TIME PLEASE!! (etiquette question)

Scotty #

I've never had the clock put on me before. Last night I had it put on me 3 times and all by the same bloke.

Hand 1. I've a house and a player puts me all in. There's a chance of a bigger house out there so I've something to think about. After 40-60 seconds a player who is not in the hand puts the clock on me. I fold. (later was told it was a good fold)

Hand 2. First round of betting. I'm daydreaming and don't realise its my turn to act. "I'm putting the clock on you". I don't know how long the wait was here, maybe shortstack can tell as he was sitting between us. Can't have been long though as the players in Drogheda usually let you know fairly quick when its your turn.

During the break I'm talking to the guy and he apologises for the "clocks" and says its to get a psychological edge. He'd also asked me to "speak up in future" after he didn't hear my check - even though there had been a bet and two folds after me and before it got to him.

Hand 3. Final table. He moves all in and its up to me. I've AKo and I have him covered just about. He asks is it just me left and then puts the clock on me. Now the other incidents didn't bother me in the least but this time I was considering my action no more than 20-30 seconds MAX.

Was this bad etiquette and can a TD over rule a players request for the clock?

BTW: I called and sent him packing.:D

Hitman Actual

Scotty # wrote:

During the break I'm talking to the guy and he apologises for the "clocks" and says its to get a psychological edge.

Why the hell did he tell you this? He's not getting much of an edge if he tells you that's why he's doing it (if that makes sense).

Scotty # wrote:

Hand 3. Final table. He moves all in and its up to me. I've AKo and I have him covered just about. He asks is it just me left and then puts the clock on me. Now the other incidents didn't bother me in the least but this time I was considering my action no more than 20-30 seconds MAX.

Was this bad etiquette and can a TD over rule a players request for the clock?

He sounds like a bit of a tool, tbh. This one definately smacks of bad etiquette; 30 seconds is nothing, ffs. At least you can take pleasure in the fact that you sent him home. I've no idea if a TD can over-rule a clock call, but I can't see how he/she could.

I've never called clock on anyone, but I've come close a few times (usually when short-stacked and the clock is ticking down too fast for my liking). I'd have no trouble doing it if I think it was merited, but the guy above is just an idiot, imo.

Shortstack

Not to defend the guys actions but you have always as long as I have known you take more time than most to make decisions.

The first one, you did take a long time, the second one also although you didn't realise it was your turn. The third time was the shortest but still 1 min 20 secs until he called the clock, I was watching it tick down as I knew he would call it again if you dwelled.

It may seem like bad etiquette but slow players irritate people, some are more patient than others. As long as you are taking over a minute to make a decision then he can call it as many times as he likes.

5starpool

I don't like slow players, but I have only ever called the clock once and that was only in jes tas Player X had told someone to call the clock on him they wanted him to hurry up. I said clock without really thinking it through just for the craic and he waited until 1 sec before folding

DeVore

^^^^ A trick I taught him.


Anyone puts clock on me and they are being a ****tard, I put my hand down, ask for floor, get it all formal and then wait 59 seconds.

It generally drives them spare.

Player X tried it on with me when I was a raw n00b (as opposed to only a n00b). So when it was my BB and he was UTG there was less then 1 minute left. I waited and he put clock on me (like 3 seconds after it became my turn). I took the full minute and the blinds went up (meaning he had to pay the higher blinds) and then showed him 82o.

If someone is taking 2-3 minutes to make a decision ok, or is commonly taking 1-2 minutes for all decisions then ok. There are better ways to handle it. But if they are just doing it to wreck your head, then alls fair in love and war.

DeV.

cardshark202

I've never called the clock on anyone. I'll let them take as long as they need to make their decisions. I like think that I will be afforded the same courtesy by others, though that isn't always the case.

Lafortezza

DeVore wrote:

^^^^ A trick I taught him.


Anyone puts clock on me and they are being a ****tard, I put my hand down, ask for floor, get it all formal and then wait 59 seconds.

DeV.

Why would you do that when it ruins the game for the rest of the table? If you don't need to take the time, then make your action as soon as you decide what you want to do.

RoundTower

I really hate playing with the Tom Murphys and Stephen McLeans of this world. Nothing personal but the game just isn't enjoyable at 15 hands an hour.

ocallagh

and incident between myself and player x will ensure i never call the clock on anyone ever again!!!!

MadsL

Do tell.....

karlh

ocallagh wrote:

and incident between myself and player x will ensure i never call the clock on anyone ever again!!!!

I was (un)lucky enough to have been at the table and i have NEVER heard such profanity at a poker table, EVER! :eek:

Basically X was in a hand with someone and had reraised him all in on a non scary board after some preflop action.

ocallagh was shortstacked, the blinds were just about to go up and X's opponent was taking an age to make a decision. After about 2 full minutes, ocallagh called clock on the guy and player X shot him a look like he'd just climbed inside his mother.

The guy decided to call 10 seconds later and X was on a stone bluff. He was out of the €500 tourney and proceeded to turn an interesting red colour and roar ocallagh out of the building.

It really wasn't funny.

An Gaiscíoch

The clock is there to speed things up and although everyone hates a slow player, I personally would never call clock on someone. I called clock on myself in a tournament once. Everyone looked at me as if I had two heads. I had been pondering over whether to call an all-in for ages and kept changing my mind. I went with my initial thought and called and won the hand and went to win HU for a juicy 1st prize. There's one player in particular that I'm sure is known by some here that I knocked out of a fairly big tournie with a genius call (sure if I can't call myself a genius once in a while well then whats the point in life at all !) He was bluffin the bum off me the whole hand but my notes on him and just general things I had picked up on him led me to call his all-in with Ace high. I won the hand and he was gone and wasn't happy. Ever since he has despised me and has called clock on me a few times, once after me thinkin bout a hand for about 5 seconds !!! What a c**t !!!

