How To Love God

John Doe

Thinking about Jesus's first commandment, "Love the Lord thy God" etc., made me wonder how exactly one can love God. The meaning of the word 'love' in this context confuses me. When one loves a person, I imagine it is either specific personality traits or the combination of those traits that one loves. If anyone can think of other interpretations of the word 'love' I'd appreciate them.

When considering love in regard to God, I can only imagine a general sense of delight and affection at God's world and loving him this way, or a love for anthropomorphism of God, such as Jesus. I can't even understand loving Jesus in any particular way, because no-one still alive knew him as a human. Love for Jesus seems to be born out of the fact that he was supposedly God, which I find very circular, seeing as I already can't work out why/how to love God. Please help!

P.S. This isn't worth starting another thread for, I think. Is itwrong to search for a religion because you want fulfillment and a sense of well-being? They're pretty selfish motives, but they're all I've got...

maitri

John Doe wrote:

Thinking about Jesus's first commandment, "Love the Lord thy God" etc., made me wonder how exactly one can love God. The meaning of the word 'love' in this context confuses me. When one loves a person, I imagine it is either specific personality traits or the combination of those traits that one loves. If anyone can think of other interpretations of the word 'love' I'd appreciate them.

When considering love in regard to God, I can only imagine a general sense of delight and affection at God's world and loving him this way, or a love for anthropomorphism of God, such as Jesus. I can't even understand loving Jesus in any particular way, because no-one still alive knew him as a human. Love for Jesus seems to be born out of the fact that he was supposedly God, which I find very circular, seeing as I already can't work out why/how to love God. Please help!

Hi John!
I am not a Christian so maybe I am not the best to answer your question, but I seemed to remember a quote from the Bible that maybe can answer some of your questions? Here it is (I looked it up to get it right):

“The person who has my commandments and obeys them is the one who loves me. The one who loves me will be loved by my Father, and I will love him and will reveal myself to him.” (John 14:21)

It seems to be a kind of practical definition of love: To love God is to do the right things, according to this definition, if I understand it right.

Personally I think that loving ourselves is maybe the crucial thing if we shall be able to really love others. Loving ourselves is, as I see it, to accept who we are right now. But that’s only my opinion.

John Doe wrote:

P.S. This isn't worth starting another thread for, I think. Is itwrong to search for a religion because you want fulfillment and a sense of well-being? They're pretty selfish motives, but they're all I've got...

I think they are very sound and good selfish motives. It’s not wrong to search for happiness. We all do that.

Good luck!

M.

BrianCalgary

There is a verse John 15:13:Greater love has no one than this, that he lay down his life for his friends.

I think that is the definition of love. Christ laid down His life for us. I would lay my life down for my wife and kids. I have made that choice. Jesus chose to do the same.

Love is a choice. What God is asking: do you love me enough or in the way that you would be willing to lay your life down for me? Being a Christian I am willing to do so. I am willing to go anywhere and do anything He asks. After all He showed His love for me first by giving His life so that I may find mine.

maitri

BrianCalgary wrote:

There is a verse John 15:13:Greater love has no one than this, that he lay down his life for his friends.

I think that is the definition of love. Christ laid down His life for us. I would lay my life down for my wife and kids. I have made that choice.

But not lay down your Happiness - I hope?

Medina

Love your Lord by trying to live His way.
Study the Bible and see what the Way really is according to the Gospels.
I think there are loads of lessons there and ultimately that's what Jesus (whether Prophet or Son of God) came to teach us, because that is what God loves.

I think the fact that you are seeking a way to love God is an extraordinarily good thing.

May God reward you for it

BrianCalgary

maitri wrote:

But not lay down your Happiness - I hope?

I find that by loving God, He assigns some pretty enjoyable tasks before me. I went to Italy in July to do soccer camps at a church. Me, socce, kids and God, the greatest of all combinations. I even had my eldest daughter with me.

At the beginning of September it is off to Guatemala for more kids, soccer and God. Yep, I'm one happy guy.:D

maitri

BrianCalgary wrote:

Yep, I'm one happy guy.:D

I am glad to hear that! (You had me worrying for a minute.)

