Speeders on the M4

Sparky

Just coming back from the mams birth home of Leitrim today, we decided to use the M4 again coming back. Now some of you may notice that the dual carrageway leading up to the M4 is a 100kmh zone.
So as you would, my mam kept the speed on the dot of around 98-100kmh, but if I seriously counted the amount of cars that over took us at whapping speeds I would be buying an island somewhere.
I would assume many of these drivers thought it was a 120kmh zone when its clearly marked 100, but to a bigger supprise was the number of cars that actually over took us and many others over the speed of 120kmh that we were doing on the M4.
At one case a black UK reg audi must of overtook us at about 150-160kmh.
What really gets me is how the government have this crackdown on speed with radio ads and tv ads etc, and when it comes down to reality, we the normal speed limit abiding drivers are looked upon by these drivers as slow.
I mean whats the point.
Like should we leave wreaked out dammaged cars on the sides of roads and motorways to bring the reality of speeding home to these drivers?

Mr Magnolia

The fatalities on our roads are not happening on the dual carrageways or motorways.

We all know when the fatal accidents are taking place and what's causing them. This is when the roads need to be policed IMHO.

Saying that, 150-160kmph in a 100 zone is dangerous and not accecptable

Sparky-s wrote:

Like should we leave wreaked out dammaged cars on the sides of roads and motorways to bring the reality of speeding home to these drivers?

No, they tried this in Dundalk a few years ago, caused more accidents because people were breaking to rubber-neck.

leahcim

As far as I know the speed limit on the M4 is 120 km per hour. When it turns into the N4 at Lucan the limit is 100km per hour then it goes down to 80km at the Spa hotel and all the way past liffey valley into town.

I would say if your Mum was doing 100Km/h on the M4 you would indeed see most cars zooming past as many would be doing 120.

I agree that the police should be out catching the lunatics doing over 120 but thats another story.

Seth Brundle

@ leahcim - I think the OP is referring to the N4 Mullingar bypass which is not motorway and therefore has a max of 100km/h

Incidentally at the lucan end of the M4 (where the limit is 120km/h) the speed limit changes to 80km/h at the Leixlip Interchange when the road changes to the N4. This speed limit continues along the N4 until the M50 where it changes to 60km/h IIRC until the Chapelizod bypass which is again back to 80km/h. It later reduces to 60 and then 50km/h as you approach the roundabout at Kilmainham.

Pherekydes

leahcim wrote:

As far as I know the speed limit on the M4 is 120 km per hour. When it turns into the N4 at Lucan the limit is 100km per hour then it goes down to 80km at the Spa hotel and all the way past liffey valley into town.

The limit changes straight from 120 on the M4 (Leixlip bypass) to 80 at the Spa. People driving too slowly (not aimed at the OP) are just as bad as people driving too quickly.

mloc123

Sparky-s wrote:

over the speed of 120kmh that we were doing on the M4.
At one case a black UK reg audi must of overtook us at about 150-160kmh.

In Fairness 150kmh on a motorway is perfectly safe, when was the last time we heard of a crash on a major motorway caused by speed?

Kimbot

mloc123 wrote:

In Fairness 150kmh on a motorway is perfectly safe, when was the last time we heard of a crash on a major motorway caused by speed?

I was going down the M4 on Saturday on on the Dublin bound side of it I saw a horrific scene!! A pug 206 and a jeep in bits!! Looks like the rolled a fewq times!!

The N4/M4 is lethal!!

ballooba

A friend drove the M1 to Dundalk on Friday evening and Dundalk to Dublin on Sunday averaging between 130 and 160 Kmph.

No speed checks apart from the fixed camera between Dundalk and Drogheda (Southbound) and he could see that from about 300 metres away. Plenty of time to slow down to 120kmph.

The motorway was fairly quite and he said it felt safe at that speed.

Fey!

What astounds me is the number of people who hit the end of the M4, slow down to 75/80 coming to the Spa, then jump on the brakes at the speedtrap despite not speeding anyway!

Did the Galway/Dublin Airport/Galway run yesterday, and was pleasantly surprised that a) I only saw one moronic overtake ('98 Audi A4 overtaking a car that was overtaking a lorry coming into oncoming traffic on the Galway side of Ballinasloe), b) didn't see anyone doing warp speeds, and c) I managed to pretty much stick to the speed limit for most of the 300 odd miles despite traffic - only saw people doing 75 in a 100 zone once or twice!

mloc123

jonny24ie wrote:

I was going down the M4 on Saturday on on the Dublin bound side of it I saw a horrific scene!! A pug 206 and a jeep in bits!! Looks like the rolled a fewq times!!

