restoring classic cars?

bo-bo

hi all,

in an atempt to get into classic car ownership ive been looking at various ford capris ( ive always had a softspot for them ). however, ive been dismayed at what people consider "good" condition!

ive been shown cars with more rot than a compost heap and been told they will only need a little bit of work.

now dont get me wrong, im not so niave to believe that a 20 (ish) year old car will be immaculate free, but from what ive seen my enthusiasm is starting to waiver.

has anyone here had experience of restoring a car? am i better off buying a fully restored car, or buying a heap of scrap and having a go at restoring it? ( ive no experience at all other than basic mechanics btw )

what costs can i expect to incur etc etc, in your experience

thanking you for your opinions

Eric318

If you want to drive a classic car as opposed to spend your time and money rebuilding one, find a no rust car, yes! Mechanics can always be sorted.

These come in 3 shapes:

- a PROPERLY restored car, something that somebody has spent an inordinate amount of money on to bring back to as close as possible to original/authentic, out of passion. A fully restored car should come with a full photographic file as evidence. Yet, I have personally been offered a car for sale with another car's photographic file... Buyer beware.

- a rust free car from a sunny country (there are loads of them from the USA); or that has been kept in a dry garage for many years (rare)

- a reshelled car (yes this exists)

The alternative is to buy a wreck and have it restored or do it yourself: long and expensive but you will know exactly what you are driving at the end of the process. You will eventually sell it for half what it cost you to some guy looking for a PROPERLY restored car etc...

I really depends if you want to drive a classic or rebuild one. Think hard first

Good luck

bo-bo

Eric318 wrote:

I really depends if you want to drive a classic or rebuild one.

if i were rich id have someone else rebuild one, sigh

i forgot to ask, but is there any bodyshops around that restore ( or will even look at ) capris

Alfasudcrazy

In my view you will regret buying a car to restore in Ireland as it is very difficult to get good quality restorers here - and all good or bad will charge a fortune. Even the UK is expensive too.

In relation to doing it yourself - again I would be cautious - that will still work out very expensive and you will have to spend much more than you will ever get if you decide to sell it down the road.

I am a firm believer in letting someone else do the work and for the seller to take the loss on sale.

I recently spent €6,500 on a fully restored 1978 Alfasud. Its not totally perfect but almost so. It was owned by Richard Bremner - ex CAR magazine and currently with Autocar. He spent £15,000 sterling having it restored. I have the pics and the bills. So even though I may have paid a record price for an Alfasud (its sale at that price prompted an article in Classic & Sportscar) I still believe I got a bargain. I can work on the slight imperfections over time as I did with my TR6 and all my other classics.

Spend a little extra for a good restored car - it will work out a lot cheaper in the end.

Eric318

words of wisdom...

Itsfixed

Alfasudcrazy wrote:

In my view you will regret buying a car to restore in Ireland as it is very difficult to get good quality restorers here - and all good or bad will charge a fortune. Even the UK is expensive too.

In relation to doing it yourself - again I would be cautious - that will still work out very expensive and you will have to spend much more than you will ever get if you decide to sell it down the road.

I am a firm believer in letting someone else do the work and for the seller to take the loss on sale.

I recently spent €6,500 on a fully restored 1978 Alfasud. Its not totally perfect but almost so. It was owned by Richard Bremner - ex CAR magazine and currently with Autocar. He spent £15,000 sterling having it restored. I have the pics and the bills. So even though I may have paid a record price for an Alfasud (its sale at that price prompted an article in Classic & Sportscar) I still believe I got a bargain. I can work on the slight imperfections over time as I did with my TR6 and all my other classics.

Spend a little extra for a good restored car - it will work out a lot cheaper in the end.

Wow, well done. I remember reading about that car and lusting after it in an article Richard wrote for Car magazine. (I remember there being more black bits on it though) It was compared with a Citroen GS and feted as the two family hatchback cars that stood out in the 1970s. I'd love a Citroen GS too.

ds20prefecture

Itsfixed wrote:

It was compared with a Citroen GS and feted as the two family hatchback cars that stood out in the 1970s. I'd love a Citroen GS too.