Asiaprod

maitri wrote:

Personally I think that loving ourselves is maybe the crucial thing if we shall be able to really love others. Loving ourselves is, as I see it, to accept who we are right now. But that’s only my opinion.

maitri, you are way to modest. That is a wonderful insight:) Indeed, "you cannot love others if you do not first learn to love yourself." And the second part of that phrase is, "you cannot learn to love yourself till you learn to love others." I wonder who will understand the meaning underlining that phrase?

maitri

Asiaprod wrote:

Indeed, "you cannot love others if you do not first learn to love yourself." And the second part of that phrase is, "you cannot learn to love yourself till you learn to love others." I wonder who will understand the meaning underlining that phrase?

Does it mean, perhaps, that it is the same thing, really, loving oneself and loving ones neighbour? Cause deep down we are all the same? All one?

Asiaprod

maitri wrote:

Does it mean, perhaps, that it is the same thing, really, loving oneself and loving ones neighbour? Cause deep down we are all the same? All one?

That would indeed be part of it.

babyvaio

The real meaning of this love - in my opinion is this -

1. That one accepts God as His Creator and worships Him.
2. That one does the works God is satisfied with (or He allowed them).
3. That one stays away from the works God is not satisfied with (or He forbade them).
4. That one prays to God to accept the good deeds.
5. That one prays to God for forgiveness when one commits an evil thing.
etc.

If you really love some one, then you have to show some commitment - saying Love you, love you, bla, bla, bla, ... is just not good enough.

And BTW, lots of people actually don't mean these words when they say them, some even lie when saying those words.

And God knows best.

Asiaprod

babyvivo wrote:

The real meaning of this love - in my opinion is this -

1. That one accepts God as His Creator and worships Him.

But can you truly call worship love? I love my wife, but I do not worship her.

2. That one does the works God is satisfied with (or He allowed them).

And how do you know what God is satisfied with it, and what do you use to determine what he does not allow?

3. That one stays away from the works God is not satisfied with (or He forbade them).

Again, how do you decide what God is not satisfied with?

4. That one prays to God to accept the good deeds.

I am fine with this approach.

5. That one prays to God for forgiveness when one commits an evil thing.
Also makes sense if one believes in God

If you really love some one, then you have to show some commitment - saying Love you, love you, bla, bla, bla, ... is just not good enough.

How very true indeed

And BTW, lots of people actually don't mean these words when they say them, some even lie when saying those words.

Welcome to real life, happens all the time. I am sure you and I both have been guilty of this.

And God knows best.

Does he? Or is it only you who thinks so because you want it to be true?

babyvaio

Asiaprod wrote:

But can you truly call worship love? I love my wife, but I do not worship her.

Well, I hope that you don't worship her. :eek: She didn't create you, but The Lord did create you.


And how do you know what God is satisfied with it, and what do you use to determine what he does not allow?


He gave you the prescription, the guidance, He sent His Messengers and Prophets, His Books, that's how you know.


Again, how do you decide what God is not satisfied with?

You don't decide, He decided that for you. Read the previous answer if you wish.


I am fine with this approach.




How very true indeed


Welcome to real life, happens all the time. I am sure you and I both have been guilty of this.


Does he? Or is it only you who thinks so because you want it to be true?

Of course He does, but some atheists probably think that they created this Universe, so guess who knows best in their opinion. :cool:

Wibbs

babyvaio wrote:

And how do you know what God is satisfied with it, and what do you use to determine what he does not allow?

He gave you the prescription, the guidance, He sent His Messengers and Prophets, His Books, that's how you know.

Still really doesn't answer the question that well as many people have different views on the messengers and books, even from the same faith.

Of course He does, but some atheists probably think that they created this Universe, so guess who knows best in their opinion.[/b] :cool:

What? Sorry? Some atheists may think they created the universe? Lost in translation there.

robindch

> Of course He does, but some atheists probably think that they created
> this Universe, so guess who knows best in their opinion.

I can't speak for anybody else, but I don't know any atheists who think they created the universe, probably or otherwise. Though I do know plenty of religious people who think the universe was created just for them...

babyvaio

Wibbs wrote:

Still really doesn't answer the question that well as many people have different views on the messengers and books, even from the same faith.
What? Sorry? Some atheists may think they created the universe? Lost in translation there.