Hitman Actual

karlh wrote:

ocallagh was shortstacked, the blinds were just about to go up and X's opponent was taking an age to make a decision. After about 2 full minutes, ocallagh called clock on the guy...

This is exactly the situation when I'll call clock on a guy, and ocallagh was totally correct, imo.

To the OP, was it really only 30secs, cos I'm inclined to believe 1.20 that Shortstack gives? There's a big difference.

Scotty #

It felt like 30 sec. but I've no reason to doubt Mike. I didn't realise I was so slow Mike I'm sulking now. I don't think 1 min 20 is that excessive either though when your tourney life is on the line. 2 mins - yes. Its only maybe 2-3 hands in a tourney I'd dwell on and their life on the line hands. Also the first time he called time was after he'd folded and was out of the hand. I found this odd as well. I'd only call a clock on someone if I thought they were taking the piss, otherwise they can take all day. I don't think any one of these clock requests were bad etiquette it was more the 3 of them put together. The last one pissed me off because it came very quick (seemed to anyway at the time) and due to our conversation during the break. I didn't see him call time on anyone else.

I think people who KNOW they are going to fold but have something to say first, like " "how much you got left, I have such and such, or counting their chips/asking for a chip count, etc. (which this guy was doing a bit of as well) hold the game up much more than people with a genuine dilemma.

I'm certainly not going to change the way I play. I've cashed in about 6 out of last 9 or 10 live MTT's I've played and part of that is down to taking my time on a desicion and making sure its the right one. Which it usually is. I should have done better than 4th on Thursday but my set got beat by a guy going all in on a bluff and catching runner runner to give him a flush. SICK!!:mad:

ianmc38

karlh wrote:

The guy decided to call 10 seconds later and X was on a stone bluff. He was out of the €500 tourney and proceeded to turn an interesting red colour and roar ocallagh out of the building.

I'd have payed the €500 entry just to see that.

5starpool

The last Fitz EOM game I was at when we were 6-7 handed with 3 tables left pretty much every other player at my table used to dwell for ages and ages and we only got 1 hand played every 5 minutes I'd say. I have never been so frustrated in my life. I can't stand slow play, but at the same time I never call clock either (apart from the p1ss take one I listed above). I think it should be a rule that dealers call the clock after a lengthy dwell up. I know this wouldn't really work in all practicality but still, I would like something done at times.

Scotty #

5starpool wrote:

I think it should be a rule that dealers call the clock after a lengthy dwell up. I know this wouldn't really work in all practicality but still, I would like something done at times.

I've heard Mike announce that he will put a clock on anyone taking longer than 30 seconds before. Usually to avoid slow play around the bubble.

DeVore

lafortezza wrote:

Why would you do that when it ruins the game for the rest of the table? If you don't need to take the time, then make your action as soon as you decide what you want to do.

If someone wants to abuse the rules to harrass a player, then I am game for that too. I only do it when someone is being stupid. I've often taken a minute over a decision, had clock called by someone (politely) and acted 10 seconds later. But harrassing a player with the clock rule is fair game for this reaction.
Its often a case that the player is new and older more experienced players want to rush them into making a mistake. Which annoys me too.
I'm not going to respond to RT's silly exageration.

DeV.

RoundTower

I'm not exaggerating. The last time I played a tournament in the Fitz we were walking down for the break when a regular player there, who was at the same table as me, said to me something like "If Stephen doesn't hurry up I'm going to choke him". So I know other people feel the same way. And these aren't the only two examples I would use, but I know Stephen reads these boards as well.

DeVore

RoundTower wrote:

I'm not exaggerating.

15 hands an hour is a silly exaggeration.

RoundTower wrote:

And these aren't the only two examples I would use

You didnt give any examples. You named two people and then told some meaningless anecdote about one time in the Fitz relating to one of them.

I havent had a complaint about taking time in over 18 months, nor had the clock put on me since then as I recall so I dont know if "some regular in the Fitz" said something to you too recently.

DeV.

RoundTower

DeVore wrote:

15 hands an hour is a silly exaggeration.

You didnt give any examples. You named two people and then told some meaningless anecdote about one time in the Fitz relating to one of them.

I havent had a complaint about taking time in over 18 months, nor had the clock put on me since then as I recall so I dont know if "some regular in the Fitz" said something to you too recently.

By examples I meant I gave you and Stephen as examples of people who slow the game down. As I said I wouldn't say this about people who don't read/post on this board.

I used to deal about 25 hands an hour depending on the game and I was pretty fast. With a slower dealer and two players who like to take their time over every decision, 15 hands an hour is not unrealistically slow.

I haven't played with you in some time, the last time I can remember someone calling the clock on you was in a hold'em only or round of each game in the Fitz on the balcony earlier in this year (March?). I was in the omaha game on the other table there, so was Marq. Someone calls "clock" on the holdem table and says something about slowing the game down. I say to Marq or Marq says to me "guess who that could possibly be" and sure enough you are mulling over a decision.

califano

'Slow play Scotty':p

I'll keep an eye on your response time on sunday week in Drogheda if were on the same table Scotty!.

cardshark202

I hope an hour is long enough for us to get our HU match over with before the 8.00 match!