Proposed GAA Championship Structures

cruiserweight

Some new league and championship structures have been proposed, what does everybody think?

The GAA have announced details of new proposals for the NHL and NFL and the All-Ireland hurling and football championships.

The draft proposals are the result of a wide consultation process by the Games Administration Committee, which included the contributions of the Competitions Task Force, the Hurling Development Committee and the Football Task Force among others.

The draft proposals have been circulated to all counties for their observations and a final document in respect of the National Leagues will be placed before Central Council at their next meeting.

A final proposal in respect of the Hurling and football championships will be before Special Congress on October 14 next.

The main points of the proposals are:
NHL: These would have four divisions - Division 1 (9 counties), Division 2 (9 counties), Division 3 (8 counties) and Division 4 (7 counties) - and would commence in 2007. The play off stages in all divisions would include semi-finals and a final with promotion and relegation between divisions. It is also proposed that a bonus point be awarded to teams who score two or more goals from open play in a league game. It is suggested that a South Dublin team would be included in Division 3 from 2008 onwards.

NFL: These would have four divisions of 8 (Divisions 1, 2, 3 and 4) and would commence in 2008, although there is an option to commence in 2007. Options to play the leagues without any final (i.e. the top placed team in each Division are named the League champions) or a final between the top two teams in each Division have been included. The bottom two teams in each division would be relegated with the sixth placed team in Divisions 1, 2 and 3 playing the third placed team in Divisions 2, 3 and 4 respectively to decide a final promotion/relegation place. It is also proposed that in Championship, the Division 4 counties would participate in the Tommy Murphy Cup only.

All-Ireland SHC: It is proposed that there would be 12 teams in the Liam McCarthy Cup, 10 in the Christy Ring Cup and 12 in the Nicky Rackard Cup for 2007. The Liam McCarthy Cup would include the Leinster and Munster Provincial championships, in addition to a qualifier group with two pre-ordained groups of four teams. The Christy Ring Cup would have two groups of five, and the Nicky Rackard Cup four groups of three. There would be no promotion to or relegation from the Liam McCarthy Cup. It is also proposed to include a South Dublin team in the Christy Ring competition from 2008 onwards and a North Dublin team in the Nicky Rackard Cup.

All-Ireland SFC: It is proposed that teams in Division 4 of the National Football league would only participate in the Tommy Murphy Cup once eliminated from their provincial championships. This would have the effect of reducing the current qualifier structure by one round. An open, unrestricted draw would be made for rounds 1, 2 and 3. It is also proposed to discontinue the pre-ordained quarter and semi-finals roster.

Other recommendations designed to facilitate the club fixtures programme include the playing of football and hurling qualifier rounds on the same dates, two defined scheduling windows for club fixtures and the playing of extra time rather than replays in a greater number of games.

flogen

I read somewhere that the new plans had provisions for a South Dublin team from 2008... I thought the plan to split the Dublin team in two was thrown out the window a fair few years ago?

charba

cruiserweight wrote:

Some new league and championship structures have been proposed, what does everybody think?

cruiserweight wrote:

NFL: These would have four divisions of 8 (Divisions 1, 2, 3 and 4) and would commence in 2008, although there is an option to commence in 2007. Options to play the leagues without any final (i.e. the top placed team in each Division are named the League champions) or a final between the top two teams in each Division have been included. The bottom two teams in each division would be relegated with the sixth placed team in Divisions 1, 2 and 3 playing the third placed team in Divisions 2, 3 and 4 respectively to decide a final promotion/relegation place. It is also proposed that in Championship, the Division 4 counties would participate in the Tommy Murphy Cup only.

I think this is fair enough there are not many competitions in the world where if you finish top of the leauge you still have to be entered into a final to see if your crowned the champions or not.

This points based system will encourage managers to field their strongest teams in the later stages of the competition when they often lose team members to county teams and the league becomes less important especially if you are in a comfortable position in the table with no fear of being relegated.