But that's not an excuse not to follow the prescription, is it now?
You do your best by your best abilities in following the Truth. And who guides people BTW if not God?

The last sentence was a retoric confirmation of how astray some atheistic thinking can go. You don't compare God to your mother. A mother is just a creature, you love her but don't worship her. What asiaprod didn't get is that worshipping God in the right way is actually loving Him and being afraid of Him and doing what He likes/allowed and not doing what He dislikes/forbade.

babyvaio

robindch wrote:

> Of course He does, but some atheists probably think that they created
> this Universe, so guess who knows best in their opinion.

I can't speak for anybody else, but I don't know any atheists who think they created the universe, probably or otherwise. Though I do know plenty of religious people who think the universe was created just for them...

Of course I didn't really mean that they think they created the Universe, that would be foolish. It's an impression you get they think when you talk to some of them. You can call it arrogant posts.

Asiaprod

babyvaio wrote:

You do your best by your best abilities in following the Truth. And who guides people BTW if not God?

Oh, its been a long time since I have seen someone walk strait into it like that. Hope you have ear plugs:)

babyvaio wrote:

A mother is just a creature, you love her but don't worship her.

I am sure you meant nothing disrespectful by that, but I honestly recommend you edit it. Calling a mother just a creature is not going to go down very well here.

Wibbs

babyvaio wrote:

But that's not an excuse not to follow the prescription, is it now?

Eh yea it is. If the details vary from faith to faith with some serious differences thrown in. If you were sick and got three different prescriptions from three different doctors, none of which you could contact yourself, which one is the right one to take?

You do your best by your best abilities in following the Truth. And who guides people BTW if not God?

OK but if you take that view atheists or more especially people from other faiths are being guided in different ways, which one is the right way. Then again I'm sure some religious people would also suggest satan is doing a bit of guiding as well.

What asiaprod didn't get is that worshipping God in the right way is actually loving Him and being afraid of Him and doing what He likes/allowed and not doing what He dislikes/forbade.

Fair enough except for the fear bit. Fear is also a human emotion. What kind of deity are we dealing with that requires fear as a part of love from it's creation. Smacks of bullying too much. Love based in any part in fear is hardly worthy of the name. That goes for respect as well. I would be interested to understand the definition of "love" that idea of a deity commands us to have for him.

It's an impression you get they think when you talk to some of them. You can call it arrogant posts.

I get where you're coming from. Equally that accusation could be levelled at the religious dogmatists of all hues just as, if not more easily. Whatever about "pure" atheists, agnostics are probably the least arrogant as they are far more likely to admit that they don't know about God for sure. the man who says truthfully that he doesn't know is the man least likely to be accused of arrogance. Compare and contrast if you will.

maitri

Asiaprod wrote:

That would indeed be part of it.

And the rest of it being...?

PS: I think Babyvaio by calling a mother "a creature" only meant that a mother is part of creation, that she is, like the rest of us, (unfortunately) not eternal and unchanging, but conditioned and changing and interdependent. And that's right, isn't it?

Asiaprod

maitri wrote:

And the rest of it being...?

PS: I think Babyvaio by calling a mother "a creature" only meant that a mother is part of creation, that she is, like the rest of us, (unfortunately) not eternal and unchanging, but conditioned and changing and interdependent. And that's right, isn't it?

No it is not maitri, At least not in the way it was posted. You have a far deeper understanding than Babyvaio and are coming from a completely different direction than he is.

babyvaio

maitri wrote:

And the rest of it being...?

PS: I think Babyvaio by calling a mother "a creature" only meant that a mother is part of creation, that she is, like the rest of us, (unfortunately) not eternal and unchanging, but conditioned and changing and interdependent. And that's right, isn't it?

Exactly. Our mothers will (unfortunately) die, same as we. I love mine so much, but she will day some day, and so will I.

I think we are finally getting into the same boat. So at least we could stay in this nice little boat for a while (assuming that none of us can swim ;-) to come further towards the truth.

So, an atheist or not, a believer or not, a Christian or not, there are so many ways/paths out there.

Now would you at least agree, that they all cannot be the truth, or that they all cannot be the right path, but only one?

