Where can i buy model railway like the display in Smiths in Dublin city near Maplin

Access

I saw a cased display model railway for hornby in smiths toys near maplin in the city.

Does anyone have any info on where fully made set like this can be bought without having to fork out for individual items and doing it yourself?

coolwings

I have not seen the layout you speak of. Also you give no indication as to your experience, the space (size of the layout, or financial budget. So it is difficult to be very specific in reply. However here are answers to some of the points you raise....

Did it include landscaping with fine details - roads, people, houses, train stations and crossings, etc?
If the answer is "yes" - then you will have to either :
A pay a modeller to do it for you
or
B buy one at auction from a modeller getting out of the hobby (hardly ever happens) or who has died.

The labour value for such items is enormous, seeing as they have had hundreds of hours to make and fine tune. I saw one sell a couple of years ago for 4000 sterling, an impressive model indeed.

If on the other hand you were looking at an "advanced boxed set" which had been assembled, and with "basic landscaping" (Hornby tend to use a mat type prefabricated topography layout) then such a model would have cost €500 - €800 . The building time would be a fraction of a masterwork layout, and you would have it for one to two thousand euro.
If it is a small layout of a boxed set then it might be just €500 - 1000.

But the point of modelling is that we make our own ..... would this be intended to be your first train layout? The greater proportion of the pleasure and pride in it comes from the fact that we did it. Not someone else. Without that - it is just "interesting for a while".

If you are still focused on a pre-made one, there are professional modellers who build to arrangement. The best model shops will have one or several builders "on their books". The toy shops (like the one you mention) will not have this service - just the items for sale.

I suggest you make a few calls to the larger Dublin based model and hobby shops and ask in person. Green Hobby & Model, The Model Centre Capel St, Marks Models are the places to begin.

Access

Excellent reply! thanks for all the info.

Ed.

Its a Hornby TrakMat layout

Avoid Irish retailers,go into Easons,buy a copy of Model Rail or Railway Modeller and source everything from the UK as it will work out a lot cheaper

billyblanks

Ed. wrote:

Its a Hornby TrakMat layout

Avoid Irish retailers,go into Easons,buy a copy of Model Rail or Railway Modeller and source everything from the UK as it will work out a lot cheaper

Only noticed this thread now, so sorry for the late reply.

Hang on there.....as an Irish retailer I would like to say our Hornby prices are based on the English RRP not a standard mark up.....there may be a slight difference due to VAT but that is all!! I would at least ask the Irish retailers for a price....If they seem expensive say it to them! (us)

Gunner69

Sorry,just noticed this thread now. A chap has set up a model rail shop in Crookstown, Balytore, Co. kildare. He is located behind the Texaco on the N 9 at Crookstown. Nice shop with alot of stock, but the best thing for you is that he specialises in building layouts for sale. I havent a number for him, but well worth a visit, he has the solution for you.

zt-OctaviaN

As a Kid I was into model railways its now all taken down from the 2 8x4 foot boards I had and is boxed in the attic!! ah well guess I lost interest a little amongst nearly electricuting meself a few times! and we need the spare room in the house soo....

Anyway yup Green hill and Marks models they were based on 14 Dolier st last time i remember??

Good luck
Nick

Gunner69

ZT, what was your layout based on, and what condition is it in,and are you interested in selling. ??

zt-OctaviaN

It was 'OO' gauge I think I had 3 or 4 locos one was intercity that was the first Kit then built on from there the other locos was a small good type steam engine....ah smokey Joe!! that was it and there was 1 or 2 other I cant remember long time ago :rolleyes:

The layout also included 2 maybe three transformers which would suggest 3 different layouts.

There was basically an oval on one of the boards with a good yard inlet a station a viduct I made from matches

The other board had a figure 8 going over a brick based viduct on tressels and a station or two? a church 5million grain of wheat bulbs!
I annoyed the pants off of a local electrical shop ordering Radionics bits!

