Faulty Gearbox - The Blame Game About to Begin?

Undercoverguy

Okay guys i drive a FIAT Punto Sporting (As some might know :rolleyes: ) After a long battle with he garage over the incorrect gearbox in the car i finally got them to replace it with the correct 6-Speed Gearbox.
I picked the car up ten days ago with the new box installed. As i drove away i noticed the car was slightly louder than before but though noting of it, maybe they'd forgotten some padding to muffle the noise of the engine but i didn't car because it wasn't too loud.

Over the new few days i started to notice a nose, kinda like a rattle slowly starting to develop on the passenger side.... Where the gearbox is.
I let it carry on for a few days thinking it would just go away but within 2 days of driving it got out of hand loud and i took it back to the garage. The mechanics took a look and had a few test drives and ruled that it needed some more time to wear itself in and to drive it a few more days and come back. The next day i got into the car and the noise had once again gotten louder and after 1 lap of the M50 to/from work i decided i wasn't going to drive it anymore and took it back again!

That was on Thursday when i left it in and its now Tuesday as i write this.
I called the garage a couple of times today to no avail until 20min ago when i got a call back. They have told me that the sound is coming from inside the new gearbox and that there is some guy coming out from FIAT Ireland to have a look at the car and check it out. The part that made me worry is these two lines:

1) "Its strange you don't seem to be having much look with this car"
2) "I have to be honest its not often ya find a faulty gearbox"

This set off alarm bells. I've been only driving for about 14 months and I'm only 18..... I have the worst feeling the garage is going to try pin this on me.
The question is tho, if they do... then what can i do?

How can i prove this sound was coming from the car the day i took it back?
Or that i'm not your typical little boy racer taking ramps at 80km/h?

This is really starting to get to me now and i can fell the solicitors getting a call..... again.

What you guys think?

SouperComputer

I stand by what I have already said:

THE CAR IS A LEMON. GET A REFUND.

jhegarty

Undercoverguy wrote:

This set off alarm bells. I've been only driving for about 14 months and I'm only 18..... I have the worst feeling the garage is going to try pin this on me.
The question is tho, if they do... then what can i do?

i think even the donut-in-the-carpark crowd would have trouble breaking a gear box that quickly...

it would have to be intentional if it was your fault....and that wouldn't make any sence after the trouble you have had getting it...

ask (demand) for a refund , you have given them every chance to fix it...

p2kone

jhegarty wrote:

ask (demand) for a refund , you have given them every chance to fix it...

thats good advice, i think the ball is in garages court to fix the problem, don't start going on about Solicitors just yet , keep a log of all the times you visit/call/ on the phone with the garage, this will come in handy if you do go to a solicitor,

you only start talking too solicitors when the garage stops doing anything for you when it's clearly there fault and there doing nothing for you,

what warranty does that gearbox have???

Henry Ford III

SouperComputer wrote:

I stand by what I have already said:

THE CAR IS A LEMON. GET A REFUND.

Exactly. Your car is a dud, and the garage incompetent.

Undercoverguy

Henry Ford III wrote:

Exactly. Your car is a dud, and the garage incompetent.

Believe me if i could take the money now i would but thats no longer a option. The garage has done so much work on the car i donbt their willing to give me my money back..... That bridge is long gone!

All i can do is keep on top of them all tomorrow and find out whats happening with the FIAT expert guy.

I really do hope they try put this on me because it will be a major crossing point for myself and all hell will indeed break loose! The thing i cant understand is how the noise exsisted in both gearboxes? That leads me to think that its noting got to do with the gearbox at all and rather problem with the driver shaft, the engine or the gearbox mounting instead! Keep ya's posted....

TempestSabre

Get the bus mate.

SouperComputer

hmm, does it vibrate more with speed? Could be an inner CV joint.

TBH, im close to "cyberslapping" you at this stage. Im sorry but this this is madness. You need to STOP DRIVING THE CAR, possibly go so far to get an "off the road" cert from the Guards and TALK TO A SOLICITOR!

As I have said before, at this stage with so many problems its a safety\confidence issue with both the car and dealer rather than a reliability one.

MercMad

We told you once...................................we told you twice...................

I think youb were told a multitude of times !!

GET RID !

You have to realise that YOU are in the strong position, as the trouble goes on it strengthens YOUR case !

Now please talk to your solicitor and leave us all alone !!

smash

dunno if you can actually get your maney back after this time... and you did test a car with a missing gear and still buy it! but if you feel the need then name and shame the garage and complain to fiat Ireland about the new gearbox! Also report them to the simi!

