

As a smoker I would like a big smoking room, however that is a big cost, but who wants to be out in the rain and in later months cold. Knowing your customers is one of the first rules to good business, and if you know that at least a certain percentage of your customers are smokers, then providing a place for them, where they dont have to be banished outside, especially in foul weather, and from a revenue perspective - stop drinking becuase you cant bring your drink with you, that is in my opinion a bad move. However, this isnt free, and I understand that, the prices are high enough at most places, additional space, especially when there isnt any because the place was designed with indoor smoking and when the ban came into place ... New places have an advantage here because they can plan for this and deal with it before its an issue

As far as atmosphere, can you elaborate a bit? What makes the atmosphere good as opposed to bad? What features do you like to see? For example during purgatory, cyprus avenue will play random 'cult classic' movies, while I believe they are provided by the purgatory group, and not cyprus avenue, cyprus avenue still does provide the projectors and TVs to display them.

barstools or high back chairs? many tables or standing room only?

Faith wrote:

Is price that important? If it was a late bar, it should have free entry. But yes, I think price is important.

I agree, I think that in many places the prices are too high, if there is a cover charge (entrance tax) that should offset the drink price, yet I have found that it doesnt. Some people use part or all of this money to pay for the entertainment, yet I still see about 200 drinks an hour being served at some of the larger places (100-200 people drinking 1-2 per hour) and knowing the retail price on kegs this would be a good markup, although I dont know all of the costs (rent, insurance, licenses, taxes, electricity, etc). Wholesale kegs are obviously cheaper since the people selling retail kegs are making a profit.

Faith wrote:

Is there a better area than oliver-plunkett? Yes

could you elaborate on where? Other than douglas, in the city centre, where in your opinion would be better?


Another thing I dislike that many places seem to do (although not all, and I have seen some places, that appear to be higher on the list of places people like) is not putting the bar right by the door, creating a choke point. You should have to walk in, away from the entrace/egress points to get to the bar. Often I have gone to places and you cant get inside because everyone goes to the cloest place to order their drink, then once they have it they dont want to move, and will stand there talking to their friends preventing anyone else from getting to the bar, or even walking in/out. That really drives me nuts.

The reason I am asking all of this is because I am considering starting a place, and wanted to know why things are the way they are, is it just apathy - every place is the same so dont demand any place better, or am I just a 'fish out of water' here, not accustomed to the culture yet?

If I do start a place it wont be until mid-2007, but I wanted to see what features people want, so that I can try to figure out costs, and see if its even reasonable for me to do. It seems, however that some of my complaints about places are felt by others, which makes me wonder why more places dont do this, aside from the obvious - there isnt enough money left over to expand/renovate and they were built for far less, and different environments (ie traditional pub that became a club).

Faith

trixter wrote:

Thati s more of what I had in mind, although there may be nights when its harder since I personally like that

That's absolutely fine. I think there should be certain "types" of nights, and these should be well publicised. For example, Friday night could be "Metal" night, Saturday could be "Rock", Sunday could be "Emo" or whatever. The thing that's really getting my goat at the moment is how "rock" is used to describe hundreds of music genres. I joined the "rock" society at college, only to be handed a flyer saying "First Event Tonight: Ska, Heavy Metal, Emo, Punk" etc. IMO they're all seperate genres.

The high heat levels in most places is something that drives me nuts. Who wants to go into a VERY crowded room with everyone sweating cause its a million degrees?

Not me, anyway! I HATE being too hot. It makes me light headed and uncomfortable, and that makes me unhappy.

As a smoker I would like a big smoking room, however that is a big cost, but who wants to be out in the rain and in later months cold. Knowing your customers is one of the first rules to good business, and if you know that at least a certain percentage of your customers are smokers, then providing a place for them, where they dont have to be banished outside, especially in foul weather, and from a revenue perspective - stop drinking becuase you cant bring your drink with you, that is in my opinion a bad move. However, this isnt free, and I understand that, the prices are high enough at most places, additional space, especially when there isnt any because the place was designed with indoor smoking and when the ban came into place ... New places have an advantage here because they can plan for this and deal with it before its an issue

Yeah, I get that this is a big problem. However, I'm always happy standing outside when it's relatively sheltered. An overhead canopy and maybe smaller ones on the ground to mark off the smoking area are good. Basically, a place where you won't get wet when it rains, and where there's a few heat lamps for when it's cold. That area can also be filled with tables during the day.

