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Sipefree

Hello people-

I'm new here at boards.ie. I used to look through the topics every now and then but I guess I was intimidated by the large amount of forums.

I'm a 15 year old atheist living in Dub-eh-lin. Needless to say my R.E. Junior Cert is going to be a good laugh. I drew pink stick figures all over my Mock and I don't see why the real thing shouldn't be any different, eh?

Around school they call me the "Atheist Boy", haha, I'm pretty much the only one in my school except for two communist guys in 2nd and 4th year respectively.

Well then... uhh... hello to all of you I guess.

-Sipefree.

Scofflaw

And welcome! I'm sure one of the elders will be around in a while to make that sound a little more official though!

cordially,
Scofflaw

Sipefree

Sipefree wrote:

Hello people-

I'm new here at boards.ie. I used to look through the topics every now and then but I guess I was intimidated by the large amount of forums.

I'm a 15 year old atheist living in Dub-eh-lin. Needless to say my R.E. Junior Cert is going to be a good laugh. I drew pink stick figures all over my Mock and I don't see why the real thing shouldn't be any different, eh?

Around school they call me the "Atheist Boy", haha, I'm pretty much the only one in my school except for two communist guys in 2nd and 4th year respectively.

Well then... uhh... hello to all of you I guess.

-Sipefree.

You could always try explaining in the RE JC exam why you think they're wrong in an intelligent manner... atheism =/= rudeness...

Tar.Aldarion

Welcome.

*Initiates elder ritual #3*

Tar.Aldarion

Tar.Aldarion wrote:

Welcome.

*Initiates elder ritual #3*

Crossing the desert???

elivsvonchiaing

Well Hi!

Just read the stickies in any forum and you can't go too far wrong if you obey they rules.

Any debate on your beliefs should be backed-up by logical argument - unless you you just want fun; see cuckoos nest etc.

Just a suggestion: I am not a mod - but you need to remember they are out there before you post.

Scofflaw

bluewolf wrote:

Crossing the desert???

No, that's the one with the pebbles.

cordially,
Scofflaw

Scofflaw

Scofflaw wrote:

No, that's the one with the pebbles.

cordially,
Scofflaw

What

Scofflaw

bluewolf wrote:

What

Ah, grasshopper, you are confused?

cordially,
Scofflaw

Scofflaw

Scofflaw wrote:

Ah, grasshopper, you are confused?

cordially,
Scofflaw

Unless I've forgotten the rest of the simpsons episode I was quoting, yes...

Scofflaw

bluewolf wrote:

Unless I've forgotten the rest of the simpsons episode I was quoting, yes...

Oops. Generation gap? Kung Fu? David Carradine?

cordially,
Scofflaw

lostexpectation

Sipefree wrote:

Hello people-

I'm new here at boards.ie. I used to look through the topics every now and then but I guess I was intimidated by the large amount of forums.

I'm a 15 year old atheist living in Dub-eh-lin. Needless to say my R.E. Junior Cert is going to be a good laugh. I drew pink stick figures all over my Mock and I don't see why the real thing shouldn't be any different, eh?

Around school they call me the "Atheist Boy", haha, I'm pretty much the only one in my school except for two communist guys in 2nd and 4th year respectively.

Well then... uhh... hello to all of you I guess.

-Sipefree.

welcome I stopped doing my exams in fifth yr, now there a thumbs up for parents I didn't do my religion exam and never told them till i got my report and they let it go...

please ask your teacher why believing in supernaturnal power is the norm and our the odd one out for me

Sangre

JC Religion is not about making you believe in a religion. Its the study of what people believe in and how it affects their thoughts/decisions.

So get over yourself, do the exam and stop being a arrogant know-it-all.

lostexpectation

Sangre wrote:

JC Religion is not about making you believe in a religion. Its the study of what people believe in and how it affects their thoughts/decisions.

So get over yourself, do the exam and stop being a arrogant know-it-all.

now thats harsh if not entirely untrue,

i doubt it has actually changed that much since I was at school, catholicism still the default,im sure its broader now but I seriously doubt it has raised to the level of "the study of what people believe in and how it affects their thoughts/decisions".

that would be impressive.

Think of this way the fact that there is even a class about religion in the first place??

Asiaprod

Welcome, seeker of truth:)

Tar.Aldarion

Scofflaw wrote:

Oops. Generation gap? Kung Fu? David Carradine?

cordially,
Scofflaw

Great show.

Sangre

Its not just religion class, its Junior Cert Religious Studies (a State exam).
Even the fact that he is known as 'atheist boy' gives an indication that he probably openly mocks 'religion', with this only being reinforced by messing up a state exam.

