My mother was attacked at work - advice needed.

daveg

Would really appreciate some advice on this. My mother works as an operator for a large healthcare multinational. One evening last week whilst working on the line she was verbally attacked and threatened by a fellow worker. He basically accused her of fúcking something up on the line (which she hadn't) and proceeded to roar and shout at her. This was witnessed by several other employees including one senior operator who is about to be promoted to teamleader. He brought her, in tears, to the shift supervisor. The shift supervisor was told what happened and basically tried to play it down and refused to make an issue of it. My mother went home emotionally in bits as you can imagine. The following evening my mother went into work and was summoned to HR. The shift supervisor had reported the issue and my mother was called to give her side of the story. It really appeared the issue was going to be dealt with. The operator who had verbally abused my mother was suspended with pay while the matter was investigated. I should point out at this stage this person is a non national from Nigeria. He has previously being in trouble for "stalking" another female operator who complained to HR. He was not fired for this issue.

HR came back to my mother the following day and said that the issue had been dealt with and that they could not tell her what they had done as it was confidential. My mother went into her work area to find the operator who had verbally attacked her back working beside her on the line. They had not even moved the motherfúcker let alone fired his ass.

My mother knows one of the HR representatives very well as she told her "unofficially" that they would love to fire him, especially after the "stalking" incident but that they were afraid of a law suit for racism. To top it all my mother told me this morning that her teamleader told her she would have to take a nights holiday for the night she went home early (the night she was attacked), whilst the attacker was suspended with pay!!!

Where should my mother go from here? Citizens advice? Solicitor?

Thanks in advance for any advice.

Beruthiel

Is she part of a Union?

To top it all my mother told me this morning that her teamleader told her she would have to take a nights holiday for the night she went home early (the night she was attacked), whilst the attacker was suspended with pay!!!

That's disgusting.
I would write a letter of complaint to the HR stating the above, I would ask them for a written explaination and ask that something is done.
Perhaps she should write down all that's happened to her so far and go see a solicitor, first visit is free after all.

daveg

Beruthiel wrote:

Is she part of a Union?

Yes.

Beruthiel wrote:

I would write a letter of complaint to the HR stating the above, I would ask them for a written explaination and ask that something is done.
Perhaps she should write down all that's happened to her so far and go see a solicitor, first visit is free after all.

Good starting point to write a letter, document what has happened and see a solicotor.

cichlid child

This happend to a mate of mine a while back. alot of these non nationals are geeting away with this sort of behaviour because anything happens they cry racism i know of one who even got promoted so the firm could take him off the shift without hassle.tell your mother to send the letter to HR and from now on write everything that happens to her in the job it will help if she does need to take it futher

daveirl

This post has been deleted.

daveg

I'll check in with her today to see what the Union reps position was but I remember her saying he wasn't too interested. Will post back what his position was. Surely as an employer they have to provide a safe working enviroment free of bullying ect.

daveg

cichlid child wrote:

This happend to a mate of mine a while back. alot of these non nationals are geeting away with this sort of behaviour because anything happens they cry racism i know of one who even got promoted so the firm could take him off the shift without hassle.tell your mother to send the letter to HR and from now on write everything that happens to her in the job it will help if she does need to take it futher

I don't want this to decend into a rasicm thread but it appears that a lot of Nigerian males think women are dirt and treat them as such in the workplace.

Tom Dunne

daveg wrote:

My mother knows one of the HR representatives very well as she told her "unofficially" that they would love to fire him, especially after the "stalking" incident but that they were afraid of a law suit for racism.

Hang on, they have two clear-cut cases of abuse by this person - surely if they follow proper procedures, put him on a final written warning then he can't claim racism?

:mad:

daveg

tom dunne wrote:

Hang on, they have two clear-cut cases of abuse by this person - surely if they follow proper procedures, put him on a final written warning then he can't claim racism?