Sell it? hmm I wouldnt mind buying a Serpent 960!!
let me think ill reply here again or PM ya! Its all boxed at the mo as I said I dunno how much track there is but if i decide to sell Ill do a Qty count on it all.
Have you already got a layout?

Nick

Ed.

billyblanks wrote:

Only noticed this thread now, so sorry for the late reply.

Hang on there.....as an Irish retailer I would like to say our Hornby prices are based on the English RRP not a standard mark up.....there may be a slight difference due to VAT but that is all!! I would at least ask the Irish retailers for a price....If they seem expensive say it to them! (us)

Ireland is a rip off for modellers,end of,as there is not enough retailers to provide competition for each other and lower prices.

The rip off republic is everywhere,blame the delightful government

coolwings

Ed. wrote:

Ireland is a rip off for modellers,end of,as there is not enough retailers to provide competition for each other and lower prices.

The rip off republic is everywhere,blame the delightful government

You are blackening everyone with the same dirty criticism.

There is much in what you said....
I agree that much stuff (especially stuff made elsewhere) is dearer in Ireland that in the places it's made.
I agree that many greedy operators overcharge here. (but I suggest those types do that elsewhere too ! )
I agree that model rail in particular has a small following in Ireland, and that this affects the price for obvious quantity discount reasons.

But as regards competition ....
The better Irish model suppliers have been competing with the UK for years.
Irish model suppliers compete with all of Europe nowadays.
Irish model suppliers also compete with Ebay where the price is often manipulated artificially low, and freight for a tiny item can be 20 to 40 dollars added on later.
Surely that is competition.

Also - the Irish model shop I have most connections with manages to have a thriving mail order business to modellers in UK, Germany, USA, Canada, etc.
So their prices on stuff must be competitive on a world scale.

Other model shops I have dealings with are smaller in size, but, given the tiny size of their market, I have always thought they were extremely good, in the face of tough WORLD competition, and in the face of vitriolic criticism from know it all modellers that place no value on the expert advice these shops hand out free every day. Unwarranted and undeserved criticism in my humble opinion.

For example, due to the ridiculous high Irish VAT tax rate we have here, (illegal under EU law), our Irish model shops have to sell goods at about half the margin, that shops elsewhere can sell the same goods for. They actually do it, because skinflint Irish modeller begrudger types would blacken their name if they tried to pass the extra VAT on, as it is intended they do by our governments. So these shops must exist on a much lower income than similar shops in other countries. Small wonder Irish model shops go out of business with such regularity.

Also - what about goods manufactured in Ireland, and valued the world over.
Are they all ripoff too?
I'll just start the list: Guinness, Intel computer chips, beef, fish, dairy produce, Riverdance, ........

I sympathise with you that there are not more railway modellers here, to sustain more better railway shops. I really do.
But is it possible that Irish railway modellers (who are notorious for buying from UK) have exactly the quality and number of shops that their own business warrants and sustains?

And from a model rail perspective:
What about the service provided by a prominent Cork based rail model shop? They have coordinated and researched the production of scale models of Irish trains over the decades. We have these Irish scale trains available only as a result of their committment. This is a specialist train supplier, right here in Ireland, who definitely do NOT deserve your sweeping criticism. (I have no connection with the man, but he does not deserve this unwarranted bad PR IMHO)

billyblanks

Ed. wrote:

Ireland is a rip off for modellers,end of,as there is not enough retailers to provide competition for each other and lower prices.

The rip off republic is everywhere,blame the delightful government

load of Bo**ox....

Call into me any day and I will go through any range in the shop, incl Hornby, and we will compare prices on the internet.

coolwings covered everything else......


Out of curosity what part of the country are you based in?

Ed.

billyblanks wrote:

load of Bo**ox....

Call into me any day and I will go through any range in the shop, incl Hornby, and we will compare prices on the internet.

coolwings covered everything else......

Why bother when I can look on a pc....... I refuse to buy most things from Irish retailers,end of,you can moan and bitch and promote yourselves all you want but you wont change my mind Im afraid,and it doenst just stand for models either,look at stuff like gilette mach 3 blades on ebay for example

Out of curosity what part of the country are you based in?