Kimbot

The garage have to give you a refund because the simple fact of the matter is the car was not sold to you in a roadworthy condition!!!

ismynametoolong

You all seem a little quick to tell this guy to go to his solicitor have you any idea the hassle involved in a legal case not to mention the time frame .
From what i can see the dealer has tried to sort him out and has requested the assistance of the distributor which i am sure he could confirm with a phone call to Fiat Irl , You have gone this far why not wait and see what FIAT have to say before going down the long and possibly very expensive legal route if you cont win or win and get yours costs

unkel

ismynametoolong wrote:

From what i can see the dealer has tried to sort him out and has requested the assistance of the distributor which i am sure he could confirm with a phone call to Fiat Irl , You have gone this far why not wait and see what FIAT have to say

I agree, although the dealer seems incompetent. Give them a last chance. If they don't get it sorted quickly, demand your money back (you caused some damage, did you? If so agree to deduct the cost of repairs from what you paid for the car) and if they refuse to pay up, then talk to a solicitor

MercMad

How many times has he been to the garage ??

How many excuses did he get before they even admitted incorrect specification ?

How many excuses did he get before they even admitted a fault ?

Now they have fixed it and it is worse ?

The chap already got solicitors advice, ignored it and this is what happens !

ismynametoolong

Solicitor is not going to fix his car
They will take his money write a few silly letters and
prolong the agony. Fiat dealers if they are dealers are
well used to receiving sols letters and i can assure you it dont
make them jump any higher.
A solicitor is not the Panacea to all ills and i have seen plenty
take on stupid cases and loose ! better try and get it sorted
while they are willing to complete the repairs for him.

When they refuse then its another matter !!

SouperComputer

ismynametoolong have you read the other thread?

At this stage the solicitor is more likely to fix his car than the Garage or FAI!

For those who haven't read the run up to this:

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2054932150
http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2054940455

ismynametoolong

Yes I have read the other Thread

But what you seem to forget and correct me if i am wrong
the dealer has tried one repair ie transmission replacement
which is different to a diagnosis regardless of visits to the dealer
or what was said

Now when it comes to a court case or arbitration the judge is
only interested in documented evidence not he said I said and trust
me it takes so long that even undercoverguy's memory will be vague
and it can be as simple as the garage stating that they accepted there
was a problem and undertook to rectify it but the customer reused to allow
a repair . Case dismissed .

I am only trying to give some practical advise not every plaintiff comes
out smiling after a motor case the garage can win sometimes !

SouperComputer

You seem to know what you are talking about ismynametoolong but I still think you are over complicating things.

It has had numerous, documented repairs & work including the brakes. From a safety standpoint is is a wise decision not to drive it based on the series of events and the general, apparent inability of the garage to resolve the issues with this car thus far.

Maybe im smoking crack, but I dont think so!

TempestSabre

ismynametoolong wrote:

...try and get it sorted
while they are willing to complete the repairs for him.

When they refuse then its another matter !!

They seem unable to fix it. What about all the time and costs associated with not having a car, and having to leave it with them, and collect it. 2 tries to fix it should be all it needs. After that, you're wasting your time.

maidhc

ismynametoolong wrote:

Now when it comes to a court case or arbitration the judge is
only interested in documented evidence not he said I said and trust
me it takes so long that even undercoverguy's memory will be vague
and it can be as simple as the garage stating that they accepted there
was a problem and undertook to rectify it but the customer reused to allow
a repair . Case dismissed .

A judge is more than happy to listen to a customer tell his story of woe. If you come across like a decent and reasonable person you will be believed. Hearsay evidence is inadmissable, but oral evidence is quite acceptable. My experience is judges are quite willing to accept the word of customers in consumer cases.

There is no obligation in law to agree to a repair first, in fact it can often weaken your case as you will be deemed to have accepted the goods. Indeed at this stage it is possible that the OP has indeed lost his right to reject.

ismynametoolong

Well Ok this argument could go on and on of course oral evidence is admissable but is far easier to dispute . A visit to the court house provided the Solicitor picks the correct one district or circuit and believe me they can put cases in the wrong courts is the last thing anybody should want.
I cant remember now if it is or not but if the car is still within warranty then request the dealer or Fiat Irl to foot the bill to have the car independently assessed before he accepts delivery or return of same and let both sides be bound by an independent engineers assessment.

maidhc

ismynametoolong wrote:

Well Ok this argument could go on and on of course oral evidence is admissable but is far easier to dispute .

Absolutely!

ismynametoolong wrote:

A visit to the court house provided the Solicitor picks the correct one district or circuit and believe me they can put cases in the wrong courts is the last thing anybody should want.