As far as atmosphere, can you elaborate a bit? What makes the atmosphere good as opposed to bad? What features do you like to see? For example during purgatory, cyprus avenue will play random 'cult classic' movies, while I believe they are provided by the purgatory group, and not cyprus avenue, cyprus avenue still does provide the projectors and TVs to display them.

I think it's near impossible to define what creates a good atmosphere, but a USP is always good. For example, here in Edinburgh there's a bar called Frankensteins. It's in a converted church, with the DJ up on the pulpit. There's tables up on the balcony where you can look down on the little space that's used as a dance floor. There's screens all around showing the movie Frankenstein, and at around 1.30 every night, the Frankenstein music is played and a huge table thing rolls out at eye level across from the balcony. There's a model of Frankenstein on it, and he sits up, looks around a couple of times and then lies back down. It's really cool, especially the first few times you see it. I always recommend that bar when people ask me where to go.

barstools or high back chairs? many tables or standing room only?

Lots of tables, always. I don't mind about the type of chair.

could you elaborate on where? Other than douglas, in the city centre, where in your opinion would be better?

Somewhere a little out of the way, but still accessible. Like the Franciscan Well. I think it's location also encourages people to stay there rather than moving on. You have to put a bit of effort into getting there, usually.

Best of luck with everything if you do decide to start a new place!

trixter

Faith wrote:

I think it's near impossible to define what creates a good atmosphere, but a USP is always good. For example, here in Edinburgh there's a bar called Frankensteins. It's in a converted church, with the DJ up on the pulpit. There's tables up on the balcony where you can look down on the little space that's used as a dance floor. There's screens all around showing the movie Frankenstein, and at around 1.30 every night, the Frankenstein music is played and a huge table thing rolls out at eye level across from the balcony. There's a model of Frankenstein on it, and he sits up, looks around a couple of times and then lies back down. It's really cool, especially the first few times you see it. I always recommend that bar when people ask me where to go.

could you define USP?

When I lived in edinburgh I never saw that place, course that was in 2000 so it may not be that old ... Sounds interesting though

Faith

A unique selling point, just anything that people notice and will talk about.

Frankensteins in on George the 4th, near the Chambers Street end. I don't know how old it is.

Blitzkrieger

Being the very soul of cosmopolitan sophistication, I can declare that the problem is not with the pubs themselves but with the clientèle. The majority of people in Cork are ignorant muck savages.

I used to work with a guy who lived near Washington Street – lets call him Ronan.........because that's his name. Ronan's favorite bar was the Mercury Lounge. At the time it wasn't open long but I could see why he liked it. On a weekend night it tended to be busy, but not packed. They often had live jazz music and it was never loud enough to be intrusive – it was pleasant background music that created a nice atmosphere. They had a little restaurant area where they served food and though I never went there for a meal myself, I heard it was good. They even had waitresses doing table service so you never had to leave your booth. They had a late license that they weren't using at the time due to some problem with fire exits. Once they did start opening late they were going to start serving chips and burgers once the kitchen closed at 11:30 – you could have spent your whole night in there. Bizarrely though, there seemed to be less people in there every weekend.

Ronan moved to Kilkenny and I stopped going to the Mercury Lounge. He was back one weekend and we decided to go back for a pint. We were stopped by a bouncer at the door because the place was packed, but Ronan knew the head bouncer so he let us squeeze in as a group came outside for a cigarette just then. Disaster! There was a **** DJ in the corner where the jazz acts would usually perform, pumping out **** music at ear splitting level. Amazingly the restaurant part was still there because I don't know how anybody could enjoy a meal with that **** assaulting their ear drums. I bet management were pleased though – the place was packed.

I just can't understand why people like that kind of pub. It was such a nice place to go before but they turned it into a place that was worse than the seventh circle of hell – they turned it into Reardens.