Think about it long and hard and then use your intelligence,its in my profile

You still have not said what shop you represent though,or are you afraid to scare off customers??

coolwings

Ed. wrote:

....Think about it long and hard and then use your intelligence,...

Hey killer .... relax. We like to enjoy our hobby here ... not have stress attacks about it.

Hmmm - don't like model shops, don't like the government (all governments or just this one?) ....don't like rip-off Ireland. Wow- you must have had a real bad experience ........

Did you ever consider moving to the UK? (Just think of the money you'd save..... )

Considered living in non-ripoff Ireland? It's all around us...
We survive there, we even enjoy ourselves from time to time.

Nothing in life is free. Especially quality of life.
Stuff already delivered to an island on the western seaboard of Europe is bound to cost more than the same stuff sitting 1000km away on continental mainland. Or the same stuff sitting on the far side of planet Earth 2500km away outside a factory in backwoods China. It's obvious.

I have worked in many places and I accept it costs more to live here. However, I don't have to get cross about it because I accept that Ireland offers other benefits to offset against a higher cost of living.

So I (and 5 million other Irish) pay the cost and get on with enjoying the benefits I (we) have paid for.

Like my kids not having to go through metal detectors when they arrive at school.

Like having a chat with the folks in a model shop. I call into every model shop I go past, anywhere, have a chat with the experts, and browse around at the nice stuff.

Like being able to fly models in a field 6km from Dublin city. In Berlin I would have to drive 200km to find a place for glowfuel, or 100 km for a place to fly electric - assuming that club had vacancies.

Some of us like it here.

billyblanks

Ed. wrote:

Why bother when I can look on a pc....... I refuse to buy most things from Irish retailers,end of,you can moan and bitch and promote yourselves all you want but you wont change my mind Im afraid,and it doenst just stand for models either,look at stuff like gilette mach 3 blades on ebay for example




Think about it long and hard and then use your intelligence,its in my profile

You still have not said what shop you represent though,or are you afraid to scare off customers??

There are other people on this forum who run/work in model shops so I think it would be unfair for me to promote mine.....Ill pm it to you.

I really don't understand what mach 3 blades have to do with pricing in model shops in Ireland? I could pick out items which are cheaper in Ireland than other parts of Europe, so that is a futile argument.

My problem is that you tarnish every model shop with the same brush which is unfair. As I said before our prices are based on the English rrp with a slight difference for VAT. I know for a fact on some items we are cheaper than a lot of European retailers...and some we are not, but we are not way overpriced on any ranges.


can you even tell me what products you are talking about? Hornby/Corgi/minichamps??

VISTA MAR

Access wrote:

I saw a cased display model railway for hornby in smiths toys near maplin in the city.

Does anyone have any info on where fully made set like this can be bought without having to fork out for individual items and doing it yourself?

Probably to late when you see this, but just came across the attached on Ebay this evening:

http://cgi.ebay.ie/hornby-oo-gauge-train-set-thomas-loco-100ft-of-track_W0QQitemZ150045588695QQihZ005QQcategoryZ112505QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

When I last looked it was about €300 but located in UK. still a great\ deal.

On the other argument, the biggest problem I hae is finding a decent model shop outside of the main cities. To be honest it is just easier for me to order of the internet. In saying that I accept I probably end up paying more for things wwhen postage is added.

Billy, do you do mail order from your shop? Can you PM me the details? Do you know are Model Irish Railways still operational? I believe they do kits of CIE loco's. I'm really interested in one of these. Any pre build/Lima ones tend to sell for €100's on EBay(not the reason I am looking:D ). How much you chargin for the new Bachmann CIE coaches?

Ed.

VISTA MAR wrote:

Do you know are Model Irish Railways still operational? I believe they do kits of CIE loco's. I'm really interested in one of these. Any pre build/Lima ones tend to sell for €100's on EBay(not the reason I am looking:D ). How much you chargin for the new Bachmann CIE coaches?