If the claim is less than €6,348.69: District Court
If the claim is more than the above, but less than €38,092.14: Circuit Court
If the claim is massive: High Court

Either way it is time for the OP to get off the fence and take some decisive action. At this stage it should probably involve a solicitor, not just to go to court, but to take all the other steps necessary before doing so and get proper advice as to the correct procedures to follow.

quarryman

What bleedin garage is this?

Undercoverguy

Okay for those of you who are interested I'll clear up a few things.
Since I've had the car it has been let in for repairs a total of 4 times, 3 of theses times were for over a night and i was giving a courtesy car.

Trip One - The Snag List:
Full Valet (Repaired)
Small Scratch (Repaired)
Air Con - (Repaired)
Fuel Injection Fault on Dash (Repaired)
Break Light Blown (Repaired)
6 Gear Problem - (Noting Done)
On this trip they also replaced the clutch without me even asking.
Time for Repairs: 2 Days
Courtesy Car: Yes

Trip Two - Electrical Fault:
Cooling Fan Stuck On (Repaired)
Time for Repairs: 1 Hour
Courtesy Car: Not Needed

Trip Three - 14 Days Ago:
Air Con Not Working (Repaired)
Fuel Injection Problem (Repaired)
Spot Light Bulb Blown (Repaired)
Breaks Soft (Repaired)
NEW GEARBOX AND CLUTCH INSTALLED
Time for Repairs: 4 Days (inc Sat and Sun)
Courtesy Car: Yes

Trip Four - Last Thursday:
Air Condition Blow Again
Small Fault With Cig Lighter
Noise in Engine
Time for Repairs: n/a
Courtesy Car: Yes

Anyone who would like to know who this garage is i will tell via PM only at the moment because I'd like to only "Name and Shame" once this whole thing is over.

I know i was told to give it back an run with the money once, twice and then a million more times but i didn't listen, i was too busy focusing on the pros of the car and not enough on the cons. I never went against legal advice, i had only taken on legal help when i was getting nowhere alone regarding the gearbox problem. One i got the new box installed my solicitor was happy and so was i.... until now. At the moment he is away so i cant contact him for legal advice until next Tuesday at the earliest, one thing that must also be noticed is that the garage hasnt actually blamed me on this gear box as of yet and untill then i cant drag any type of solicitor into this untill the finger is pointed at me. I contacted the garage today and they have confirmed that FIAT Ireland will be out to look at the car no later than 11am and that i will be called as soon as more information is available.

This could easily be a faulty gearbox from FIAT or a bad install by the garage and could quicky be rectifed, but it can also swing the other way just as easy with the finger being pointed at the young "little boy racer" looking male.

Again i will keep you guys posted and i cant thank ya's enough for all your help with this.... the good advice and even the hurtful :eek: is all taken bored.

Cheers Again

TempestSabre

They sold a car in that condition? :eek:

Undercoverguy

Christ No!

The first trip was about a week after i got the car and the garage was aware of the smaller stuff like the scratch and air con and arranged the date to bring the car back. They couldnt do it then because they needed a pump for the air con and the bodywork guy to do the inch long scratch. The bulb and stuff just happened over time.

Oh and just noticed some guy a few posts back said that i did damage to the car. Correct. I damaged the passenger side pretty bad but it was repaired and would not have impacted the car in any other way.

unkel

Undercoverguy wrote:

Oh and just noticed some guy a few posts back said that i did damage to the car. Correct

Who was that?

Henry Ford III

I think a few of us are running out of sympathy tbh.

You got good advice and chose to simply ignore it. That's your call I guess.

It's hard to believe for example the a/c has failed 3 times since you bought the car.

TempestSabre

What I've seen happen in these cases is that you trade in the car for the price you paid for it, less the cost of the mileage and depreciation due to wear and tear you've done to it, for another car of theres.

But I'm no sympathy either at this point. The cars a lemon, if the garage was anyway decent none of this would have happened. But to be honest I'd expect no better from a main dealer. The majority of them are rubbish.

Undercoverguy

In fairness lads i'm not asking for sympathy instead i'm just keeping the ones that are intrested in this entire thing up to date.

L5

No offence intended, but you must be simple.
You were given solid advice from every poster several times over. You chose to ignore this now you come whining about the same shít happening over again?
You've made your bed.....lie in it.
Sorry but this just písses me off, you've noone to blame for the situation but yourself, id say the garage are laughing at you to be honest. 99% of normal people would not stand for that shít :mad: