[PR] DART disruption : Howth to Howth Junction

Victor

http://www.iarnrodeireann.ie/news_centre/travel_alerts.asp?action=view&news_id=17

DART disruption : Howth to Howth Junction by Corporate Communications

Due to a level crossing fault, services between Howth and Howth Junction are currently suspended.

Customers travelling to and from Howth, Sutton and Bayside should avail of Dublin Bus services. Dublin Bus are honouring rail tickets. Customers travelling northbound should transfer from DART to Dublin Bus at Raheny to travel to Howth, Sutton and Bayside.

Iarnród Éireann is working to rectify the fault, and apologises for the inconvenience caused.

Chris_533976

Funny how Dublin Bus can suddenly honour rail tickets. Granted, it is a special situation, but just goes to prove what utter rubbish the complaints are about integrated ticketing.

MarkoP11

Its a long standing agreement, plently of tickets are valid on both

Line reopened shortly after 10:30

westtip

Slightly off subject but to do with Howth Junction is the Aer Dart Service running from their these days - it closed down when they were rennovating HJ station. Just wondered heard nothing about it since.

Dub13

westtip wrote:

Slightly off subject but to do with Howth Junction is the Aer Dart Service running from their these days - it closed down when they were rennovating HJ station. Just wondered heard nothing about it since.

No...IIRC Aer Dart is no more,the company folded.

darkskol

No, it has not been running again since it was stopped a long time ago now, well before howth junction was getting renovated. From what I heard the owners of Aerdart called it a day with the service as it was just not profitable enough.

westtip

darkskol wrote:

No, it has not been running again since it was stopped a long time ago now, well before howth junction was getting renovated. From what I heard the owners of Aerdart called it a day with the service as it was just not profitable enough.

Great pity this one had to rely on profit and was not incorporated into the great melting pot of public transport; it was an excellent way of keeping out of the city centre to get to the airport form any dart/arrow station. It reminded me of the excellent service from Manhattan to JFK, taking one of the public service trains and then a buslink to the airport form the nearest station to JFK (its name escapes me) but I remember back in the 80s it was about two dollars.

and before anyone jumps down my throat to say it was a private venture that should have wiped its face, no, it was good idea which the public sector transport providers should have seen and filled,the fact it hasn't worked in the private sector doesn't mean it isn't still a good idea, and if it doesn't wipe its face, so what - a lot of buses and trains lose money on their operations but they still provide essential transport services.

Victor

You can of course get the 230 from Malahide.

westtip

Victor wrote:

You can of course get the 230 from Malahide.

Victor, fine if you are coming from Malahide, my point about the aerdart is you could get on the suburban rail system anywhere and stay on it without having to change at Connolly for the Airbus, or if you were coming in on mainline train to Connolly (say from Sligo line or Wexford line), you just stayed on the rail system to Howth Junction and got the shuttle bus. It was simplicity itself and had real merit, I am sure for example anyone travelling from the south Dublin and Wicklow dart stations would have found the service very useful, maybe shoudl start a new thread on this subject again as this is off subject.

MarkoP11

AerDart failed miserably even when Irish Rail bank rolled them by handing over the full value of the combined DART/Maynooth line to Airport ticket, basic problem was Howth Junction its just a not a safe place to be combined with the fact airport passengers require a much superior service at they are a lot more comforatbale with the city centre bus option since if company A fail to turn up you get company B or get a taxi,

Dub13

Victor wrote:

You can of course get the 230 from Malahide.

Not on a Sunday....:eek:

westtip

MarkoP11 wrote:

AerDart failed miserably even when Irish Rail bank rolled them by handing over the full value of the combined DART/Maynooth line to Airport ticket, basic problem was Howth Junction its just a not a safe place to be combined with the fact airport passengers require a much superior service at they are a lot more comforatbale with the city centre bus option since if company A fail to turn up you get company B or get a taxi,

