New Dell 5100

Den_M

I'm about to buy a new pc and got this quote from dell.ie
The machine is

2.6ghz intel pentium d 805 dualcore (533mhz fsb, 2mb cache)
1gb ddr2 ram
160gb 7200rpm hd
19inch flat screen monitor
256mb ati radeon x600 vid card
16 speed dvd+-rw

comes with the usual basic keyboard, mouse
I've specified no speakers, antivirus sw, floppy drive or modem and the most basic collect + service deal

price 740euro inc vat and delivery

Does this seem reasonable? i saw another thread with a similar machine and price and it was deemed a bit of a rip off. But this seems pretty good to me.
The vid card doesnt need to be that great, i just want to be able to play quake4, doom3, f.e.a.r. etc - not new games.

Den_M

Someone please respond, there's two deals on this that end on Wednesday!

TempestSabre

Its ok, not amazing since its not that fast a PC. If its not for games you could have bought a machine with a lesser spec. If it is for games you should get a better cpu and gfx. If that the best your budget can get you and you know its a compromise then its ok.

Den_M

Yeah I am on a bit of a budget atm, isn't a dualcore processor pretty nippy though? I intend on adding ram and maybe a new graphics card in the future when I've got the money but just want something to do for now and upgradable in the future. My last pc had rdram and used the IDE standard.

Would a dualcore 2.6 outperform a 3.4p4?

SickBoy

Den_M wrote:

Yeah I am on a bit of a budget atm, isn't a dualcore processor pretty nippy though? I intend on adding ram and maybe a new graphics card in the future when I've got the money but just want something to do for now and upgradable in the future. My last pc had rdram and used the IDE standard.

Would a dualcore 2.6 outperform a 3.4p4?

I think your getting mixed up with the Pentium D dual core and the Core2Duo dual core CPUs. While the Core2Duo would toast the 3.4P4 you're not going to get anywhere near the performance of a 3.4 in games with a Pentium D 805.
As far as upgradability goes, you can certinally upgrade the RAM and GFX at a later date but the upgrade path to a Core2Duo does not exist for you

Den_M

Thanks for pointing that out, I had no idea.

For another 30 quid I can have this processor :

Intel® Pentium® D 915 Dual Core Processor (2.80GHz, 800MHz fsb, 2x2MB cache)

Would that make much of a difference?

For less than 800quid you can't expect that much though I guess..

TempestSabre

In games a dualcore (not the new dualcore2) is slower in games than a single core which has a higher speed. In other tasks like encoding, or multitasking the dualcore is still slower but the system will be more responsive and usuable. Dualcores/Dual CPU's are only faster in a small amount of tasks. For most tasks a faster CPU either by design and/or clock speed will be faster.

Dualcore2 is a faster by design regardless that its also dualcore.

If you really want something upgradable in the future I would suggest building your own PC with a motherboard that can take a dualcore2 but for now stick a dualcore into it and overclock it.

http://forums.overclockers.co.uk/showthread.php?t=17548523
http://forums.overclockers.co.uk/showthread.php?t=17615863

Or you can get AMD system based around a board like the Asrock 939SLI32-eSATA2 (Socket 939 & Upgradable to AM2) and stick a cheap single core amd like a 4000+ into it and do the same thing.

Or get the best you can now, (as you have) and just sell it and get another cheap but better dell when the time comes. Maybe a better GFX card will be all you need, or you can pick up a faster dualcore (not the new dualcore2) like a 3.4 when the funds allow.

A lot of dualcore1 boards will not be compatible with dualcore2. Some with have bios updates, but thats unlikely on Dell machines. Theres different power requirements.

TempestSabre

Den_M wrote:

Thanks for pointing that out, I had no idea.

For another 30 quid I can have this processor :

Intel® Pentium® D 915 Dual Core Processor (2.80GHz, 800MHz fsb, 2x2MB cache)

Would that make much of a difference?

For less than 800quid you can't expect that much though I guess..

Still dual core 1 and would 200mhz make that much of a difference? Probably a better gfx would be more worthwhile IMO. Stick to you budget though, don't get carried away.