:mad:

Seems they don't want to risk it :mad:

ArthurDent

As an employer they must provide her with a safe working environment. Tell her to take it up with both HR and the health and safety rep in work - IN WRITING. She may want to copy the letters to her solicitor. It's just tough sh!t that the company don't want to deal with this for fear of being labelled racist, this is just a cop out for them to say this, too many scumbag bullies get away with this sort of behaviour by either waving a race or gender card around , imo, bullies are bullies I don't care what colour, race, gender, sexual preference etc they are they need to be tackled. I wouldn't let the union rep off the hook either - she needs to raise it again in writing to her union rep. Also tell her that she should definitely not take the night as a holiday - she should demand that if her supervisor is saying this that he/she requests it in writing - a trip to occuoational health might not be any harm either - let them know how stressed she is by this incident.

All the best to her - bullying in work, both from her colleague and managment, is sh!tty and can really dent a person's confidence.

Gillo

tom dunne wrote:

Hang on, they have two clear-cut cases of abuse by this person - surely if they follow proper procedures, put him on a final written warning then he can't claim racism?

:mad:

Thats what I would have thought, it's a case of building a file on him before doing anything, at this stage they want to very very fair so that they can when accused of being racist they can clearly display that they were not.

With regard to suspending him with pay, if you suspend someone without pay, it is basically the same as fireing them (admittedly only for a short period of time) so for that reason the company will normally pay them as they are still employed by the company. I know that in most cases it's unfair for the rest of the employees but employment law is similiar to property law, it's a minefield (especially if someone is going to use the racism card).

daveg

She is visiting the doctor today to see if she can get some time off for stress as she dreads going into work at the moment. Putting everything in writing sounds like a good idea.

Tom Dunne

daveg wrote:

Seems they don't want to risk it :mad:

Spineless, utterly spineless.

I have heard the same where my own mother works - she is a nurse. Sadly, from working with non-nationals, she has become incredibly racist. But she tells me the same things, management are too afraid of the racist card being played, so they let the Irish staff take abuse and do nothing about it.

Again, not wanting to drag this into a racist thread, I should point out that she tells me it is only a percentage of non-nationals who give the rest a bad name.

Beruthiel

Also
Does this company she works for have any kind of Anti-Bullying Policy in place? It was brought into our company a while back because of one asshole, he's well cleaned his act up since then.

The Union Rep is there to help her, she should make him do his job.
Everyone one is just hoping she forgets about this and they can just sweep it under the carpet. It's just not right or fair and she should push for something to be done.
As someone else said, he should be on his last warning at this stage.
Is he legally in this country btw?

ArthurDent

tom dunne wrote:

Again, not wanting to drag this into a racist thread, I should point out that she tells me it is only a percentage of non-nationals who give the rest a bad name.

and that's why these scumbag bullies should be tackled. They make work very difficult for the majority of people from whatever background that just want to get on with their jobs.

Raiser

Now theres a HR dept. thats showing their true worth - typical paper-pushing buzz-word spouting morons, I wouldn't mind but in their daft interview processes they love to ask people to name a time when they were honest at the bus stop and showed leadership blah, blah, blah - but once you get the job you are allowed to stalk people and threaten, intimidate and abuse them.....

Then a Union rep. thats worse than useless, no interest in providing any recourse to a genuine person who should be able to go to them for immediate assistance and peace of mind, would be better off with no union representation than a smalltime ineffectual twat like this idiot.

I'd personally like to see your Mother bring a successfull legal action against these cretins from every conceivable angle and retire early - I'd advise that she should channel all energies into litigation & look forward to buying a villa somewhere sunny with her richly deserved compensation.

Hagar

Does the word "Boycott" ring any bells for anyone?
If the company won't act, your mother and her workmates should isolate the individual in a non-confrontational, totally peaceful manner. Refuse to speak to him, exclude him from any and all social contact. If he joins a canteen table then everyone just gets up and goes to another table without a word. Nobody can make you make him feel welcome if you don't want to. Keep doing this until he shapes up or ships out.

daveg

Quick update:

Doctor has given her an open dated sick note. She has to go back again next week to be re-checked. He has diagnosed she is suffering from stress.

She has not approached the Union Rep as he has, so far, been representing the Nigerian worker. The union rep has not approached my mother.