Reardens is the Cork pub.....in that it encapsulates every thing that's bad about pubs in Cork. Not all the bad pubs are as bad, but they always share the same characteristics; the bouncers are absolute pricks, the staff are usually twelve and haven't learned to pull a pint yet and surprisingly given the volume of drink going over the counter, pints taste like they've spent a week at the bottom of a sock bin. The music is too loud and is usually ****, they pack way too many people in and everybody seems to smell like armpits.......except for the die hard culchies who smell like wet ass.

I honestly can't imagine why people would like going there. At the other end of the scale; I enjoyed being in Meade's wine bar the other night. I know a bar that quiet isn't to everybody's taste but Reardens is just madness.

The last time I threw a birthday party I had it in Nancy Spains'. I say “threw” but I'm chronically lazy so I really just sent a text to everybody in my phone book that I was going for a few drinks to celebrate my birthday. It turned out to be a great night though. Kerbdog were playing up the back so there was a fair crowd in for that, but it wasn't too packed. They had a DJ near the bar playing a mix of rock, grunge and metal, but it wasn't too loud. We grabbed ourselves a couple of tables near the bar at the front where we got served quickly and the smokers could easily go out the front. It turned out to be the perfect place for a party. It was a lively pub with good atmosphere but we weren't packed in like sardines. We had a table to ourselves and didn't have to shout at each other to have a conversation.

The last time I was in Nancy's was when we did the pub crawl last year. I think we were the only people in there at the time and I hear it's always dead quiet in there these days.

It you want to see a good night club, go to the Forum in Waterford. I was there for some Ministry of Sound thing and it was brilliant. I don't really like the type of music the DJ was playing but he mixed it so well and the tunes themselves were so good I spent most of the night on the dance floor – something I never do. The great thing was that once you went back from the dance floor the music was quieter. At the bar you could say your order to the barman (who had never heard of a Jaegeebomb) instead of shouting. There was some comfy looking seats away from the dance floor too where you could take a break and actually talk to your friends. I never actually sat down though because once you were on the dance floor the music was really intense and I just didn't want to leave.

So there you go – give me a pub like Meade's, the LV, Tom Barry's or Nancy's when it was popular and a club like the Forum and I'll be happy.

StandnDeliver

loads of interesting comments,the drinks i agree with the comment of having prices on display.
I am trying at them moment to get some cheap pint in purgatory or at least sponsered but it doesnt always happen straight away,with starting up a night most brewerys usually wait a while to see how the night performs etc...

The air conditioning yes important ,but again you work with what is provided,i cant considered buying something for a venue that isnt mine,nor should anyone..

In regards to how a place is cleaned, well sure carpets and clubs dont mix ,puke,pills,piss and drink dont mix well lol

Another late bar as far as i know club one is being changed into one,it will no longer be a club.

All other venues in this city are dominated by chart music for the masses,hiphop and dance.
Halfmoon lost its club licence and well then there are some premises that are dodgy to say the least,but then it depends on your punters.

To open a club night i wish you the best,if your starting from scratch then jaysus you will have a battle with the drink licence,there arent any available or theyre few and far between.
Most of the pubs and clubs are owned by 3 lots of people in corkcity duno if people knew that.They will outbid you till the last,property in cork is crazy.
they have it sewn up.

if you were to invest in a venue or a pub i would recommend a gig venue ,do your homework,market research on the irish market.Visit earth new club opened,cube,,comedyclub,pav,mangans,side tracks,readons,cubins,savoy,see the difference.

yeah cork has a poor selection.

Tree

mercury lounge IS owned by reardon's these days, no more food in teh evenings, or cocktails.

oddly enough the reardon's group also own preachers but it doesnt represent the style of music or clientele of their other pubs (though i must say, there are many more females to be found in there these days, tis just not right, i mean, queuing for the loo and ordering nonpint/pitcher drinks! i ask you, what is the world comin to)

chippybrady

I lived in Cork for around 5 years and I hated Reardons and Cubins etc. The best pubs in Cork are the Mutton Lane Inn, Sin e and the Oval. These pubs always have decent music but the only downside is that they tend to get packed easily. Tom Barry's up in Barrack Street is a good spot and so is the castle on North Main Street. All the pubs I mentioned are fairly unpretensious as well. For a night club I recommend the Everyman Palace. They have a band playing on Saturday nights and the clientele is between 25 and 35.