I agree Howth Junction leaves a bit to be desired - but these things can be addressed, I still believe it was an alternative worth using - and has worked well in other cities (I mentioned JFK in an earlier post), re Aerdart failing miserably, they failed financially, but they did provide a good service, the problem was the whole aerdart thing was seen as a private "wipe your face venture", if it was incorporated into the services of Dublin Bus or IE then it could have worked with subvention. You state airport passengers are a lot more comfortable with a city centre bus option - this is only your view, I don't share it. If you could get on the Dart at say Bray to Howth Junction and then get a simple shuttle bus is that not better than getting off at Platform 7 in Connolly, getting all the way from Connolly to the Bus Station and taking a bus from the city centre? Re taxis, if local taxis in north dublin had got their act together they could have had a taxi rank at Howth Junction offering a taxi ride to the airport to supplement the aer dart service. In addition, if mainline services ex Belfast halted for set down only at Howth Junction then it would have been a good service to the airport for those users. It just required a bit of imagination, committment from Dublin Bus and IE and some decent publicity and it would have worked.

Victor

westtip wrote:

I mentioned JFK in an earlier post

AFAIK it was Howard Beach, but that was at the edge of the JFK campus, not a 15 minute trip away.

http://www.mta.nyc.ny.us/nyct/maps/submap.htm

westtip

Victor wrote:

AFAIK it was Howard Beach, but that was at the edge of the JFK campus, not a 15 minute trip away.

http://www.mta.nyc.ny.us/nyct/maps/submap.htm

Well I can' remember the name of the station at JFK, but thanks for letting me know the shuttle bus would have taken about ten/fifteen minutes to the terminal you needed to get to - and the time would have been not much different than the HJ to Dublin Airport time. I know that when I was regularly in NY on business this was the fastest and cheapest way to the airport from downtown Manhattan (avoided the usual logjam exiting the city, at rush hour), in a similar the water bus across the harbour used to be the most efficient way to get to Boston airport - avoiding the tunnel mayhem they have their. In terms of time saving, how much time does it take to get off the Dart/Arrow and get down to the bus station and then onto an Airport Bus? especialy with luggage I just think this Aerdart thing kept travellers out of the city centre and was very convenient for anyone with access to the Suburban train services of Dart or Arrow. Billions will be spent on the metro to the Airport, and whilst Aerdart was not perfect, it was IMO a great idea - it just needed the public transport planners to commit to it on a service basis and not how much revenue can it generate basis.

subway

the aerdart was doomed as it was cheaper to get to the city centre directly for tourists.
combined with the fact that howth junction was a dump of a station while it was running and youve got absolutely no reason to use it.
the amount of bewildered looking tourists with a load of suitcases to get over them steps was not funny.
nowadays it is the epitomy of iarnord eireann staff attitude, with no staff visible except jack booted security.
i havent seen a ticket seller in howth junction or sutton in 2 weeks.
quite hilarious when the machine isnt working and your dart is due in 5 minutes.

sorry went on a little rant there,
basically for 4 people with bags it was cheaper to get a taxi to howth jucntion, so why would you bother.
once you got there you were faced with a dirt track in an industrial estate where half the builings were burnt down and travellers were camping at the bus stop. multiple stairs to climb depending on your eventual destination,
and a bloke in a 4 foot by 4 foot ticket office who had no intention of even telling you which platform you should go to.

westtip

subway wrote:

the aerdart was doomed as it was cheaper to get to the city centre directly for tourists.
combined with the fact that howth junction was a dump of a station while it was running and youve got absolutely no reason to use it.
the amount of bewildered looking tourists with a load of suitcases to get over them steps was not funny.
nowadays it is the epitomy of iarnord eireann staff attitude, with no staff visible except jack booted security.
i havent seen a ticket seller in howth junction or sutton in 2 weeks.
quite hilarious when the machine isnt working and your dart is due in 5 minutes.

sorry went on a little rant there,
basically for 4 people with bags it was cheaper to get a taxi to howth jucntion, so why would you bother.
once you got there you were faced with a dirt track in an industrial estate where half the builings were burnt down and travellers were camping at the bus stop. multiple stairs to climb depending on your eventual destination,
and a bloke in a 4 foot by 4 foot ticket office who had no intention of even telling you which platform you should go to.