But I don't think that only allowing teams in the fourth division only play in the tommy Murphy Cup. I think that would only take from the Sam Maguire with teams that are currently in division 2b including Cavan and Sligo always puttng up a good fight and a show on for their fans.

Dapos

charba wrote:

But I don't think that only allowing teams in the fourth division only play in the tommy Murphy Cup. I think that would only take from the Sam Maguire with teams that are currently in division 2b including Cavan and Sligo always puttng up a good fight and a show on for their fans.

I agree, what if a team who normally preforms poor in league suddenly for some reason have a great run in province and get to province final. They lose and are out of run for sam yet team they beat in semi's go on through qualifiers. I know this is just one freak scenario, just came to my head minute i read that article. Is there really that much wrong with football championship. If they want to eliminate rounds then just knock out any team who lose first game

The Rooster

Dapos wrote:

I agree, what if a team who normally preforms poor in league suddenly for some reason have a great run in province and get to province final. They lose and are out of run for sam yet team they beat in semi's go on through qualifiers.

No.

If you get to a provincial final then you play in the All Ireland series. You cannot play in the TM Cup even if you're a Div4 team.

The Rooster

flogen wrote:

I read somewhere that the new plans had provisions for a South Dublin team from 2008... I thought the plan to split the Dublin team in two was thrown out the window a fair few years ago?

The tentative plan is for a South Dublin team in the Christy Ring and a North Dublin team in the Nicky Rackard. However Dublin would still play in the Liam McCarthy, and the two regional teams would act as feeder teams for up and coming players.

DUB

The Rooster wrote:

The tentative plan is for a South Dublin team in the Christy Ring and a North Dublin team in the Nicky Rackard. However Dublin would still play in the Liam McCarthy, and the two regional teams would act as feeder teams for up and coming players.

A lot of people seem to be having trouble following that part of the plan. It'd be a great boost to the Dublin hurling manager to be able to have two feeder teams to pick from, even if the standard in the Rackard wouldnt be great, What happens if they get promoted?

Culchie

The Tommy Murphy cup is a joke.

There is a qualifier system already in place, which is plenty consolation for first round losers.

County Boards, and indeed county supporters have to put some pressure on themselves to raise their standard of coaching at underage level, not rely on a Mickey Mouse tournament to bring their players on.

It's different for Hurling, as it is only played in 'pockets' outside the Hurling strongholds ...but Louth, Clare, Sligo in the Tommy Murphy ....ffs let's get real.

Dapos

The Rooster wrote:

No.

If you get to a provincial final then you play in the All Ireland series. You cannot play in the TM Cup even if you're a Div4 team.

How do u know this?

gerire

The Rooster wrote:

The tentative plan is for a South Dublin team in the Christy Ring and a North Dublin team in the Nicky Rackard. However Dublin would still play in the Liam McCarthy, and the two regional teams would act as feeder teams for up and coming players.

I like this idea, the ammount of players that are in Dublin, there needs to be guys out there playing intercounty to develop themselves for the big show, some of these guys could go through their career and not have a chance of playing with the dus but a bit of extra development could give them a chance.

However I can see the likes of Kilkenny, Tipp and Cork especially having a problem with this and would expect similar offer available to them

The Rooster

Dapos wrote:

How do u know this?

Genius that I am, I read the proposals!

Dapos

The Rooster wrote:

Genius that I am, I read the proposals!

My Bad sorry!