I have advised her to document everything that has happened. Write a letter to HR detailing what happened and how dissatisfied she is with the way HR have handled the case. Perhaps also mention that she has passed this onto her solicitor. I've also suggested she writes to her union and finally that she makes an appointment with our family solicitor. Finally I have advised her to ask her teamleader to put in writing how she wants my mother to take the time off on the night of the incident (sick leave/holiday/time worked up etc).

She is extremely cautious though that the company will make things difficult for her and thus have her hand in her notice. They may move her to a different area etc etc but surely this would be seen as constructive dismissal? I have told her to discuss this with her solicitor.

daveg

Hagar wrote:

If the company won't act, your mother and her workmates should isolate the individual in a non-confrontational, totally peaceful manner. Refuse to speak to him, exclude him from any and all social contact. If he joins a canteen table then everyone just gets up and goes to another table without a word. Nobody can make you make him feel welcome if you don't want to. Keep doing this until he shapes up or ships out.

This for me was the most sickening part of the whole issue. When the Nigerian worker returned to work some of the workers patted him on the back and shuck his hand saying well done and good to see you back at work. Can you believe that !!

DOLEMAN

Yup, useless HR people strike again. HR people do nothing all day. I'm not surprised they've done nothing once again.

Something similar happened to a friend of mine. He won a lot of money in an out of court settlement (over 100k). She should go to the doctor and go off permanently sick (not for a week or two, but for a year +) Talk to a solicitor and sue them for causing her to have a breakdown and being unable to work. She'll win.

****ing scumbags.

daveg

Beruthiel wrote:

Also
Does this company she works for have any kind of Anti-Bullying Policy in place?

They must have as they are one of the biggest medical device companies in the world. I'll ask her to check.

Beruthiel wrote:

Is he legally in this country btw?

As above I'd say he must be.

ArthurDent

daveg wrote:

She is extremely cautious though that the company will make things difficult for her and thus have her hand in her notice. They may move her to a different area etc etc but surely this would be seen as constructive dismissal? I have told her to discuss this with her solicitor.

you've hit the nail on the head here, the company would love to see her go, then they won't have to tackle this issue head on. Tell her to keep documenting everything and insist that everything the company says to her is in writing. If they won't put it in writing, ie insist in having a converesation - tell her to type up a note on the conversation and sent it back to them (via e-mail preferably) asking them to confirm that this is what the discussed.
In many ways the company is much more culpable that the bully that attacked your mam at this stage- they should be defending her and as for the union rep that hasn't even discussed it with her - they should be kicked out of what ever union they are in.

seamus

Can she bring legal proceedings directly against her co-worker?

If she successfully managed to sue him, surely the HR department could use that as sufficient claim that there are no racism issues here.

daveirl

This post has been deleted.

Hagar

/edit triple post sorry - I don't know what caused that???

Hagar

/edit triple post sorry - I don't know what caused that???

Hagar

You don't have to associate with anyone.
You have the freedom to maintain your own society of friends.
You do not have to associate with agressive bullies.
Non-association with violent anti-social misfits is not bullying it is a form of passive resistance.

daveirl

This post has been deleted.

Hagar

You may be correct, he might sue but would he win?
If you choose not to speak to me what can I do about it?
Can I make you speak to me?
Morningstar put me on his ignore list, again , today.
Can I sue him for not wanting to hear what I have to say?
If several people did that can I sue them all?
Would boards.ie be responsible for his/their actions? I think not.

It's an acedemic point in this situation as it probably wouldn't achieve much anyway.

The best course of action for the OP's mother would be through her union, via an external union rep, and through legal channels.

daveirl

This post has been deleted.

lostexpectation

is there another union rep who could represent her? the other union rep can't probably rep two people in a dispute, not even moving him seems terrible. I don't think it be against rules to say if they guy got 'reprimanded'. or second strike or whatever. Did her HR friend unofficial tell her any of that?

sounds like this guy is busy on his way to being fired, the company/hr are being ridicilous I don't fully believe the fear of racism thingy, its bad bureaucracy. And er cos the abusive guy prob.

spurious

Whoever did whatever to her is not the issue. The race of that person is not the issue.

The issue is that her employer has failed to provide her with a safe working environment. She can tackle this through the union if she likes, but there is no need to. If she is dissatisfied with the service she gets from her rep., she is quite entitiled to contact the union and look for a branch officer or a rep from another centre.