MIR are still in business,which kit are you looking for?? There should be a guy selling them at the exhibition in Clontarf next weekend - www.modelrailways.ie

Lima 201's are still about and Bachmann will do a 141/181 at some point,commissioned by the same company that did the Bachmann mk2's

Ed.

Ive sat down and worked out a few prices on things and below is an example

Hornby Class 60 - LoadHaul



UK selling price = £69 = €100 (average price from 6 UK retailers)
Irish selling price = €150 = £100 (from a Dublin model shop)


Irish VAT = 21% - €31.50 on Irish price - €118.50 = £79.40
UK VAT = 17.5% - £12 on UK price = £57 = €84

Without VAT
UK - £57 - €84
Ireland €118.50 - £79.40

Minus shops cut on this,also known as profit (average figure)-
£57 - £15 = £42 = €62

€118.50 - €25 - €93.50 = £62

So at the end of the day there is a €30 difference in prices,still cheaper in the UK

Result its still cheaper to import from the UK on the majority of items

coolwings

Ed. wrote:

......still cheaper in the UK.....

Let me see.
You are saying it's cheaper to buy a UK product in the UK, than another country.
Isn't that a bit obvious?

I expect Japanese made goods are cheaper in Japan too!
Maybe Scotch whiskey is cheaper in Scotland!
(Thinks: I wonder if tea is cheaper in India....? Dammit - Tescos have ripped me off on my tea-break!)

But we live in Ireland.

And all that stuff abroad has to be mailed to here. And all backup will have long distance tel calls atttached, along with more postage, time delays for shipping, risk of breakage in shipping, and so on.

Try adding phone, freight, occasional return freigh / phone costs of a "wrong-un", buying 10 of a spare part when you only need 2, and other hassle costs into your equation.

Also: Who do you go to for technical advice? Is that another long distance call to UK ? There is a value on convenience that you are pretending does not exist.
This value varies from person to person depending on time available, money available, and expertise not present but needed to "make it go right"
As a presumed expert you need little backup I guess, but you advise beginners to proceed as if they will not make a mistake?

Did you get help from the local hobby shop (Marks?) when you were starting off? Was their advise so worthless?

IMHO It is bad advise to give a newcomer, who still has to learn the tricks of modelling to buy technically complex equipment from far away locations . Usually they buy the wrong stuff, and spend far more than necessary.

This very week I spoke to a modeller (buying from UK and USA) who claimed to have spend over 4000 euros on model plane equipment, and he still can't fly. Any Dublin shop would have gotten him flying, the model plane and equipment, free lessons, several suggested locations of places to fly from, the lot - all the advise he needs, and still charge 3500 less.

Ed.

I never said you had to start buying stuff from overseas retailers.....

Im sticking to my guns on this 1,doesnt matter what you say, if its cheaper elsewhere and you possess the necessary knowledge then go buy elsewhere. Everyone makes mistakes but not everyone learns from them it would seem. I agree with you regarding convienience but if you know what you are buying this is not a problem. What if you are into detailing and repainting your models?? Then everything must be sourced overseas as a few tins of humbrol will not suffice. I think your playing on the theory that people are scared of mailorder as they will be shafted,thats why credit cards and payment protection are about

Why is everyone here freely saying buy R/C car stuff from Towermodels.com and not being slated

BTW most Hornby stuff is made in China now

coolwings

Ed. wrote:

I never said you had to start buying stuff from overseas retailers.....

Sorta what I meant.

Ed. wrote:

if its cheaper elsewhere and you possess the necessary knowledge then go buy elsewhere.

Yes. That is undoubtedly what many modellers of long sytanding do.

Ed. wrote:

Everyone makes mistakes but not everyone learns from them it would seem.

Beginners especially.

Ed. wrote:

but if you know what you are buying this is not a problem. What if you are into detailing and repainting your models?? Then everything must be sourced overseas as a few tins of humbrol will not suffice.

The more you know the less help you need. Also I would agree that when you get into what I might call "high fidelity scale models" that a specialist supplier becomes more interesting, esp if they are into your particular specialty.
But that can be a catastrophe for someone getting into modelling at first.
What they need is to have it simplified, not made more complicated. It's too complicated already (for beginners).

Ed. wrote:

.. people are scared of mailorder as they will be shafted,thats why credit cards and payment protection are about

No - I wasn't suggesting that at all. But you're right there, it is a real factor, because with greater distance goes less familiarity with the supplier, and also goes greater risk - risk of breakage in transit, risk of the parcel being stolen, risk of a stoppage and charge by customs.
What I was getting onto is that the farther the seller is, in distance, the less he has to worry about getting a bad name for selling beginners unsuitable stuff. Whereas the local hobby shop would be wiped out if the word got round that they were willing to sell any old crud. So my point is the nearer seller has more loyalty to the consumer, you and me, and (for example) the guy in China couldn't give a rats arse about you once he has your money.

Ed. wrote:

Why is everyone here freely saying buy R/C car stuff from Towermodels.com and not being slated

Not quite as simple as that. What they are saying is that they get this or that from eg Tower or elsewhere, but they are not (in my opinion) saying that every single item is cheaper in one particular country (UK) , and that all local sellers are bad, and all overseas sellers are better. You implied this, though you didn't say it in those words, that was the meaning that came across, and I disagree with.
You see most modellers are the same as ordinary shoppers, they get this thing here, that thing there, and go to another place for another thing. I don't personally, like Tescos for example, but I acknowledge they have a place for certain types of stuff.
Many modellers acknowledge the importance of the local hobby shop for many items for sourcing model fuel and spare parts for example.
They also know that if all beginners buy elsewhere the local shop wil close and their own needs become more difficult to serve.
Also I have noticed many "internet" modellers send their friends to the LHS, so their friend can get local advice, and the "experienced pal" doesn't have to bother with effort or the time to show the newbie how to do it. It is dual standards, but it happens a lot.
The very hard boiled internet buyers also turn up in the LHS after they made a really serious buying error on the internet - in the hope of a "magic wand" solution, or even more silly still, the hope the local shop will buy a really strange unwanted item from them for cash!

Ed. wrote:

BTW most Hornby stuff is made in China now

It's China eh? - not surprising really. Has the quality held up? Personally I prefer Eastern European manufactured goods (where they are technically complex) myself. Better quality of manufacturing. Not as low cost as China, but generally far more reliable. IMHO As part of my job I spend a lot of time on different hobby shops, and one in particular has gone down the european gear route a lot, which I consider a step forward.
I have heard much whinging about why the cheap (far eastern) one failed earlier than the modeller expected, I have also heard the reply "what do you expect for that price", and I myself use very little Chinese stuff in my own models. I feel my own models are much too valuable (measured in both cost & build time) to risk them with beginner quality stuff in the control system.
If the German quality stuff costs me a bit more then I will save a bit longer, and still get it. My models go on and on.
Vorsprung durch technik !

billyblanks

VISTA MAR wrote:

Probably to late when you see this, but just came across the attached on Ebay this evening:

http://cgi.ebay.ie/hornby-oo-gauge-train-set-thomas-loco-100ft-of-track_W0QQitemZ150045588695QQihZ005QQcategoryZ112505QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

When I last looked it was about €300 but located in UK. still a great\ deal.

On the other argument, the biggest problem I hae is finding a decent model shop outside of the main cities. To be honest it is just easier for me to order of the internet. In saying that I accept I probably end up paying more for things wwhen postage is added.

Billy, do you do mail order from your shop? Can you PM me the details? Do you know are Model Irish Railways still operational? I believe they do kits of CIE loco's. I'm really interested in one of these. Any pre build/Lima ones tend to sell for €100's on EBay(not the reason I am looking:D ). How much you chargin for the new Bachmann CIE coaches?

Hi,

Sorry only read this now....yep we do mail order. Ill pm you the rest of the details.