The Bible exegesis in a bit different manner

T-1111111111111

I decided to study the Bible (beginning with Matthew) from a bit different perspective than the usual one - having in mind that the true message of the Bible is that there is only One True Lord of the Heavens and the Earth and everything between them, One True Creator and also having in mind that Jesus, peace upon him, is a prophet of Almighty and is certainly only human and not divine in any sense. This also is valid for the Holy Ghost who was mixed up (deliberately or not) with angel Gabriel, peace upon him.

The very basic analysis of chapters Matthew 1-7 showed many contradictions with the trinity as such. God Willing I will post my further analysis results (which may be correct or incorrect) for those who want to open their minds and think about what the Bible is saying.

Another point is that the Bible as it exists today cannot be taken into consideration as a complete and true revelation from God to His prophets meaning that the original scripts are not extant and the nowadays Bible (with all the man-made modifications and contradictions) is an incomplete reflection of the original Revelation incl. the invented trinity, the divinity of Jesus, and similar.

Note that [c] means my comment and [t] the actual verse(s) from the Bible.

Book Chapter Paragraph Verse(s) Verse Text / Comment
Matthew 5 Salt and Light 16 [c] Father in Heaven is praised, not Jesus nor the Holy Ghost.
Matthew 5 The Fulfillment of the Law 17-20 [c] Jesus does not break the 10 Commandments but confirms them.
Matthew 5 Murder 21-26 [c] Jesus condemns murder and gives a warning to murderers.
Matthew 5 Adultery 27-30 [c] Jesus condemns adultery and gives a warning to adulterers.
Matthew 5 Divorce 31-32 [c] Jesus condemns divorce, however divorce is allowed.
Matthew 5 Love for Enemies 45 [c] Father in Heaven causes the sun to rise and sends rain, not Jesus.
Matthew 5 Love for Enemies 48 [c] Heavenly Father is perfect, again, Jesus and the Holy Spirit are not mentioned.
Matthew 6 Giving to the Needy 01 [c] Father in Heaven gives the reward, not Jesus nor the Holy Spirit.
Matthew 6 Giving to the Needy 4 [c] Father sees what is done in secret, not Jesus nor the Holy Spirit.
Matthew 6 Prayer 6 [c] Again, Father sees what is done in secret.
Matthew 6 Prayer 8 [c] Father knows what people are asking Him; people pray to Father alone.
Matthew 6 Prayer 9-13 [c] Jesus teaches them how to pray. They pray to Father, not to Jesus nor to the Holy Spirit.
Matthew 6 Prayer 14-15 [c] Father forgives (or does not) sins, not Jesus nor the Holy Spirit.
Matthew 6 Fasting 18 [c] Father is unseen, also; people's fast is known only to Him, not to Jesus nor the Holy Spirit.
Matthew 6 Do Not Worry 26 [c] Father feeds the birds, not Jesus nor the Holy Spirit.
Matthew 7 A Tree and Its Fruit 21 [c] Jesus confirms that only he who does the will of the Father will enter Heaven, not the will of Jesus nor the will of the Holy Spirit.

UU

Christians all know that the Bible was written by men but inspired by God whilst Muslims claim the Qur'an is the actual word of God. If you're out to prove the flaws in the Bible, good luck to you, because I engaged in a similiar conversation about it once and there was no end to it. :rolleyes: The same would be if I were to engage in a debate of the truth of the Qur'an (which I also believe to be false). Basically it is case of "this is what I believe and this what you believe".

According to the Bible, Jesus did, in fact, claim himself to be God and many Christians will argue that what he said is true. Of course I don't believe in God so I obviously don't think that Jesus is God. If you're out to interpret the Bible your own way to justify what the Qur'an says about Jesus being a prophet and only human, well that is just silly and foolish. Sure, people just interpret (or misinterpret) passages the way the want it to be and not accepting what is.

BTW, there also many passages in the Bible to equally support the concept of Jesus being God. I'm sure some educated Christians would be happy to point them out to you.

Good luck because you'll by all means need it.

Wibbs

T-1111111111111 wrote:

Another point is that the Bible as it exists today cannot be taken into consideration as a complete and true revelation from God to His prophets meaning that the original scripts are not extant and the nowadays Bible (with all the man-made modifications and contradictions) is an incomplete reflection of the original Revelation incl. the invented trinity, the divinity of Jesus, and similar.

I see you still haven't returned to a certain thread on this forum to explain the inconsistencies, errors of transmission and origins in your own divine manual the Quran, then. Try thinking along the lines that others may not see the inconsistencies, errors of transmission and origins in theirs and respect them accordingly. I live in hope.

T-1111111111111

Wibbs wrote:

I see you still haven't returned to a certain thread on this forum to explain the inconsistencies, errors of transmission and origins in your own divine manual the Quran, then. Try thinking along the lines that others may not see the inconsistencies, errors of transmission and origins in theirs and respect them accordingly. I live in hope.

Oh Wibbs I did not forget. I was enjoying my vacations. I will get back to that - Allah Willing - with pleasure. But I would expect u to listen and read what I write, ok?