The N4/M4 is lethal!!

But was this in usual M50 bumper to bumper fast moving traffic? Doing over 120kph in that is stupid but on a clear quite motorway (which the m4 is most days) its fine imo.

Wing Walker

mloc123 wrote:

In Fairness 150kmh on a motorway is perfectly safe, when was the last time we heard of a crash on a major motorway caused by speed?

I wouldn't agree there. IMHO, it's only safe to drive at 150kmh if you've been trained to drive at higher speeds in a car that's been checked on a regular basis. For instance, when was the last time you checked your tyre pressure and do you know the safe stopping distance at 150kmh? The driving test in this country is dire, as I'm sure we'd all agree. It doesn't prepare people for driving at speed. And yet many of us drive cars well capable of hitting 150 and more.

My point basically is, it's not safe to drive really at anything other than 120kmh (give or take a few) on a motorway. There's too many variables with other, less experienced (or perhaps just ignorant) drivers on the road and indeed with some road surfaces!!! How many people pull out into the overtaking lane without indicating or even checking their mirrors. Picture this happening while you've got the pedal to the metal and they pull out in front of you! I've seen the results of something similar on the M50 before and it wasn't a nice sight.

In any event, you never really gain much ground in this country by hitting the higher speeds. We all get caught up together at the next town anyway.;)

Kimbot

mloc123 wrote:

But was this in usual M50 bumper to bumper fast moving traffic? Doing over 120kph in that is stupid but on a clear quite motorway (which the m4 is most days) its fine imo.

Road was empty!! I didn't see the crash itself only the remains!! The amount of ambulances and fire engines making its way to it was large!!

RobAMerc

Wing Walker wrote:

I wouldn't agree there. IMHO, it's only safe to drive at 150kmh if you've been trained to drive at higher speeds in a car that's been checked on a regular basis.

Come on 150kph is a doddle for any car once it is in reasonable nick and should be for any driver (except your average Irish driver) who can drive at all. GO to the continent and do some driving, 120 is acceptable on a two lane road, it is not fast.

Wing Walker wrote:

My point basically is, it's not safe to drive really at anything other than 120kmh (give or take a few) on a motorway. There's too many variables with other, less experienced (or perhaps just ignorant) drivers on the road and indeed with some road surfaces!!!

Even 120 is not safe in this country as the roads are full to the brim with morons. But your idea that 120 is safe and 150 not because thats the law is a bit too simplisitc.

Wing Walker

RobAMerc wrote:

Come on 150kph is a doddle for any car once it is in reasonable nick and should be for any driver (except your average Irish driver) who can drive at all. GO to the continent and do some driving, 120 is acceptable on a two lane road, it is not fast.

Even 120 is not safe in this country as the roads are full to the brim with morons. But your idea that 120 is safe and 150 not because thats the law is a bit too simplisitc.

No, I'll readily admit that prior to the penalty points, I regularly hit 150 and more. I considered that my driving was safe, I didn't weave in and out through traffic and I didn't do it unless there was a low volume of traffic on the roads.

Having driven on the continent, I've seen how easy it is to move quickly and not even come close to having an accident. If you're motoring down the outside lane of the autostrada and the guy in front of you is moving slower, he simply pulls over (if you haven't already indicated), lets you by and then moves back into his rhythm. No flashing lights, no tailgating, just decent road manners. You don't get that in this country.

I don't agree that 120kph is the right speed for some of our roads. But until such time as the "morons" can learn they're not going to change the law.

Mr Magnolia

Wing Walker wrote:

No, I'll readily admit that prior to the penalty points, I regularly hit 150 and more. I considered that my driving was safe, I didn't weave in and out through traffic and I didn't do it unless there was a low volume of traffic on the roads.

Having driven on the continent, I've seen how easy it is to move quickly and not even come close to having an accident. If you're motoring down the outside lane of the autostrada and the guy in front of you is moving slower, he simply pulls over (if you haven't already indicated), lets you by and then moves back into his rhythm. No flashing lights, no tailgating, just decent road manners. You don't get that in this country.