She's on an absolute winner with this - the employer hasn't a leg to stand on, and they will know that.

Mrs. MacGyver

I'd also advise that you go to a solicitor with this matter, especially one with experience in employment law/legislation. Is the company covered by the provisions of the Freedom of Information Act? I'd get her to do an FOI request as well to see both sides of the story. If she's not happy with the answer it will go to an internal reviewer and if still not satisfied, to the ombudsman.

I think all people should be treated equally under the law, it's ridiculous to fear playing the racial card. Not being racist but if that were an EU citizen they would have been fired or severly sanctioned for this behaviour. There should be no generalisations or exceptions. :mad:

WhiteWashMan

there should be at least 2 union reps in each place of work.
if the rep is currently looking atfer the other guy, then you can get him to refer it up the chain to the regional union guy.

however, the union are not interested in in-fighting in the work place.

id be more inclined to go higher in the HR department myself, and id also make sure there was a solicitor involved.

gerrycollins

ok having read the OP this sort of sh1te angers me
firstly forget the union they would be more intrested in the non national as they are seen as the weaker by the unions and are the ones who need the help

there are a number of avenues for her to take ie the legal which would be against the individual or the company for various reasons but many things must happen before this is taken,any issue between ur mother and the individual will be seen as civil and leave the company exempt from anything other than to provide papers and records etc they will not be spoken to but you can however bring the company to bear as they did not provide you with a safe workin environment etc they cannot be held responsible for the mans actions only that they were allowed to take place and should they have "scolded" him appropiately then they have no case to answer

has she a contract,statement of work, in it should be basically the do's and don'ts of what can go on,if she feels that one of the companies policies which warrant instant dismissal is broken then she should see HR straight away

This matter is not bullying(bullying is over a period of time) but is abusive and threatning behaviour which was "outlawed" under the equal quaility status act of 1998,this matter usually is not an instant dismissal unless voilence is used but is a final written warning ie once more and your gone(bullying where proven is the same result)bullying now comes under the remit of your health and safety not HR

firstly she needs to ask HR what was the result,as she was involved they cannot use any confidence crap,however they are not obliged to "move" either of them unless one asks to be moved,but its usually good practise

if she is unhappy she can then commence a grivence policy with the company and/or the worker as she is now on medical leave from work due to the attack,this is usually a chat followed by a registered letter stating that she is unhappy with the/any result of the issue as she is not sure where she stands in the company and feels not like the victim ths is usually the best option as it leads into legal land,keep records and bring an independant witness to all meetings,chats

if they are afriad of the race issue been dragged up well then they are a crap HR because the law covers their ass in so many ways that they must not know how to use it to their advantage and if they keep appropiate records then they are grand

as for pub whispers where "they wanted to get rid of him" is sh1te again unless its down on paper or told to you officially then it should not be used for or against the merits of the case,sadly irish law is tricky when it comes to two different matters like this and if this "stalking" was taken care of as the company like to put it and its on his personal record then it can be used in a legal matter where your solicitor gets a court order for the provision of his files

Red Alert

they could complain someone for bullying if they do the canteen-table thing.

i take it by 'operator' you mean this is a phone company/customer service business of sorts - i wonder how has his behaviour been to customers? could be an easier one to get him fired for.

daveg

Red Alert wrote:

i take it by 'operator' you mean this is a phone company/customer service business of sorts

No. Manual operator working on a production line.

Red Alert

ah ok, it makes more sense reading it now. thanks!

daveg

Just wanted to follow this up since my last post.

My mother is still of sick and is seeing her doctor on a weekly basis who is providing her with a sick note. She has also been referred to a psychologist. As per company procedure she is also having to see the company occupational therapist on a weekly basis.

My mother has been to see her solicitor. He asked my mother what course of action she would like him to take. He asked her what would she like the outcome to be (go back to work etc etc). She wants to go back to work but only when she is assured that the company that she will come back to a safe work place. An assurance that the company have not given to date. He has sent the company a letter stating that his client wants to come back to work but that he requires the company to reply to his letter stating the steps they will take to ensure that this will not happen to my mother again (basically all they have to say is that your man will not be working across the desk from her).