Den_M

Yeah I knew it was just a better version of the same cpu, but I thought since I'm gonna have to stick with the same cpu in this machine I might as well get the best one available on the website. I'd hate to look back and regret not spending another 40 quid when I should have.

As far as gaming goes I mostly just wanna play games from the last few years that I bought for my older machine. A lot of them didnt run that well.

Thanks for the advice so far fellas

TempestSabre

I think that gfx card is the main weak point. Budget to replace that as soon as possble.

Anti

You want to play fear and quake 4 on a x600, thats just not gonna happen. It will play it, with all the details on medium/low with a 1024*768 resolution. For that price you can build your own pc to a much higher spec. but you will not be able to have a 19" monitor

Den_M

Yep the monitor is definetly attracting me to this deal! Should be a luxury after using my 15inch crt for the last few years.
I intend replacing the video card soon though, a friend of mine is upgrading his soon (he has some high end nvidia card, not sure which) and I'll buy his old one. I'll put the x600 in my old machine.

TempestSabre

1280x1024 will need quite a better gfx card than a 1024x768. Depends on the game though. Older games might be fine. Beware its not 4:3 and some games (very few now) don't like 5:4 aspects.

zod

would this
and this

be better ?

SeanW

Dells are waaaaay more trouble than they're worth. If I were you I'd go for a Komplett custom build.

Basically what you can do is pick the parts and have Komplett build the PC for you. Much more customised than Dell, gives you some of the flexibility of a home build without the actual home building bit.

Ever since Intel Core 2 Duo (Conroe) came out, AMD kit has been going really cheap. This might be of interest to you because you need performance on a budget so Conroe is probably out of the question. Core2Duo is Intel's only advantage over AMD.

Have a look at this:.

Then downgrade the case to an APlus Qubic, change the powersupply to anything other than NorthQ and a slightly higher wattage, and tailor all the other components to your own personal requirements of features and/or performance versus price.

irlrobins

SeanW wrote:

Dells are waaaaay more trouble than they're worth.

As soon as I saw the thread title I thought to myself "How long before SeanW comes dell bashing" :rolleyes: Guess I have my answer

TempestSabre

SeanW wrote:

Dells are waaaaay more trouble than they're worth. If I were you I'd go for a Komplett custom build.....

I've never had any more problems with Dells than another brand or home builts myself. I dunno why you'd bother to get Komplett to build it for you. Just buy the cheapest parts from all over and put them together yourself. Needs a little TLC to do it but its not difficult. Of course if don't want to do that just buy the Dell, its cheaper and less hassle.

That komplett spec doesn't include a monitor and still has a half assed gfx card. Whats the point of that? You'd be better to buy the Dell in the original offer and stick a better gfx card in it. If you want a balanced machine for gaming.

Den_M

TempestSabre wrote:

That komplett spec doesn't include a monitor and still has a half assed gfx card. Whats the point of that? You'd be better to buy the Dell in the original offer and stick a better gfx card in it. If you want a balanced machine for gaming.

This is my thinking at the moment. Thanks for link seanw, i've been looking in that section of komplett for a while now but haven't been able to get similar specs to that dell and a 19inch monitor for near the same price.

Den_M

For a grand I can get this :

Intel® Viiv™ technology - Intel® Pentium® D 945 DualCore(3.40GHz,800MHz,2x2MBcache)
1024MB Dual Channel DDR2 533MHz [2x512] Memory
320GB (7200rpm) Serial ATA/100 Hard Drive with 16MB DataBurst™ cache
16x max. DVD+/-RW Drive
256MB nVidia™ GeForce™ 7300LE Turbocache graphics card
Dell™ 19" Value Flat Panel (E196FP)
Integrated Sound Blaster® Audigy™ ADVANCED HD software
Dell™ A225 Stereo Speakers

How much better is the cpu and video card?

lonnbeimnech

Den_M wrote:

Intel® Viiv™ technology - Intel® Pentium® D 945 DualCore(3.40GHz,800MHz,2x2MBcache)
256MB nVidia™ GeForce™ 7300LE Turbocache graphics card

How much better is the cpu and video card?

