Acts 4 - Prayer for Boldness (or The Believers' Prayer) - Jesus a servant of Almighty

babyvaio

Just wanted to hear people's opinions about the statement that Jesus, peace upon him, was only a prophet of Almighty God and His humble and honest servant. Jesus was anointed by God, he was His prophet.

It's engraved in the verses below - the Bible clearly confirms it.

Acts 4 (verses 23-31, New King James Version)

Prayer for Boldness

23 And being let go, they went to their own companions and reported all that the chief priests and elders had said to them. 24 So when they heard that, they raised their voice to God with one accord and said: “Lord, You are God, who made heaven and earth and the sea, and all that is in them, 25 who by the mouth of Your servant David have said:

‘ Why did the nations rage,
And the people plot vain things?
26 The kings of the earth took their stand,
And the rulers were gathered together
Against the LORD and against His Christ.’[c]

27 “For truly against Your holy Servant Jesus, whom You anointed, both Herod and Pontius Pilate, with the Gentiles and the people of Israel, were gathered together 28 to do whatever Your hand and Your purpose determined before to be done. 29 Now, Lord, look on their threats, and grant to Your servants that with all boldness they may speak Your word, 30 by stretching out Your hand to heal, and that signs and wonders may be done through the name of Your holy Servant Jesus.”
31 And when they had prayed, the place where they were assembled together was shaken; and they were all filled with the Holy Spirit, and they spoke the word of God with boldness.

Acts 4 (verses 23-31, New International Version)

The Believers' Prayer

23On their release, Peter and John went back to their own people and reported all that the chief priests and elders had said to them. 24When they heard this, they raised their voices together in prayer to God. "Sovereign Lord," they said, "you made the heaven and the earth and the sea, and everything in them. 25You spoke by the Holy Spirit through the mouth of your servant, our father David:
" 'Why do the nations rage
and the peoples plot in vain?
26The kings of the earth take their stand
and the rulers gather together
against the Lord
and against his Anointed One.[c]'[d] 27Indeed Herod and Pontius Pilate met together with the Gentiles and the people[e] of Israel in this city to conspire against your holy servant Jesus, whom you anointed. 28They did what your power and will had decided beforehand should happen. 29Now, Lord, consider their threats and enable your servants to speak your word with great boldness. 30Stretch out your hand to heal and perform miraculous signs and wonders through the name of your holy servant Jesus."

31After they prayed, the place where they were meeting was shaken. And they were all filled with the Holy Spirit and spoke the word of God boldly.

Almighty God is nobody's servant nor a servant to Himself - but people/humans/creatures like we, are - His servants.

staple

Will get hammered for this, but will say it anyway.

The divinity of Jesus is accepted by most who call themselves Christians. As far as I know my church history, it was much debated in the early church, and hammered out at the councils in the first 300-400 years. You can find posts by Excelsior in the archive better explaining why Christ is not just a nice guy, not just a prophet, and did have physical human form. He was fully human and fully divine. There are lots of other places in the New Testament where Christ reveals his nature, and I'm sure your verses and the rest were all read by the men at the Council of Nicaea and by doctors of divinity since then.

You have identified verses in the bible that support your view that he is just a prophet, and ask for posters here to argue the case. That is perfectly reasonable. However, as others have mentioned, there is a sad lack of Christian theologians posting on boards.ie so you may not get satisfactory answers. That does not mean the answers do not exist, merely that you will have to look beyond this corner of the internet for them.

Now for the controversial bit. I maintain that I can believe Christ to be divine and not know all the intellectual arguments against the objectors. I can drive a car and not know how it works, and believe in heliocentrism, evolution, and a round earth but never bother to find the intellectual arguments for and against. Should it ever bother me, I know there are hundreds and hundreds of volumes written on Christ's divinity and the roundness of the earth. There aren't many exams to be a Christian, and some of us (including me) are woefully unlearned. But then you can be a Christian and not even be literate. Until I am troubled by doubt on these matters, I will occupy my time finding out about issues that do cause me doubts.

In summary, I cannot refute your claim that Christ is no more than a prophet. Yes, that does bother me, and I think I should be able to. However, it is better not to argue a case at all than to argue it badly and be an aunt Sally.

babyvaio

staple wrote:

Will get hammered for this, but will say it anyway.

The divinity of Jesus is accepted by most who call themselves Christians. As far as I know my church history, it was much debated in the early church, and hammered out at the councils in the first 300-400 years. You can find posts by Excelsior in the archive better explaining why Christ is not just a nice guy, not just a prophet, and did have physical human form. He was fully human and fully divine. There are lots of other places in the New Testament where Christ reveals his nature, and I'm sure your verses and the rest were all read by the men at the Council of Nicaea and by doctors of divinity since then.

You have identified verses in the bible that support your view that he is just a prophet, and ask for posters here to argue the case. That is perfectly reasonable. However, as others have mentioned, there is a sad lack of Christian theologians posting on boards.ie so you may not get satisfactory answers. That does not mean the answers do not exist, merely that you will have to look beyond this corner of the internet for them.

Now for the controversial bit. I maintain that I can believe Christ to be divine and not know all the intellectual arguments against the objectors. I can drive a car and not know how it works, and believe in heliocentrism, evolution, and a round earth but never bother to find the intellectual arguments for and against. Should it ever bother me, I know there are hundreds and hundreds of volumes written on Christ's divinity and the roundness of the earth. There aren't many exams to be a Christian, and some of us (including me) are woefully unlearned. But then you can be a Christian and not even be literate. Until I am troubled by doubt on these matters, I will occupy my time finding out about issues that do cause me doubts.

In summary, I cannot refute your claim that Christ is no more than a prophet. Yes, that does bother me, and I think I should be able to. However, it is better not to argue a case at all than to argue it badly and be an aunt Sally.

Nicely said, no question about that. But I somehow doubt that even the pope himself can explain that chapter (to prove "the divinity of the servant of God").

Now, I didn't say what's posted there, the Bible did. The problem is that lots of Christians accept certain belief knowing that this very belief doesn't even clearly explain who God is. I'm not saying that people should understand God's Being - obviously we can't anyway - but at least there should be no contradictions in something that you might call the core of the belief.

babyvaio

I just want to say goodbye to everybody, I am leaving this forum for good. I hope you won't miss me too much

At the same time I would like to apologize to whomever I may have insulted.