I think its time I found real work again.

NickyOD

A 1-2 6 max hand. No real info on villain.

Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em, $ BB (4 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: FlopTurnRiver)

SB ($70.30)
BB ($416.28)
UTG ($32.34)
Hero ($204.10)

Preflop: Hero is Button with J, Q. SB posts a blind of $1.
1 fold, Hero raises to $8, 1 fold, BB calls $6.

Flop: ($17) 4, 9, Q(2 players)
BB checks, Hero bets $12, BB calls $12.

Turn: ($41) J(2 players)
BB bets $41.43, Hero ?????.

Ste05

Push?

EDIT: Didn't pay attention to stack sizes, new reply coming....

EDIT 2:

It's a great bet by the Villain TBH, it's just right, he gets a huge amount of info from Nicky, and he's basically put Nicky's whole stack on the line by only risking $40 of his own I;m undecided as to whether I'd push here expecting to get called by sets, mad straight hands, weaker 2 pair, 1 pair +FD/SD hands and folding bluffs, or just calling this bet and allowing him to draw for free and bluff again or value bet weaker hands that don't outdraw me...

Very tricky one though. I think calling maximises returns from weaker 2 pair hands and allows him to bluff off more chips if he has nothing or some weak pair. I realise this also allows him to draw for free, but because it's only 4 handed I might give him this opportunity hoping that he'll try again to buy the pot if his draw misses or if he has a weak holding and if he outdraws me then so be it.

One thing to add though, personally I wouldn't be too worried about the flush possibilities, due to it only being 4 handed and his call on the flop.

Very tricky spot and I'm looking forward to hearing other people's views on possible lines as I'm undecided if a push here is better than a going defensive now and calling

Atlas_IRL

AQ, JJ he prob wouldnt play with 810 or 10K he may have tried to slowplay a set

what did you put him on?

RoadSweeper

Could be a K T or less likely 8 T, i presume you lost so a staright looks likely.

NickyOD

I thought it was a pretty easy fold. Of course only when you're thinking straight. He had 99. I just wanted to post this so I could take satisfaction from the fact that there are people out there just as dumb as I am and raise the turn here.

Ste05

NickyOD wrote:

I thought it was a pretty easy fold. Of course only when you're thinking straight. He had 99. I just wanted to post this so I could take satisfaction from the fact that there are people out there just as dumb as I am and raise the turn here.

I don't think it's that easy a fold due to it only being 4 handed, but the bet was so confusing I suppose a fold could be found if thinking clearly...

RoadSweeper

his call on the flop makes it look like your ahead, its a nice bet and a hard situation to lay down

cardshark202

NickyOD wrote:

I thought it was a pretty easy fold. Of course only when you're thinking straight. He had 99. I just wanted to post this so I could take satisfaction from the fact that there are people out there just as dumb as I am and raise the turn here.

Huh? Its four handed, you know nothing about your opponent, he could well be an absolute donk, top two is well ahead of his range here surely. I am certainly not folding in this spot. If he has Q9/QT/J9/KQ or whatever you'd be saying it was an easy call.

bohsman

Easy call, you shouldnt be results orientated

Hectorjelly

in general theres no shame in going broke with 2 pair in a raised pot

NickyOD

Hectorjelly wrote:

in general theres no shame in going broke with 2 pair in a raised pot

Losing 2 grand in 3 days does wonders for your confidence.

Gholimoli

NickyOD wrote:

Losing 2 grand in 3 days does wonders for your confidence.

Nicky that’s a call there and if you fold these often your playing too tight and giving up too much value.
As for loosing money, I have lost 2.2K over 5 days but I know im playing better than my opponents. my reads have been spot on for the most part and just getting outdrawn etc.
You know your gonna get it back and that’s pretty much guaranteed because they all suck specially at the lower levels .

Ardent

I think the best you can do in this spot, where there's a strong indication you might be beat, is flat call the turn and river and hope you're ahead. Tough to lay this one down.

brianmc

Thank goodness this thread corrected itself. I've been playing $0.50 - $1 to get used to the cash thing and I got as far as here...

RoadSweeper wrote:

Could be a K T or less likely 8 T, i presume you lost so a staright looks likely.

...and I was starting to think I was a bigger donkey than I ever first imagined or that there was a dramatic difference between $0.50 - $1 and $1 - $2.

Errr... push. Or call... Yes, call. final answer.

El Stuntman

Gholimoli wrote:

You know your gonna get it back and that’s pretty much guaranteed because they all suck .

Gholimoli, quality levels of confidence there!!

Gholimoli

El Stuntman wrote:

Gholimoli, quality levels of confidence there!!

but its true ,maybe not all but most of them do suck .
the level of knowledge that ppl have on this board is in most cases much higher than your average 1/2 player.
The only thing is you gotta build up on the discipline part and then you will be laughing .

El Stuntman

Gholimoli wrote:

but its true ,maybe not all but most of them do suck .
the level of knowledge that ppl have on this board is in most cases much higher than your average 1/2 player.
The only thing is you gotta build up on the discipline part and then you will be laughing .

discipline eh? hmmmm....

like not shoving with pocket Kings when it's obvious you're beat?

lol, that was somewhat funny though....in deference to your advice, I then 'disciplined' myself on the other table and came away with 4 buy-ins!!

staringelf

i think its an easy push. top 2 pair in a raised pot is very hard to get away from. if he hit his set you have to pay him off - most of the time you're taking this down with a push or taking a huge pot when he calls you with AQ, flush or straight draw if he's an idiot (and god knows there's a few of those), etc etc.

as has been said already i think his turn bet is brilliant. its a bet i often see from the very good regular players i play with in sngs on party. it looks sort of weak - like he's trying to get a cheap river card to fill his flush/open ender/hit 2 pair. he knows he might face a push otherwise which he can't call. he gets lots of info relatively cheap depending on your next move

- if you fold, he's pleased as he wins a decent pot
- if you flat call he gets his river card for probably cheaper than you would have given it to him and he can reevaluate then when it comes down
- if you raise or push he knows he's well beat and can get away having not lost a huge pot

great way to take control of the hand. i love this play.
anyway, i wouldn't feel too bad about paying him off nicky, folding top 2 there is weak unless you have a mad read on him. suck it up and rebuy

EDIt: i also should say that another reason its a great turn bet is that its so confusing and weak looking that it can induce a bluff re raise all in. great when you have a pretty much lock hand. most players who have led preflop and on the flop just can't back down when facing a bet like that and will check call all the way to the river or push and give you a monster pot. love it.