Anyone just out of College and...

Nalz

got no job?

Its a killer...I live 60 miles or so from Dublin, have a Bsc in Software Engineering with 2nd class honours and ther is no decent jobs around. I've signed up online with Computerjobs.ie, Fás, Eden Recruitement, Monster and Irishjobs.ie but all I get (and no offence to anyone when I say this) is 1st or 2nd level support jobs (on the phone all day changing passwords,lookin after network etc) that pay feck all in City Centre.

For all the computer related ppl here Ive fairly good knowledge of C/C++ and VB, with some knowledge in Assembly, Perl, Java, Pascal and Delphi. Even a testing job would do me! only 3 people have got a job from my class (of 15) and one of those was in Australia!

I'm not even on the dole (yet....)

drvin me mad!

ST*

Work forum

I've found in the past that having a very good rapport with specific people within agencies that you will see better results. Also, keep on their case and follow up constantly - but nicely.

Registering with agencies doesn't mean you can sit back and wait for the job offers to come flowing in.

Terry

note to self. do not try for a software engineering degree.

InFront

I know the feeling. Im looking in a different area but am finding jobs pretty hard to come by. Then again, I am a recent college dropout with almost no experience in the workplace unless you count one summer job, Im not expecting employers to be lining up outside my house.

With all the hype about the sustained economy boom and availability of employement, Im not seeing much of it tbh.

Agamemnon

Don't go near recruitment agencies, they rarely have anything to offer graduates. They'll try to dump you in tech support/call centre hell. Apply directly to large companies that have graduate programs and you'll get a job eventually. It might take a few months but you'll be better off. If you're living near Dublin, try IBM.

Dr Galen

i've worked in IT recruitment for a good while before becoming what i am today and i have to agree, your best bet is to go direct to the companies.

At this time of year there is a splurge of grads coming out of college so companies like IBM, Oracle etc etc don't need to waste the money paying a recruiter to find them people to fill entry level grad positions, they just take what they have on file.

Every now and again a job will come in alright that you cold fill with a recent grad but thats the exception rather than the rule. Following up with the agencies is also very important. Every couple of days give a ring or an email in, keps you in the frnt of the recruiters mind. To give an example, I used to easily get 20 - 30 CV's sent in every night to me, so you can imagine how quickly you will be forgotten at that rate.

niggle

Hey Trilla,

You have to start somewhere, if the company that is offering the support work is good take it, give yourself a year, be looking for opportunities in the company for you to move to. You have to remember that your degree only shows the employer that you have the ability to learn, they will still have to train you when you get in.

Need to ask yourself - do you have any industrial experience.....?

I left college 5 years ago with a Comp Sci degree, dossed for a year, then took a support job, wanted to get into programming like yourself, got my foot in the door, but I have since moved into the business side as there are more opportunities there. Dont regret my choice

Long and the short of it is........ without years of experience its a lot harder to get a programming job. GET YOUR FOOT IN THE DOOR, and take it from there? you never know whats around the cornor

Also a good book is "What colour is your parachute" dont make it your bible but it might give you an idea or two

Anyway that was my take on the situation
N

Heyes

Heya trilla, know the feeling its not as easy as some may think when you leave college to go and actually get the job. It took me six months to get a job after leaving college, if you think about it this way most places arent hiring in july / august as there is a lot of people going on holidays during those months, then the hiring begins, keep at it, dont get demoralised, the job you want will come around soon. my advice, really hit it hard at the end of august.

good luck

Nalz

Thanks for all the replies, its so long since I wrote a line of code! Ive forgotten everything! I understand the whole "get your foot in the door concept", but its companies that deal with software (create,test) I want to work for...not support for major "non-software development" companies.

Ah Im hopeful still, just about.

Slippers

Trilla wrote:

Anyone just out of College and got no job?

That's the situation I'm in alright. I did a BSc in statistics. I just started a thread about it.

Madge

Trilla wrote:

got no job?

Its a killer...I live 60 miles or so from Dublin, have a Bsc in Software Engineering with 2nd class honours and ther is no decent jobs around. I've signed up online with Computerjobs.ie, Fás, Eden Recruitement, Monster and Irishjobs.ie

I'm not even on the dole (yet....)drvin me mad!

Yep I was in the same boat as you Trilla, although I was offered a job just last week but I don't start untill September :rolleyes:
I did three interviews, two of the companies never got back to me :mad:
Just keep trying, you'll get something eventually..

Nalz

I had 2 interviews in Dublin, got excepted for both jobs but timing and money wasnt the best. Plus they were just I.T support jobs. Good companies, great location just not for moi. The phonebill is gonna be massive (on dialup), constantly looking for work on net! Alot of classmates are píssed off to say the least, though the ones that got a job are gettin well paid. A guess its just a matter of luck..... and waiting

DublinWriter

As someone who has an almost 20 year career in I.T., the experience of the OP really makes me sick for the following reasons...