My mother has been constantly badgered and bullied by the company. They have rang her on several occasions bullying her to come back to work, we need a date etc. She was asked to come in to see the occupational therapist, which she did, only to be confronted by the HR representative (who bullied her asking what do you mean I have given you no support etc etc). The HR representative dealing with the case has since left and a new grease monkey has taken over. However it is now obvious no 1-1 on the case has taken place so my mother is now having to explain, over the phone to this guy what happened. This constant revisit of the whole episode is causing her great stress.

Events took a turn for the worse/better (you decide) today. She received a hand delivered letter stating that the company occupational therapist has said that she is now fit to return to work. When she met him, this week, he gave no indication that he felt this way. The letter asked that she present herself at a meeting with HR this Friday to discuss her returning to work next week (Monday was stated) as the company feels she should now return to work. She is in bits today worried that they will sack her or stop paying her if she does not attend this meeting/return to work next Monday with NO assurances that the guy who attacked her will not be working opposite her on the line. She is waiting for the solicitor to call back from advice.

NUTLEY BOY

Leave colourful issues to one side and focus on the central point which is that one employee was effectively assaulted by another. That is just not on.

If this was not the first such episode of this behaviour the employer seems to be negligent in not disciplining or dismissing the offender.

If this is a repeat offence then the employer could also be liable in negligence for exposing employees to this type of behaviour which has obviously caused considerable alarm and distress. Just because you do not have a bruise it does not mean that you are not injured.

I hate HR arrogance. I particularly dislike HR people whose spines have wilted. Telling the victim of this incident that the matter has been dealt with is utterly slippery, crass and typical of their type.

The victim needs to register a formal complaint in writing with the employer. If the same union official is representing the offender as well there is probably a conflict of interest. A different union official should represent the victim or possibly a union official not involved with that office.

How prepared would the offender and the employer be to give more attention and respect to this matter if the victim also reported this to the gardai as an assault. Worth considering.

Anyhow, this type of workplace conduct is utterly unacceptable and intolerable. :mad:

daveg

NUTLEY BOY wrote:

Just because you do not have a bruise it does not mean that you are not injured.

the company seem unable to grasp that she has been bruised (emotionally). If she is not pysically hurt they cannot understand why she has not returned to work.

NUTLEY BOY wrote:

The victim needs to register a formal complaint in writing with the employer.

My mother registered a formal compaint the night it happenend (verbally). As of today the company will be getting a registered letter of compaint from her solicitor.

Following on from the letter she received she spoke with her solicitor last night. He asked her to fax in the letter highlighting all the discrepencies that the HR representative had made with his accounts of the incident (of which there were many). He said she does not have to attend this meeting on Friday and he is faxing the comapny to set the record straight on this. He said they will attend a meeting but that he (the solcitor) will be present as well.

mel123

I was just going to say that, tell your mother not to go near the company on her own for any meetings, to always now have her solicitor with her. I would also get EVERYTHING in writing, reports of what the doctors (on both ends) say, letters from the company saying they want her back by Monday etc etc.

Does your mother now really want to go back to a company who has treated her like this, has no respect for its workers, bullies them (as what HR were doing), have no interest in her safety, emotional well being etc etc etc?? I know I wouldn’t want to go back. Me personally speaking I would have their asses in court. This type of thing needs to be highlighted. It may be easier said than done, I have never been in this position myself, but we cant let companies get away with this. I am not saying let your mother be forced out, but she might be better off with a few quid in her back pocket for all her troubles and a job she is happy in.

daveg

She really does want to go back to work. all her friends are there and she was happy, before this incident. I did say, during the visit with the solicitor, what would happen if my mother decided to go down the bring them to court route. He said it would be a lot of stress, loads more than she is under now. However he said, having represented many a company, that they would only have to prove 10% negligence on the side of the company to win the case. He has said that they have done everything arseways and he would have no doubt he would win the case.

My mother just wants to get back to how things were. The solicitor said when the whole thing is over and she is back at work if they make anything difficult for her he will have them in court for constructive dismissal.

I'll keep you all posted...