subway I wouldn't disagree with some of what you are saying - the service was difficult without lifts at HJ, I presume they are in there now, and the station is undermanned, but not so much for tourists I still think it was great way of getting to the airport if you had access to the suburban rail system, and it was pretty cheap with a single fare ticket from any dart/arrow station It is a pity the idea has been killed off - our public transport management failed to realise it's potential as a seamless service from suburban rail to the airport.

subway

westtip,
from what i remember it was 4.50 and pricing was not integrated with the dart?
i may be wrong on the integration point but from what i remember the only people on it were airport staff who were given discounted rates.

there are lifts now and its one of the largest, most modern staions on the dart line,
but, there are still no staff on hand and the surroundings from the ind est side, where the aerdart pulled in, besides being landscaped are still as desolate as ever.
as has been mentioned if the service was brought back it would be better running from malahide or the new station at baldoyle.

in the meantime, im sure most commuters would appreciate if they decommissioned the special aerdart buslane on the n32 which is used by no bus but still happily taking up space.

MarkoP11

There was a DART + AerDart fare and it was advertised in the IE timetable and available all DART and Maynooth line stations

When times got hard, Irish Rail gave AerDart all the revenue from the ticket to see if it could keep them going until things got better

westtip

subway wrote:

westtip,
from what i remember it was 4.50 and pricing was not integrated with the dart?
i may be wrong on the integration point but from what i remember the only people on it were airport staff who were given discounted rates.

there are lifts now and its one of the largest, most modern staions on the dart line,
but, there are still no staff on hand and the surroundings from the ind est side, where the aerdart pulled in, besides being landscaped are still as desolate as ever.
as has been mentioned if the service was brought back it would be better running from malahide or the new station at baldoyle.

in the meantime, im sure most commuters would appreciate if they decommissioned the special aerdart buslane on the n32 which is used by no bus but still happily taking up space.

There was an integrated fare as P11 has pointed out - I think it starte off at £3 pre Euro days - a great deal if you were coming from say Greystones or Bray, saving car parking costs, keeping out of the city centre, off the M50, away from the Toll bridge. I used it a few times and everyone looked like bonafide passengers. I am glad to hear HJ has improved, and maybe you are right a service from Baldoyle or Malahide might be better. BTW how much is a cab from Malahide station to the Airport? As an idea I think it (Aerdart) was great, I just don't think it got enough publicity for people to catch on to the idea. Now HJ has been improved and with the problems getting to the Airport on the M50, if it started up now it might have more success.

MarkoP11

Howth Junction has improved beyond belief, all new

The fundamental issue here is confidence. If the bus fails to show in Howth Junction you are snookered, if it fails to show in the city centre you simply hail a cab or get the other bus thats the issue

Little known fact you can get a DART ticket to the airport valid on the 747/748 bus its €5.50

westtip

MarkoP11 wrote:

Howth Junction has improved beyond belief, all new

The fundamental issue here is confidence. If the bus fails to show in Howth Junction you are snookered, if it fails to show in the city centre you simply hail a cab or get the other bus thats the issue

Little known fact you can get a DART ticket to the airport valid on the 747/748 bus its €5.50

I think you are right - who wants to be abandonned at HJ when the check in desk will close in 30 minutes. Re the integrated ticket - That truly is a little known fact - probably a case of such a good deal they don't want anyone to know about it. Can you purchase such a ticket from any dart station - and can you purchase on the return journey - ie get on the bus at Dublin Airport and ask for a through ticket to any dart station.

MarkoP11

All I know is a single ticket exists and it is €5.50, you should be able to buy it in advance from a Dublin Bus ticket agent, it should be issuable at a DART station, I said should be, it depends on you finding someone who knows how to properly use the ticket issuing machine. Given the way the ticket works I don't think a return is available

Its possible to get a bus only return for €9 again check with Dublin Bus ticket agent

There is of course the DART in nightlink home ticket, its still in the system somewhere...........

subway

MarkoP11 wrote:

There is of course the DART in nightlink home ticket, its still in the system somewhere...........

now thats interesting!!
can this be bought thorugh the vending machine?

do you know how to use a dart ticket machine so i could tell the chap how to sell me one of those tickets?