I'm restoring a GS at the moment. It will be a long time before it is as beautiful as Alfasudcrazy's 'Sud but it's good to aim for something.

Interestingly, neither the first Alfasud nor the first GS were hatchbacks - they were saloons with a chopped "Kamm" tail. The GSA (Mk 2 GS) was a hatchback, and I think the series 2 'Sud was too. The Alfasud was the better drivers car, with more performance and more entertaining handling but the GS is more technically interesting. Both were a metric mile more advanced than any of the competition. (Kadett, R12, Fiat 128, Ford Escort)

Alfasudcrazy

Itsfixed wrote:

Wow, well done. I remember reading about that car and lusting after it in an article Richard wrote for Car magazine. (I remember there being more black bits on it though) It was compared with a Citroen GS and feted as the two family hatchback cars that stood out in the 1970s. I'd love a Citroen GS too.

I think that was his 1979 series II Alfasud (hence the black wheel arch surrounds) that Richard wrote about in CAR. He has owned several over the years. My car never appeared in any magazine article as I asked him when buying it and he said no.

He only bought my car in 1996 - so (I think ?) was gone from CAR then to Autocar where any articles on Alfasuds would not have got very far with the editors.

Itsfixed

Alfasudcrazy wrote:

I think that was his 1979 series II Alfasud (hence the black wheel arch surrounds) that Richard wrote about in CAR. He has owned several over the years. My car never appeared in any magazine article as I asked him when buying it and he said no.

He only bought my car in 1996 - so (I think ?) was gone from CAR then to Autocar where any articles on Alfasuds would not have got very far with the editors.

Yes, that's it. It definitely had more black trim and bumpers. The aforementioned Car magazine article would have been from the late 1980s. I think that series II was the nicest looking Alfasud of all. GSs and Alfasuds must be buggers to work on, right? Poor rust protection, fragile Italian and French mechanicals etc.

ds20prefecture

Itsfixed wrote:

GSs and Alfasuds must be buggers to work on, right? Poor rust protection, fragile Italian and French mechanicals etc.

Speaking for the GS - not really. The rust protection isn't great, but no worse than other cars of the seventies. The GS is very robust, as long as it is well treated. Oil changes every 3000 miles are a must and the camshafts are prone to failure if it isn't, but the engine is actually very easy to work on. A strong man could lift it out of the car with ease. Electrics are fine, transmissions ditto. The hydraulics are practically bullet proof and easy to work on.
Theres some myths about their complexity out there, and they are certainly different to other cars, but follow the manual and there's not much that will surprise you in a bad way. For example: you need to remove a headlamp to change either of the front spark plugs but this is not a hard job. say 20 minutes instead of 10 for a normal car.

Lyre61

Ha Ha, wait till you get near the clutch, I ended up cutting up spanners so I could adjust it Or wait till you got to fix the window mech you need three hands, but they need to be half the size of the two you got!
After saying that, they are a great car to drive, and the Break could hold a hugh amount of stuff. The GSA that followed it just got too heavy and lost the simple beauty in style and mechanics the GS has.

ds20prefecture

Interesting - i've both of those jobs coming up! I'm replacing the doors with new ones so will have to move the windows and locks to the new doors. The clutch bite point is a little close to the floor, so I'll have to adjust that up. I'm looking forward to it now!

Lyre61

The trick is with the windows to be careful of the plate that is glued to the glass that moves in the rail as the glass goes up and down. The clutch is ok to adjust once you have modified the spanners I was talking to a mate who works on Citroens the other week and we were swoping tales of all the good tools we had cut up to work on the cars!

Eric318

Back in the 30's, for the Traction, Citroën even developed its own threads for bolts and nuts... Original bolts had the double chevrom stamped on the head. Today it helps tell the boys from the men when inspecting a restored Traction

Lyre61

With the amount of nuts and bolts on a Citroen always thought that they shares in a nut and bolt factory!