Pls be so kind to send me a link to the thread, I can't find it...thx.

wolfsbane

T-111... said:

I decided to study the Bible (beginning with Matthew) from a bit different perspective than the usual one - having in mind that the true message of the Bible is that there is only One True Lord of the Heavens and the Earth and everything between them, One True Creator and also having in mind that Jesus, peace upon him, is a prophet of Almighty and is certainly only human and not divine in any sense. This also is valid for the Holy Ghost who was mixed up (deliberately or not) with angel Gabriel, peace upon him.

In other words, you decided to see what parts of Matthew 1-7 could be presented as supporting your already fixed conclusions. 'Study' is perhaps the wrong word to use.

The very basic analysis of chapters Matthew 1-7 showed many contradictions with the trinity as such. God Willing I will post my further analysis results (which may be correct or incorrect) for those who want to open their minds and think about what the Bible is saying.

Let's see from your examples:
Matthew 5 Salt and Light 16 [c] Father in Heaven is praised, not Jesus nor the Holy Ghost. So if I praise robindch for his analysis in some post, does that mean I can't praise Scofflaw for his in another? Your logic is flawed.

Matthew 5 The Fulfillment of the Law 17-20 [c] Jesus does not break the 10 Commandments but confirms them. So? Christians believe He did that. In fact, as their substitutionary atonement, He had to perfectly keep the Law. He was the sinless Lamb of God.

Matthew 5 Murder 21-26 [c] Jesus condemns murder and gives a warning to murderers. See above.

Matthew 5 Adultery 27-30 [c] Jesus condemns adultery and gives a warning to adulterers. See above.

Matthew 5 Divorce 31-32 [c] Jesus condemns divorce, however divorce is allowed. Jesus in fact returns mankind to a higher standard of behaviour than Moses required. Moses permitted divorce for many reasons, Jesus reminds us that at the beginning it was not so, and He prohibits divorce except for the most grave reasons.

Matthew 5 Love for Enemies 45 [c] Father in Heaven causes the sun to rise and sends rain, not Jesus. So Jesus is not the Father - does not mean He is not God.

Matthew 5 Love for Enemies 48 [c] Heavenly Father is perfect, again, Jesus and the Holy Spirit are not mentioned. Not mentioned does not mean excluded.

Matthew 6 Giving to the Needy 01 [c] Father in Heaven gives the reward, not Jesus nor the Holy Spirit. See above.

Matthew 6 Giving to the Needy 4 [c] Father sees what is done in secret, not Jesus nor the Holy Spirit. See above.

Matthew 6 Prayer 6 [c] Again, Father sees what is done in secret. See above.

Matthew 6 Prayer 8 [c] Father knows what people are asking Him; people pray to Father alone. That is the normal path for our petitions: ask the Father in Jesus' name. Does not mean Jesus is not one with the Father, the same in essence, God. Just means different roles for each member of the Godhead.

Matthew 6 Prayer 9-13 [c] Jesus teaches them how to pray. They pray to Father, not to Jesus nor to the Holy Spirit. See above.

Matthew 6 Prayer 14-15 [c] Father forgives (or does not) sins, not Jesus nor the Holy Spirit. The unity in the Godhead of Father, Son and Holy Spirit is demonstrated in this matter of the forgiveness of sins: here it says it is the Father who forgives; in Matthew 9:6 it is Jesus who forgives sins.

Matthew 6 Fasting 18 [c] Father is unseen, also; people's fast is known only to Him, not to Jesus nor the Holy Spirit. How come Jesus knows the thoughts of our hearts: Matthew 9:4? In the wider context of Scripture, the Holy Spirit is also shown to be the One who knows our deepest thoughts:
1 Corinthians 2:10 But God has revealed them to us through His Spirit. For the Spirit searches all things, yes, the deep things of God. 11 For what man knows the things of a man except the spirit of the man which is in him? Even so no one knows the things of God except the Spirit of God.
And that text also should put paid to the ridiculous assertion that the Holy Spirit is the angel Gabriel.

Matthew 6 Do Not Worry 26 [c] Father feeds the birds, not Jesus nor the Holy Spirit. The roles within the Godhead again.

Matthew 7 A Tree and Its Fruit 21 [c] Jesus confirms that only he who does the will of the Father will enter Heaven, not the will of Jesus nor the will of the Holy Spirit. So the will of Jesus is different from the will of the Father? Not at all. Their wills are one. To do the Father's will is to do Jesus' will, and vice versa.

Another point is that the Bible as it exists today cannot be taken into consideration as a complete and true revelation from God to His prophets meaning that the original scripts are not extant

With that meaning we agree. No original manuscripts. The original manuscripts of the Koran are kept where?

and the nowadays Bible (with all the man-made modifications and contradictions) is an incomplete reflection of the original Revelation incl. the invented trinity, the divinity of Jesus, and similar.

The Bible we have today, even with the many scribal inaccuracies, still conveys the original message. Any of the doctrinal disagreements amongst those calling themselves Christian relate to interpretation of the substantive text, not to the minor variations in the text itself.

The Trinity, Divinity of Jesus, etc. are doctrines held from the beginning of the Church, but opposed at times by heretics within and without. Just as Judaism threw up the Pharisees and Sadducees: one held to the existence of the spirit world (souls, angels, etc.) and the other denied their existence.