Another ruling question

dingle

Yet another ruling question. This occurred at a live €25 scalps game I played in last night and I was wondering does anyone know the correct ruling.

Player 1 goes all in, folded around to Player 2 who folds making the comment "I have to fold, Player 1 doesn't go all in unless he has aces" Player 3 then makes the comment "Well it's going to be a split pot then" and turns over AA. Note, not sure if has any bearing but he turned over his cards next to his chips, they didn't cross the line.

Player 1 then complains to the dealer that Player 3 has folded as he turned his cards up before saying 'Call'. Much confusion and the TD is called.

What ruling should he have given ?

ArmaniJeanss

I don't know the official ruling, but to me Player 3 quite clearly intends his actions to be read as a call, so if theres any justice it should be accepted as a call.
And Player 1, for claiming that Player 3 has folded... he should be taken outside and bull whipped (I'm sure thats in the rules somewhere).

Mr. Flibble

dingle wrote:

What ruling should he have given ?

He should let him call as he is obviously calling.

Exposing your hand is against the rules but I don't know if making the hand is always the penality. He may be given a time penality or something - although this would be harsh as he is obviously calling.

The rules should be a guideline only me thinks, TD should have final say.

slegs

ArmaniJeanss wrote:

I don't know the official ruling, but to me Player 3 quite clearly intends his actions to be read as a call, so if theres any justice it should be accepted as a call.
And Player 1, for claiming that Player 3 has folded... he should be taken outside and bull whipped (I'm sure thats in the rules somewhere).

or at least a wedgie

markontap

I thought [assumed?] that if someone went all in and it was folded around to you, that you could turn your cards over to try and get a read on the player all in while deciding whether to call. In saying that, I'm only speaking from experience in home games so I'm not too sure what the general rules are.

Scouser in Dub

I seem to recall Brunson suggesting you should do the same for that very reason in SS

Hectorjelly

yeah whenever I get AA Im concentrating on getting a read on what other players who are all in have

ArmaniJeanss

Hectorjelly wrote:

yeah whenever I get AA Im concentrating on getting a read on what other players who are all in have

Its definitely worth pausing for a minute or two to consider the payout structure

Scouser in Dub

Ok then maybe not in those specific circumstances but it suggests that turning your hand over before calling/folding is legitimate?

Hectorjelly

Scouser in Dub wrote:

Ok then maybe not in those specific circumstances but it suggests that turning your hand over before calling/folding is legitimate?

It actually depends on the rules of the casino. In the fitz its not allowed, but in the US it normally is. However in this case it would be clear that he intended to call, and I think thats good enough.

dingle

The TD ruled that the intention to call was obvious and that in keeping with the spirit of the law he allowed the hand to stand. Player 1 wasn't very happy and, continuing to grumble, showed 66. He stopped grumbling and started roaring when a 6 appeared on the flop.

He stopped roaring when an A appeared on the river.

All in all a very entertaining few minutes. :rolleyes:

ArmaniJeanss

dingle wrote:

Player 1 wasn't very happy and, continuing to grumble, showed 66. He stopped grumbling and started roaring when a 6 appeared on the flop.

He stopped roaring when an A appeared on the river.

Always nice to see justice done.

Carlsberg don't do rivers.......

Hitman Actual

dingle wrote:

Player 1 wasn't very happy and, continuing to grumble, showed 66. He stopped grumbling and started roaring when a 6 appeared on the flop.

He stopped roaring when an A appeared on the river.

LOL, I love when gobsh!tes get done like this.

nicryan

while in the fitz this is not allowed, the ruling that will be given will always be the one with the integrity of the game in mind - the player will be allowed to call but will be told not to turn their hand over in future...and I've seen it happen once that a player who was warned twice was told their hand was dead...

and I'm all for the bull-whip/wedgie rule...


-Nic

Mellor

If he just turned his cards and said nothing it may be considered a fold, but before he did said "its going to be a split pot so", this implies that he was calling. Any other decision would be wrong.