Danno

PROPOSAL FOR HURLING 2007

* Disband the League

LEINSTER HURLING CHAMPIONSHIP
26th March - Round One 3.00pm
8th April - Semi Final 1 3.00pm
22nd April - Semi Final 2 (Round One Winner plays here) 4.00pm
7th May BANK HOLIDAY Final - Croke Park - 4.00pm - Double Header with Ulster Hurling Final 2.00pm

MUNSTER HURLING CHAMPIONSHIP
1st April - Round One 3.00pm
15th April - Semi Final 1 3.00pm
22nd April - Semi Final 2 (Round One Winner plays here) 2.00pm
6th May Final - Semple Stadium - 4.00pm - Double Header with Minor Hurling Final 2.00pm

ULSTER HURLING CHAMPIONSHIP
26th March - Round One 1.30pm
8th April - Semi Final 1 1.30pm
22nd April - Semi Final 2 (Round One Winner plays here) 2.00pm
7th May BANK HOLIDAY Final - Croke Park - 2.00pm - Double Header with Leinster Hurling Final 4.00pm

ALL IRELAND SERIES

* Four groups of three teams
* Open draw

JUNE 3RD: Kilkenny V Cork; Galway V Wexford - Semple Stadium
JUNE 10TH: Antrim V Clare; Offaly V Limerick - O Moore Park
JUNE 17TH: Kilkenny V Waterford; Galway V Dublin - Semple Stadium
JUNE 24TH: Antrim V Laois; Offaly V Tipperary - Nowlan Park
JULY 1ST: Cork V Waterford; Wexford V Dublin - Semple Stadium
JULY 8TH: Clare V Laois; Limerick V Tipperary - Nowlan Park

Group A:
Kilkenny
Cork
Waterford

Group B:
Wexford
Galway
Dublin

Group C:
Laois
Clare
Antrim

Group
Tipperary
Offaly
Limerick

* The top two teams in each group qualify. An open draw is decided to see who plays who. Teams from the same group cannot meet in the quarter finals.

JULY 22ND ALL IRELAND QUARTER FINALS DOUBLE HEADER
Kilkenny V Wexford
Cork V Galway

JULY 29TH ALL IRELAND QUARTER FINALS DOUBLE HEADER
Laois V Tipperary
Clare V Offaly

AUGUST 12TH ALL IRELAND SEMI FINAL
Kilkenny V Cork

AUGUST 19TH ALL IRELAND SEMI FINAL
Laois V Clare

SEPTEMBER 3RD ALL IRELAND FINAL
Kilkenny V Laois

Thoughts anyone?

PS: Never mind the Laois V Kilkenny All Ireland - just an example given!!!

The Rooster

Pretty good idea - apart from bringing the Ulster final to Croke Park - absolutely no sense in that. Leave the curtain raiser to the Leinster final as the Leinster minor final.

I'd probably seed the group winners in the QF draw - have to give some incentive to winning the group.

Another option would be to have 3 groups of 4 with the top 2 in each group making the quarters. The 3rd place teams in each group playoff alongside the winners of the Christy Ring Cup for the last 2 places in the QFs.

AthAnRi

I take it the Provincal Championships and the All Ireland Series will be two seperate Competitions.

If so then Obviously Galway would need to enter the Leinster Championships and the Name changed to the Connaught/Leinster Championship Otherwise they would have no Games at all.

Agree with the Open Draw but maybe have a promotion/relegation element to it also.

Personally I like the format at the moment. It's certainly more benefical to Galway than the previous Ideas. However the only slight Gripe I have about it is that Galway still get treated like they have come through the Back door even though they haven't lost any games.

Jimoslimos

All-Ireland SHC: Disband the feckin provincial championships. What sort of 'achievement' is it for Kilkenny (e.g.) to beat two average teams and then be crowned Leinster champions. There's barely enough hurling teams to support a single competition nevermind seperate provincial championships. Open draw is the only way forward with as proposed an initial qualifier stage for the weaker counties.

NHL: If its proposed to have two Dublin teams in the league why not apply this to the stronger counties. Kilkenny, Cork, Tipp could be split into two teams which would give the weaker counties, Dublin, Laois, Antrim etc more of a chance of getting a win from these games. Mightn't make much difference to Kilkenny come All-Ireland time but would definitely provide a boost to the weaker counties if they managed any sort of result (win, draw, even a narrow defeat)