I could urge you more towards an upgrade of the processor to a Core 2 Duo and regarding the GFX the LE stands for light edition. Out with the old and in with the new.

Den_M

Nicely said! But every machine on dells site with the new dualcore processor is well over a grand. I guess with my budget it's either build a machine myself with a future proof mobo or buy the machine I'm looking at and shoot myself in the foot upradability-wise?

lonnbeimnech

upradawhatwhat? Can you afford to save for a few more weeks and self build a really nice one? Personally I've been saving for a few months and won't have all the money for another month or two yet for my rig. Short term pain - long term gain friend o' mine!

TempestSabre

Den_M wrote:

Nicely said! But every machine on dells site with the new dualcore processor is well over a grand. I guess with my budget it's either build a machine myself with a future proof mobo or buy the machine I'm looking at and shoot myself in the foot upradability-wise?

You need to take a deep breath and then spend the next week doing some research on which gfx are worth getting, and which are a good balance between price and performance. I sugest you do this based on reviews that use the same games as you, and see what performance they get.

Personally I have a Dell thats about 1.5yrs old, 3Ghz, 1GB ram, came with no gfx, (I bought it off the outlet very cheap). and about a year ago I stuck a 6800GS in it and it plays most stuff quite well at 1280x1024. Most games these days really need a decent gfx first. The CPU is less important. I usually to build my own machines, but the Dell was a bargain and I was too busy to build my own.

The http://forums.overclockers.co.uk/ forums are great for learning about different hardware, and they generally know whats worth buying what isn't. But don't rely on one site, shop around and see whats hot and whats not.


http://www.simhq.com/_technology/technology.html#reviews
http://www.anandtech.com/default.aspx
http://www.simhq.com/_technology/technology_060a.html
http://www.simhq.com/_technology2/technology_081a.html
http://www.simhq.com/_technology/technology_063a.html
http://www.simhq.com/_technology/technology_064a.html
http://www.simhq.com/_technology/technology_055a.html
http://www.simhq.com/_technology2/technology_090a.html

Den_M

lonnbeimnech wrote:

upradawhatwhat? !

Upgrad-ability! Coined words and typos are a bad combination!

lonnbeimnech wrote:

Can you afford to save for a few more weeks and self build a really nice one?

In all honesty I don't think I could build my own machine. I'd love to be able to; there's many on this section of boards that have obviously pieced their own machine together and get better performance and satisfaction this way, but basic RAM/card installation is where I'd draw the line.

At the moment I'm close to buying this :

Intel® Pentium® D 945 Dual Core Processor (3.40GHz, 800MHz fsb, 2x2MB cache)
2048MB Dual Channel DDR2 533MHz [2x1024] Memory
320GB (7200rpm) Serial ATA/100 Hard Drive with 16MB DataBurst™ cache
16x max. DVD+/-RW Drive
256MB ATI Radeon® X600 HyperMemory graphics card
Dell™ 19" Value Flat Panel (E196FP)
Media Card reader

1000euro for that machine

and then replacing the video card a few months later with a 256 MB PCI-Express nVidia T GeForce 7900 GS. (150euro roughly?) Would my psu be able for this card though? It doesn't say what watt it is on the site. Probably just the standard dell psu.

TempestSabre

I think that for you, thats probably a better route. Though if you want a machine built, I'd do it for you. I doubt theres a problem with the PSU because you can get high end cards in that PC from Dell. Best place for Dell info and upgrading info is on DellTalk.

http://delltalk.us.dell.com/

Den_M

TempestSabre wrote:

Though if you want a machine built, I'd do it for you.

Thanks but all the worrying I've done on dells website for the last few days must have some outcome!

TempestSabre wrote:

I doubt theres a problem with the PSU because you can get high end cards in that PC from Dell.

Yep this is true, actually that card nvidia card is already in some of the higher end dell machines, I forgot

lonnbeimnech

I hope it all works out for you. Do let us know how you find the machine when you've had it for a few days.

Den_M

lonnbeimnech wrote:

I hope it all works out for you. Do let us know how you find the machine when you've had it for a few days.

Yep I definetly will, thanks for the advice fellas, much appreciated.