All zealots are annoying, its irrelevant if they're religious or not.

Rev Hellfire

Sangre has hit the nail on the head when it comes to religion class. Having an understanding of religion(s) regardless of if you believe in it or not is a beneficial skill to have in this day and age for no other reason than it is a major political force both on a local and global level. And while Ireland is certainly becoming a more secular place it would be a foolish and complacent man who thought that religion and its influence is waning on the global scale. One need only look to our cousins in the states and their emerging theocracy.

robindch

Firstly - sipefree, welcome to the forum!

> [Rev Hellfire] Having an understanding of religion(s) regardless of if you
> believe in it or not is a beneficial skill to have in this day and age

Yes, and I will bet you a beer of your choice that not one school teacher in the country is suggesting to the good folks in school that (a) religion can be explained fully as a mutable cultural entity feeding off natural human needs, rather than something handed down from heaven on a silver platter and (b) that the history of the church generally consists of it propping up the local powers-that-be, in the few instances where it wasn't the powers-that-be itself. Unless religion is taught in this truthful way, rather than credulously as it is (to my knowledge), then I suggest that very few people are going to understand religion for what it is...

Crucifix

Welcome!
I'd be interested in hearing what your religion class is like Sipefree.

Back in my day it was straight foward catholic dogma, but I'd love to hear if there's even been a small bit of progress.

Rev Hellfire

That's one bet I'll not be taking

I’d agree with you to a point on the idea that a greater focus on sociological interactions between religions and society both contemporary and historical should be taught (assuming there isn’t already, I’m a long time out of school). But I’m not sure that the religious education class is the forum for such a thing. Civic or History would be more suitable to my mind. Certainly a grounding in the basics of the major religions should be given and the subject thought in a somewhat more academic manner.

Asiaprod

Crucifix wrote:

Back in my day it was straight foward catholic dogma, but I'd love to hear if there's even been a small bit of progress.

Back in my day it was some burly Christian Brother who would tell you to stand in front of the class and demanded

"Boy, name the The Ten Commandments," they did tend to shout a lot and forget your name
"Eh, the what?" answerd the future Buddhist in training
<Bang, as a fist, a hand or some missile landed with pin-point accuracy on either ear>
The same loud voice then issued the command "Stand in the corner till you can come up here and repeat them off by heart, backward"
Damn, now I not only had to learn them, I had to learn them backward too. I remember thing that if this was the type of person I could expect to meet in heaven, I was not going.

Dades

Welcome Sipefree.
You've obviously strong feelings on the matter but I suggest you heed Bluewolf's excellent suggestion that you put pen to paper in an intelligent manner rather than just messing up your exam paper. Doing so might move you from an atheist whose position is seen merely an act of rebellion, to one whose position is a result of serious thought.

There's certainly more respect for the latter, and not just in this forum. Go forth and read some Carl Sagan or Richard Dawkins this summer. Religion studies doesn't have to be in school.

Asiaprod wrote:

Back in my day it was some burly Christian Brother who would tell you to stand in front of the class and demanded

Not any more as of today...

From the Independent:

Brothers to quit schools after two centuries

Lay people will take control in watershed for education system

THE Christian Brothers are planning to end two centuries of direct involvement in primary and secondary education in Ireland.

They are finalising arrangements to hand over 29 primary and 109 secondary schools to a charitable trust run entirely by lay people.

The setting up of the Edmund Rice Schools Trust (ERST) represents one of the most significant changes in Irish education for decades.

In future, the role of the Brothers will be confined largely to an education office and the provision of back-up education services to schools.

A charter outlining the education and religious philosophy of ERST schools will be launched in September. The schools will operate in the tradition of Edmund Rice who founded the Brothers in 1802. Principles of spiritual development, equality and social justice will be strongly emphasised.

Son Goku

Rev Hellfire wrote:

That's one bet I'll not be taking

I’d agree with you to a point on the idea that a greater focus on sociological interactions between religions and society both contemporary and historical should be taught (assuming there isn’t already, I’m a long time out of school). But I’m not sure that the religious education class is the forum for such a thing. Civic or History would be more suitable to my mind. Certainly a grounding in the basics of the major religions should be given and the subject thought in a somewhat more academic manner.

Well just going by what my brother tells me of his school and friends in other schools*, even though the curriculum sounds like a decent one, most of the teachers are still simply ardent Catholics who'll skip over Buddhism and Jainism so they can spend most of the time preaching about "Our Lord".

*not exactly a survey of massive statistical significance I'll admit.

lostexpectation

The Atheist wrote:

Welcome Sipefree.
You've obviously strong feelings on the matter but I suggest you heed Bluewolf's excellent suggestion that you put pen to paper in an intelligent manner rather than just messing up your exam paper. Doing so might move you from an atheist whose position is seen merely an act of rebellion, to one whose position is a result of serious thought.