I don't agree that 120kph is the right speed for some of our roads. But until such time as the "morons" can learn they're not going to change the law.

*applauds*

Mayshine

Got to agree with you, spend the last 8 months driving in the UK, frequent drives down the M6 from Glasgow to Manchester and further. Cruise control at 85-90 mph and you would be at median speed.

No one would be drving below 70-75 (120kmp) and no one above 100 (160kph). Perfectly safe.

Difference between here and UK and is that most of their motorways are 3 lane which makes overtaking even safer. The other is the curtesy and awareness that drivers show each other.

Sadly Ireland has neither

mloc123

Wing Walker wrote:

No, I'll readily admit that prior to the penalty points, I regularly hit 150 and more. I considered that my driving was safe, I didn't weave in and out through traffic and I didn't do it unless there was a low volume of traffic on the roads.

Having driven on the continent, I've seen how easy it is to move quickly and not even come close to having an accident. If you're motoring down the outside lane of the autostrada and the guy in front of you is moving slower, he simply pulls over (if you haven't already indicated), lets you by and then moves back into his rhythm. No flashing lights, no tailgating, just decent road manners. You don't get that in this country.

I don't agree that 120kph is the right speed for some of our roads. But until such time as the "morons" can learn they're not going to change the law.

My personal hate is people who don't seem to think they have to indicate when changing lanes and also people who think once they indicate they can just swap lanes regardless of whos coming from behind.

Sparky

mloc123 wrote:

My personal hate is people who don't seem to think they have to indicate when changing lanes and also people who think once they indicate they can just swap lanes regardless of whos coming from behind.

Yeah this I seen a lot of. I feel safe in a car, and even so when I am driving, by having a good distance between the car in front of me, but I really hate drivers that overtake you at the full speed limit, only to cut your distance in half by cutting in front of you.

For the record, we were doing 120kph on the M4. Many might think its ok to do 130+, but I dont think the guards will see it that way.

jimmycrackcorm

It's a lie to suggest that speed kills. If it was the case then formula one wouldn't last very long as the drivers woudl all be dead from speeding.

Inappropriate speed does kill though! but that has no direct bearing on the spurious speed limits we have around the country.

Seth Brundle

WRT to balloba's point about driving the length of the M1 without coming across a speed check - don't forget that the M1 is (AFAIK) quite popular with speed detecting unmarked cars.

ballooba

Yeah, there was nothing that looked remotely like a police car on the road though. (According to my friend).

Mostly yellow regs.

I presume the guards wouldn't be doing motorway patrols in anything over 5 years old? Definitely not over 10?

HelterSkelter

Wing Walker wrote:

I wouldn't agree there. IMHO, it's only safe to drive at 150kmh if you've been trained to drive at higher speeds in a car that's been checked on a regular basis.

And who in this country has been trained to drive at 120kmh? Not many. I was trained to drive at up to 40mph for the driving test. Does this mean the majority of people should stick to 40mph???

JamesM

jimmycrackcorm wrote:

It's a lie to suggest that speed kills. If it was the case then formula one wouldn't last very long as the drivers woudl all be dead from speeding.

I could say, "That's a stupid statement", but I'll put it down to your youth and inexperience
In the late 60s my brother had a chart on his bedroom wall with pictures and names of the current F1 drivers. Within about 5 years almost half of them were dead :eek:
Nowadays the drivers in the F1 cars are protected in a cocoon and the tracks have run off areas and there is almost nothing to hit if you go off at speed. BUT, If you go out in your standard saloon and loose control (eg. a puncture) at 120 +, there is no protection from poles, trees etc. I don't fancy your chances.
Jim.

Gerry

Couple of points here.
It was said that people who do over 120 kph are "lunatics". Where does this distinction occur? Is 125kph lunacy?
The m4 and m1 are both good quality roads. There should be no issue with doing a steady 80 - 90 mph on these roads, indeed I've often done this on the m1, not worth it as much on the m4, as theres only a short 120kph stretch.
However, its only worth doing when the road is nearly empty. Otherwise, you just have to contend with an endless stream of morons who hog the fast lane. Its not worth getting angry about any more, there are just too many.
As other posters have said, 80 - 85 is a medium speed on uk motorways. I've brought 2 cars back from england, both times I had to do 80 - 85 to make the boat, but this was about the average speed on the road.
The only reason this can't work here, is Irish drivers. As pointed out above, Irish drivers are not trained to drive at anything over 40mph, due to the farcical driving test which decides if you can drive from one side of a town to the other.
Until Irish driving improves, significant speed ( ie 160 kph ) is best left until the road is completely empty. That won't happen until the government stops thinking it can train and educate drivers with some ads, drops its mantra on speed being the problem, and starts some decent driver training. For all drivers, not just new ones.