If you agree on that, then the major question is - which one is right?
Isn't that something you could call the question of life?

babyvaio

Asiaprod wrote:

Oh, its been a long time since I have seen someone walk strait into it like that. Hope you have ear plugs:)

I am sure you meant nothing disrespectful by that, but I honestly recommend you edit it. Calling a mother just a creature is not going to go down very well here.

I'm not going to edit what I said in that particular post. My own mother is just a creature. Now let's make this clear. She does not create nor did she create anything nor she will create. That's what I meant. I love her so deeply just like every single one of us loves their mothers.
When I say she is just a creature it means, that she was created like all of us. And her mother and her mother and her mother...now you know exactly where I'm going to.

Furthermore, if somebody is a creature, that means nothing bad, that only means that that particular one was created.

So, to make it obvious, I'm just gona call myself a creature.

I, babyvaio, declare myself as a creature and I find nothing bad in that. In fact, I actually am very grateful, that I was created, because before I had been nothing. I wasn't. There wasn't me. Now it is. Full stop.

Now please, I hope that this makes my previous post (or the post you were referring to) clear.

Wibbs

babyvaio wrote:

So, an atheist or not, a believer or not, a Christian or not, there are so many ways/paths out there.

Agreed

Now would you at least agree, that they all cannot be the truth, or that they all cannot be the right path, but only one?

Possibly. Possibly not. It's equally possible none of them or all of them contain some "truth". This is what's confusing. It all boils down to personal faith, which is cool. After all if we just look at the Abrahamic religions, the Jewish tradition is still waiting for it's messiah, the Christian tradition maintains Jesus is the final say on the matter, then the Islamic tradition comes along and says Mohammed's message is the final say. Who's to say there isn't another final say? I mean if you're Jewish, Jesus and Mohammed don't come into it and you would find much in your doctrine to back up that idea. Same with the Christian perspective on Mohammed. And that's just the Abrahamic faiths. Confusing non?

If you agree on that, then the major question is - which one is right?
Isn't that something you could call the question of life?

I would say the question of life is to keep questioning not blindly accepting. Until clear answers are forthcoming some of us not "blessed" with faith in one system or another will have to keep posing the questions. Until then a little bit of humanism goes an awfully long way(a concept most prophets of all hues would go along with). Sometimes ironing out the details obscures the big picture. Put it another way, when the world is so full of suffering that is fixable I find it hard to concern myself with the details of dogmatic differences. Especially when too much of that suffering is down to those dogmatic differences. Maybe when all have full bellys, shelter and peace we can get to the details(sheesh I sound like a ms world winner:D ).

Asiaprod

babyvaio wrote:

Now please, I hope that this makes my previous post (or the post you were referring to) clear.

Then in this situation I will accept that I may have misunderstood what you were trying to say and instead will offer you my apologies.

robindch

> the major question is - which one is right?

As Wibbs says, what if none of them are right?

What if the world is too big to fit between the covers of just one book, no matter how good it is?

And what if the people who say that the world actually can be contained within a single book are in fact stopping themselves from seeing that other people might have a point too?

Perhaps the search is the most important thing -- and stopping to look is the best thing, while stopping looking is the worst?

maitri

babyvaio wrote:

I think we are finally getting into the same boat. So at least we could stay in this nice little boat for a while (assuming that none of us can swim ;-) to come further towards the truth.
(...)
Now would you at least agree, that they all cannot be the truth, or that they all cannot be the right path, but only one?

Speaking of mothers: My (catholic) mother says that the different religions and religious philosophies are like the fingers on the hand. They can seem very different and separated from each other when you look at the “surface” of the religions ( = the fingertips), but when you learn more and go deeper into the religions in your search for truth you will se that deep down the religions meet each other - beyond concepts and ideas, maybe - like the fingers meet in the hand.
I don’t know if it is right, but the thought that it just might be so is a humbling thought when I meet with people of other religions or philosophies, I think.

robindch wrote:

> the major question is - which one is right?

As Wibbs says, what if none of them are right?

What if the world is too big to fit between the covers of just one book, no matter how good it is?

And what if reality (and truth and the world) is too big to really fit into any our concepts and ideas, however bright they may seem?

robindch wrote:

Perhaps the search is the most important thing -- and stopping to look is the best thing, while stopping looking is the worst?