There's certainly more respect for the latter, and not just in this forum. Go forth and read some Carl Sagan or Richard Dawkins this summer. Religion studies doesn't have to be in school.

Not any more as of today...

From the Independent:

*dances* there was bit on news 2 last night, about cork nuns who are all old and are moving out of their convent to a smaller retirement place, they are introducing some retreat type place for girls though.

Son Goku

Son Goku wrote:

Well just going by what my brother tells me of his school and friends in other schools*, even though the curriculum sounds like a decent one, most of the teachers are still simply ardent Catholics who'll skip over Buddhism and Jainism so they can spend most of the time preaching about "Our Lord".

*not exactly a survey of massive statistical significance I'll admit.

I'm glad I went to a non-denom secondary school...

Zombrex

Firstly welcome.

Secondly, I would recommend not failing your Junior Cert religious exam.

While I wouldn't be as harsh as Sangre (I don't think it was necessary to call you a know it all), education and knowledge about any subject, including world religions, is a good thing (ummmkay). You don't have to believe in it, but knowledge of it is better than ignorance of it.

Scofflaw

Scofflaw wrote:

Oops. Generation gap? Kung Fu? David Carradine?

cordially,
Scofflaw

*shakes her head*
vaguely...

Dades

bluewolf wrote:

I'm glad I went to a non-denom secondary school...

Honestly, I'm glad I didn't.

The Atheist

The Atheist wrote:

Honestly, I'm glad I didn't.

What kinda stuff did you do?

Stephen

Son Goku wrote:

Well just going by what my brother tells me of his school and friends in other schools*, even though the curriculum sounds like a decent one, most of the teachers are still simply ardent Catholics who'll skip over Buddhism and Jainism so they can spend most of the time preaching about "Our Lord".

*not exactly a survey of massive statistical significance I'll admit.

My school days ended five years ago but that sounds pretty much exactly how the religion course was there too. You'd get the lightest mention of anything non-Catholic, followed by months of waffle about the 'one true god'.:rolleyes:
What made it entertaining though was the ridiculously angry christian brother we had for it, he'd spend most of the class shouting and roaring at people... he was so very easy to wind up.

Dades

bluewolf wrote:

What kinda stuff did you do?

I don't recall too much. Religion class was never taken seriously. There were bible story studies I suppose and we had a really enthusiastic lay-teacher for years. I even went to Medjugorje.

I don't believe the indoctination kids go through in school is so influential. Ultimately they can, and will make up there own minds. Many will decide they want or need religion, and the rest will exist happily without it.

Zombrex

The Atheist wrote:

I don't recall too much. Religion class was never taken seriously.

Why are you glad you didn't go to a non-demoniational school though?

Dades

Wicknight wrote:

Why are you glad you didn't go to a non-demoniational school though?

Because it was a good school, and some of the priests were the best teachers. Not saying I wouldn't have been as well off in a non-denom school, just that I'd never diss my own RC school education.

Sipefree

Haha okay people I was joking about messing up my exam. I'm not actually that bigheadded.

I find that using religion class as a medium for discussion is futile. Religion teachers just try to teach the bull**** course (and yes, it is bull****, as a matter of fact; it teaches such things that intelligent design is a fact and that sex should be before marriage) and avoid all the questions posed to them.

I'm known as Atheist Boy not because I openly mock religious views, but because the people who call me it are 15 and have been indoctrinated since their birth.

I think it's a sad reflection on some of you to go making assumptions about the way I conduct myself without waiting for me to post more.

Oh and as for the heads up about the mods, thanks but I don't need it. I've been on plenty of forums before. I ain't no n00b.

-Sipefree.

HealingBlight

Oh, I think it was my 2nd year religion teacher who talked allot about Medjugorje, infact, earned the nickname 'Medjugorje man' (Its amazing what the average 14-15 year old can come up with, Atheist boy and Medjugorje man!).
This is when I was already seeing and thinking the obvious origin of any/original god being the 'god of the gaps' type. Thing is, I was one of about 3 in a class of almost 30 who went to mass once a week, I was a batter christian than most christians.
Lucky enough I never had to do any religion tests, how the hell can you get a right answer on a test when you cant get a single clear answer in real life?

The best view about religion is a secular; otherwise it would be biased to one religion (its kind of, "I'm not racist, I have everyone equally", but its the most level way to view religion, lets point out that atheist is not a religion). It's also good to point out that faith is, holding the belief in something despite the lack of evidence or evidence against it. Which is why you need faith for god.
I’m sure that if you asked what the name of the Christian god was, they couldn’t tell you.