Companies are always banging on about the lack of I.T. graduates. Crap, there's plenty around, they just want to hire someone with narrow experience of Version X.Y.X of a tool, or the usual '10 years of experience in .NET' when it's only been around for the last 5.

Companies want people, but they just can't be arsed to develop their skills. They want to quick fix and they want it now. Makes it even the more difficult with more and more companies outsourcing their I.T.

OP I'm afraid with I.T., you just have to 'blag' it. It's not like architecture or dentistry, there's no defined career path, especially in your early years.

damnyanks

The milkrounds will be kicking off again (If some haven't already!) start applying for grad jobs.

Check out www.milkround.co.uk for grad positions. Mainly UK but sure you're young!

BizzyC

I'm in the exact same boat.

Cant find a development job at all.
It's gotten to the stage where I've basically applied for every Java Developer job I can find, even if it requires 1+ years experience, in the hope that they cant find one and settle for my 6 months.

The reqruitment agencies really piss me off. I've applied for at least 10 jobs which asked for someone with my exact skillset, where the agencies never even aknowledged my application. Then you can never get them on the phone to follow up.

I'm waiting ages for CPL to get back to me about a job they rang me about.

Nalz

have two interviews for testing jobs this week in the big smoke (Dublin for you city folk!). Gonna take them regardless of money location etc...need to start somewhere and start making money. Have applied for a C++ graduate position aswell through Monster.ie (I think)...so Im a little more hopeful

best a luck to all in my postition, and dont take those feckin support jobs, unless they pay really really well!!

Hitchhiker's Guide to...

Don't forget to claim the dole while you are searching. You are fully entitled to it, and you'll be paying enough tax when you start working.

Dopey

Trilla,

I have been in the industry for 10 years with a degree in computer science. I've recently been involved in recruiting two grads.

If you want a development job I suggest you improve your CV while you are job seeking. If it's Java you want to do then prepare and sit the Java programmer exam. Most people I have interviewed claim they have Java but can't answer the basic questions.

I presume there is a similar certification you can do it .NET.

I would also consider looking at some of the open source projects and consider contributing to them.

If that doesn't interest you offer to do up a web site for somebody.

All experiece you gain will stand to you.

Good luck

leeroybrown

Anyone out there who is looking for a grad job in Dev/Test (or any other technical area) should listen to Dopey's suggestions. When I've reviewed bundles of CV's (albeit for SysAdmin not Dev jobs) it makes it a lot easier to screen the CV's if the applicant stands out as having a bit more of a clue(TM). When I was finishing college I knew people who claimed a lot of the same skills as me despite barely being able to blag a vague knowledge of them. It made me put some extra effort into making sure my CV gave the impression I had some knowledge of them. Two generic grad CV's - one from someone who is interested and learns quickly and another from someone mediocre who just wants a job - can be hard to tell apart sometimes.

Also, if you're looking for a Dev job theres no point in being out of practice because you've been searching for a while. You should actually be in practice and know more than you did finishing college.

Nalz

Dopey wrote:

If it's Java you want to do then prepare and sit the Java programmer exam.
...
Good luck

Cheers Dopey...but how does one go about that? is ther a general Java programmer exam and where do ya get it? Sorry if question is stupid but never heard bout it before

RoundTower2 wrote:

Don't forget to claim the dole while you are searching. You are fully entitled to it, and you'll be paying enough tax when you start working.

Oh dont talk to me, Ive applied...Im looking for back pay since Ive been out of college (mid May). I applied in 2nd week in June, gave them all they wanted (documents etc). They called me back 3 weeks later for an interveiw which lasted 3 minutes, told me theyd be in contact. That was nearly 2 weeks ago, no word since. I have proof of work the whole way through this period so Im planning to pay them a visit tomoro to find out what the fúck is goin on - means tested for nearly 6 weeks now - feckin joke!!

Dopey

Hi Trilla,

You can find the Java programmer certification information at http://www.sun.com/training/certification/java/java_progj2se.html.

There is a FAQ here http://faq.javaranch.com/view?ScjpFaq

The exam is not very expensive (approx 200 Euro).

While you are preparing for it it put on your CV that you are about to sit it.

Is it Java that you want to get into? If so, spend time getting familiar with Eclipse, Ant and Maven, JUnit. The programmer cert is the most important in my mind.

By the way, to keep costs down use your library. Try to get the Java cert books from the library and also use the internet there.

Nalz

Cheers for that Dopey...

if only I can get this dole sorted out (like I said in the last post I made). I went into office today but it was packed so walked out. Will probably have to ring them! ah its painful the time ya havta wait

iKeano

Try a recruitment agency called rescon (www.rescon.ie). They have an adv. on Newstalk at the moment looking for testers.

BizzyC

Has anyone done the Java developer training?

I would be interested in becoming certified in J2EE development while I'm job hunting.
Do you have to work your way up through their certification levels, or can you jump straight to EE?
I'm already familiar with j2EE development, but as you pointed out, it's easy to say that but hard for an employer to know if it's true.

sdssarah

have you tried here:

http://gradireland.com/

i looked it up here and there seems to be plenty, hope that helps!

Nalz

ON the dole 2 months now. Found a great testing job in blackrock, applied tru recruitment agency and got through to second round of interviews. Out of 12, 3 were put forward. Got a call today (from recruitement agency) to say they go by a points system and I came 2nd to a guy with 2 years experience. Didnt want to hear that!

Really pisd off with it all - job hard to come by! if anyone knows of anything it would be great. thanks

marco_polo

Trilla wrote:

ON the dole 2 months now. Found a great testing job in blackrock, applied tru recruitment agency and got through to second round of interviews. Out of 12, 3 were put forward. Got a call today (from recruitement agency) to say they go by a points system and I came 2nd to a guy with 2 years experience. Didnt want to hear that!

Really pisd off with it all - job hard to come by! if anyone knows of anything it would be great. thanks

Keep the chin up something will turn up in the end. It is very frustrating experience to find out you were only beaten to the job by one person. However I would focus on the positives of getting to a second round interview, you very nearly got the job so remember you are obviously a very employable graduate. There is no shame in losing out to someone with the holy grail of two years commercial experience. I thought I would share my similar story which has a happy ending.

I was in much of a similar position to yourself up until last week. Although I was fortunate enough to have a full time job as a care assistant in a hospital in the meantime. I have finally secured a graduate analyst position with a good company. I finished a M.Sc in Software Engineering last year and after bumming aroung for a few month at home started looking for software engineering work in Dublin around march. Thought it would be easy :rolleyes:

I had a pretty good cv I got a 1.1 in my masters and have Java programmer certification which I did in between my B.Sc and M.Sc(Highly recomend this seemed be recieved very well in various interviews) and had started the developer certification project.

I did about 2-3 interviews in the first couple of months and was having no luck, (mostly because I was a crap interviewee mind:o ). Tho I did manage to get about 3 interviews with one company, who then proceeded to ignore me . Then there was a lull for a few months which I used to improve my interview skills.

In July I had 4 interviews in the space of two weeks. One company never got back to me :mad: , another company said that they were restructuring the engineering department so the position was no longer in existance:mad: , the third company brough me up to dublin for a face to face interview after a telephone interview to tell me that they don't usually hire graduates and the learning curve would be too steep (Could they not have just read my CV? :mad: )And the fourth interview I just didn't get but at least I was actually informed about this :eek:

As you can imagine this was all pretty frustrating, if you multiply this by three round trips of 260 miles for each one it is downright infuriating. Happy ending is that I had a first round interview two weeks ago, a second round interview on thursday and got offered the position the day after, starting in three weeks time:D .

Anyway just though I would share my story, hopefully it might make you feel a little better. It can take a while to get started as a graduate not just in IT but in many other areas too. As someone else mentioned this is a terrible time of year for job hunting, rememner most people with the power to hire you are probably golfing in the Algarve. Best of luck with the hunt anyway hopefully you will be writing a similar story on here in a few week time.

rick_fantastic

id have to say a lot of the people that i graduated with in may are not employed in jobs yet.

i was lucky. i got all my "support" experience while i was in college (did it part time x 4 years). before i finished i started applying for jobs (mostly contract) because i wanted to go travelling.

got myself a nice job as a contract sys admin which has led to a full time job offer and the opportunity to do a funded masters over two years.

i worked in a college doing support during college terms and during the summers i took jobs with the likes of hp.

i would think that graduates coming out of computer science think they are going to be walking into 30-40k jobs a year which is a joke. unless you have relevant work experience your looking at 21-25k starting.

Nalz

rick_fantastic wrote:

unless you have relevant work experience your looking at 21-25k starting.

yeah maybe, but out of a class of 14 (where 8 graduated I think), 4 have got a job with 28k and a 10% bonus is the smallest wage :eek: !

Others are on €30k (Australia), 26k sterling testing job and another 30k Dublin south job. One of these guys failed 2 years in a row. I'm delighted for him though because he's agreat friend of mine.The rest are either on the jam roll, tech support,on the buildings or working in McDonalds (no joke).

Anyhow I am hopeful as I am a decent programmer and always had a great interest in development. Something might just come my way. back to monster and irishjobs it is then....