Oh, we are born so horribly curious!
Do you think it is really ever possible for us to stop looking?

babyvaio

Wibbs wrote:

Agreed

Possibly. Possibly not. It's equally possible none of them or all of them contain some "truth". This is what's confusing. It all boils down to personal faith, which is cool. After all if we just look at the Abrahamic religions, the Jewish tradition is still waiting for it's messiah, the Christian tradition maintains Jesus is the final say on the matter, then the Islamic tradition comes along and says Mohammed's message is the final say. Who's to say there isn't another final say? I mean if you're Jewish, Jesus and Mohammed don't come into it and you would find much in your doctrine to back up that idea. Same with the Christian perspective on Mohammed. And that's just the Abrahamic faiths. Confusing non?

If you read carefully what I'm gona say just now, slowly and carefully then it might make sense to you. Now this is how I see that this confusion came to this world (but it didn't come from God Almighty, but from people, of course):

Abraham
Neither he was a Jew nor he was a Christian. He lived way before both of these 2 groups, so as I said - he was neither a Jew nor a Christian.

Jews & Christians
Moses, peace upon him, received the Torah, and before him David received the Psalms. And then Jesus, peace upon him, was appointed by God Almighty, and when he received the Gospel (that good news), he was also taught the Torah, not only the Gospel. He also was appointed to correct the errs of Jews, for they have allowed something to themselves which was originally forbidden by God and similar. However, when he claimed that he is the Prophet of God Almighty, some Jews accepted him, some didn't. Those who didn't (still) call themselves Jews and they are waiting for their messiah. Why they didn't accept Jesus as a prophet of Almighty, that's a different story.

Muslims
Then God Almighty appointed Muhammad saws, and he received the Qur'an via the very same angel, Gabriel, peace upon him too, who was anointed to bring from the Heavens all God's (major) Books (Psalms, Torah, Gospel and Qur'an). The Qur'an confirmed all the previous revelations (listed inside the brackets above) and explained itself (that the Qur'an is the book in which there is no doubt, what it actually is, what is its message and similar).
Then some Jews believed in this message spread out by Muhammad saws and some didn't. The same goes for Christians and all others.
Those who did accept the message are now Muslims.

So, in the end, it is not really confusing.

babyvaio

Asiaprod wrote:

Then in this situation I will accept that I may have misunderstood what you were trying to say and instead will offer you my apologies.

Always accepted

maitri

Asiaprod wrote:

But can you truly call worship love? I love my wife, but I do not worship her.

Actually, I think you should. Really, all women like to be worshipped a little no and then. Nothing wrong with that.

Asiaprod wrote:

Or is it only you who thinks so because you want it to be true?

I think we all do that... believe what we want to be true.


(PS to Asiaprod: You'll actually find the answer to your Big Question here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Navel_lint At Wikipedia, of course!)

John Doe

This thread has really taken off in my absence (I was in Amsterdam for a week, supporting my friends in the World Rowing Championships. Ireland did quite well, incidentally)! Thanks to everyone who has replied. All of them have been very useful. Maitri's first reply is similar to what I might have thought of myself, but didn't. This is the manner of loving God that I think I can achieve.

That said, I appreciate all of the ideas put forward as part of my 'search'

McGinty

Hi I haven't read all the threads but something tells me that you think about God and love very deeply, to be honest love is as hard to define as God is, yes the bible can point us in the right way, but I have been reading the bible on and off for a long, long time and each time I read it my understanding of it changes. Personally I beleive there are a few forms of love, first of in St Paul's letter to Corinthian (I think, may have that wrong it could also be acts 2) but it states "God is love" so if God is love how can you love love? I often think this myself. So what is love? That is the first question, and to be honest I can't define it, maybe it is to do with creation, kindness, to lift oneself and others, sacrifice (but not to the detriment of the self) to take care, to elevate. I guess for to show your love to God is to commit to God, to believe in Him and to express your love for him by praying, learning about him and being open to His word. Having said all of that I am as clueless as you, these are just quesses and supposisitions.

John Doe

McGinty wrote:

"God is love"

There's another interesting one. I hadn't thought of that! This just goes to show how useful posting a religious enguiry on this forum can be.

If this simple sentence can in fact be taken literally, then I'm most definitely a believer in and worshipper of God, which I hadn't really considered possible before.