Fun school experience, my 6th year religion teacher suddenly remembered to start classes with prayer after the class where I said I was an atheist (funny enough one student didn’t know what an atheist was). No other teacher did it for some reason, and I don't think any other classes did it, of course I was the only one to sit when all others were standing.

BTW Sipefree, -PLEASE- post something that points out that the idea that ‘ID is FACT’ is being taught directly to students in any class, scan the page or something. I ****ing well hope that you slipped on a banana peel, hit your head on the keyboard and that **** was typed, there is no way in hell they could say that ID was fact, its a complete and utter mess, and I'm sure most the Biology teachers in the country could point out HOW MUCH **** it is, and that teaching the students such is completely unfair. I don't care if they are talking about it in a religion class as a viewpoint of faith, but if they dare state its fact, there is something wrong going on.

This post was a bit rambely, errr, sorry. :P

rainbow kirby

Could be worse... I had a 78 year old nun for a religion teacher in 6th year, and she kicked me out of her class for suggesting that I was an atheist. She suddenly dragged me back to her class when she found out I was using the free periods to study for Applied Maths - a subject she deemed "not ladylike". This was only 4 years ago, and thankfully she's since retired so she won't be inflicted on my sister's year group. Ever.

MagnumForce

They started having R.E. as a J.C. exam the year after i did the Junior Cert, in 2000/2001 or something like that. I was in De La Salle, a catholic school and the course was aimed at "teaching pupils about their faith", They did however also incorperate alot of teachings about other religions into the course, which was a good idea.

But there were two problems.

First of all, learning about other religions is fine and all, but only if you have one to begin with, otherwise its a whole load of meaningless crap, like a Classical Studies class about mythology expect they expect you to believe it all.

Secondly, The muslim pupils in the school were excused from attending R.E. classes, despite the fact that their religion was learned about in said class also. I tried numerous times to be excused from attending R.E. class but was outright rejected each time! Apperanly my rational lack of belief of a deity from birth was not as valid as a bunch of crazy people talking about supernatural bollox!

Fallen Seraph

Sipefree wrote:

Religion teachers just try to teach the bull**** course [...] and avoid all the questions posed to them.

I think it's a sad reflection on some of you to go making assumptions about the way I conduct myself without waiting for me to post more.

Ah, well observed. It's unreasonable of people here to form an opinion of you based on your words, but completely reasonable for you to make a blanket statement about all of Ireland's religion teachers.

Rev Hellfire

Lets not even include in this fact that he also felt the need to embellish his post with lies about his actions. It seems to me that most of the responses have stemmed from that initial comment which he has since retracted.
Yet another sheep giving the usual clichés they feel their peers wish to hear and no knowledge to back it up.

Sipefree

Sipefree wrote:

it teaches such things that sex should be before marriage

Nothing wrong with that

Dades

MagnumForce wrote:

a bunch of crazy people talking about supernatural bollox!

Don't think I'd quite endorse that description, knowing a few "crazies" myself.
Are you sure you weren't watching an episode of "LOST"?

Tar.Aldarion

Lost makes more sense than religion.
*worships hurley*

Dades

Tar.Aldarion wrote:

Lost makes more sense than religion.

They do have common characteristics.
Both require you sit through a frustrating 45 minutes of unanswered questions every week.

Tar.Aldarion

With a lovely recap of everything that has happened so far.

MagnumForce

The Atheist wrote:

Don't think I'd quite endorse that description, knowing a few "crazies" myself.
Are you sure you weren't watching an episode of "LOST"?

well, if you think about it, for all intents and purposes, if for example a fundementalist christian was analyised by a psychiatrist who had never heard of religion before, the shrink would have them commited to a mental asylum diagnosing them with paranoid schitzophrenia and class them a danger to others.

and now that i think of it, Lost is alot like sitting through an R.E. class or a religious ceremony alright!

robindch

> if for example a fundementalist christian was analyised by a
> psychiatrist who had never heard of religion before

...that's more or less what Daniel Dennett's recent (fairly good) Breaking the Spell: Religion as a Natural Phenomenon proposes -- how on earth would you explain religion to somebody who'd just arrived from Mars?

Funsterdelux

Even though I used not go to mass/oratory, I used to go to the hall or just stay in the classroom, my religion teacher, the principal and I had an understanding, for some unknown reason. Still, some of the best debates we had were in religion class even though I'd have the class in stitches, when giving reasons why I couldnt write for him, I'd say I had a stroke down my right side and that my arm was dead and start shaking it like it was life-less, great auld times.