unkel

Couldn't agree more, Gerry

Parts of the M1 and M4 are suitable for driving safely over 120km/h when very quiet imho. I rarely go over 120km/h on the M50 these days even when it is fairly quiet. I'm more on the edge doing 120km/h in my BMW 7-series on that road than I'd be doing 150km/h in a Fiat Punto driving on an equally quiet Autobahn or Autoroute...

The problem in this country is people, not roads or cars

Gerry wrote:

not worth it as much on the m4, as theres only a short 120kph stretch

Since recently, the M4 120km/h limit stretches from Leixlip all the way to the Mullingar bypass afaik, only broken by toll booths in the middle somewhere

jimmycrackcorm

JamesM wrote:

I could say, "That's a stupid statement", but I'll put it down to your youth and inexperience
In the late 60s my brother had a chart on his bedroom wall with pictures and names of the current F1 drivers. Within about 5 years almost half of them were dead :eek:
Nowadays the drivers in the F1 cars are protected in a cocoon and the tracks have run off areas and there is almost nothing to hit if you go off at speed. BUT, If you go out in your standard saloon and loose control (eg. a puncture) at 120 +, there is no protection from poles, trees etc. I don't fancy your chances.
Jim.

I'm flattered that my prose effects such an impression of youth. I would re-emphasize my point in my posting that it is not speed that kills but the circumstances, as indeed you have pointed out. F1 is much safer because of those circumstances.

Wing Walker

jimmycrackcorm wrote:

I would re-emphasize my point in my posting that it is not speed that kills but the circumstances...

Agree with you there. Like others have said before, you can drive at speed quite safely. But combine speed with say drink or a crappy road surface and you've got a lethal combination.

BTW for regular users of the M4 there's a marked traffic cop car which is "catching" people on the slip roads onto the M4 as well as chasing people down while they're on it. I'm not exactly sure which station this is based in as I've seen it between Kilcock and Lucan. Maybe it's free-roamer?

JamesM

jimmycrackcorm wrote:

I'm flattered that my prose effects such an impression of youth. I would re-emphasize my point in my posting that it is not speed that kills but the circumstances, as indeed you have pointed out. F1 is much safer because of those circumstances.

Sorry about the "Stupid" remark
You just reminded me of the time I stood in front of that poster and realised that such a large number of those guys had been killed in crashes - all names and faces I knew so well.
Jim.

Seth Brundle

Wing Walker wrote:

BTW for regular users of the M4 there's a marked traffic cop car which is "catching" people on the slip roads onto the M4 as well as chasing people down while they're on it. I'm not exactly sure which station this is based in as I've seen it between Kilcock and Lucan. Maybe it's free-roamer?

I have seen this along the N4 also - a 4x4 parked on the slip road onto the outbound carriageway at woodies. Well hidden in the scrub that you won't know hes there until he has you.
I have also seen them parked on the slip road of the M7 around Portlaoise, presumably catching folk speeding on the motorway. I wouldn't have thought it was the safest place to park, especially now since we have the rest stops along the motorways for them to park on!

Nuttzz

I was on the M4 back to Dublin yesterday and was followed by a marked traffic corps car, we over took a corsa with a pallet tied to its roof, no roof rack, just a wooden pallet with rope around it, i pulled in front of pallet man and the coppers just kept going, surely driving at 100km/h on a motorway with a pallet tied the roof isnt the safest thing in the world.....

Alun

Nuttzz wrote:

I was on the M4 back to Dublin yesterday and was followed by a marked traffic corps car, we over took a corsa with a pallet tied to its roof, no roof rack, just a wooden pallet with rope around it, a pulled in front of pallet man and the coppers just kept going, surely driving at 100km/h on a motorway with a pallet tied the roof isnt the safest thing in the world.....

That's just plain crazy. And you can bet your bottom dollar that if you'd been "speeding" at, say, 140km/h he'd have pulled you over in preference to "pallet man". Traffic Corps my @rse.