Thom Yorke - The Eraser, Leaked!

Giblet

Poor bastards, can't keep anything under wraps.

John

Well who's fault is that? If they can't trust anyone, don't give anyone copies of the album before it's released! Unless it's deliberate. The dastard.

maquiladora

The leak is hardly surprising considering the fact that the record was actually sent to Radiohead fansites such as Atease. More likely than not Thom doesn't care if its out there in the public domain, I really doubt he's made this record for financial reasons.

John

Please don't discuss the album, if you've downloaded it, you shouldn't have. I'll leave this thread open once it's only about the concept of leaking but I'd prefer to take a hardline approach towards illegal downloading on this forum. It's in the charter about leaked albums anyway.

HarryHoudini

John2 wrote:

Please don't discuss the album, if you've downloaded it, you shouldn't have. I'll leave this thread open once it's only about the concept of leaking but I'd prefer to take a hardline approach towards illegal downloading on this forum. It's in the charter about leaked albums anyway.

Whats wrong with people discussing the album!? Who is to say that eveyone thats heard it has downloaded it!

dream brother

John2 wrote:

Please don't discuss the album, if you've downloaded it, you shouldn't have.

and then

maquiladora wrote:

The leak is hardly surprising considering the fact that the record was actually sent to Radiohead fansites such as Atease.

QED my man!

Are the songs done acousticly or more along the lines of KID A etc?

Giblet

A promo was sent for review, not to leak all over the internet!

DerekD Goldfish

John2 wrote:

Please don't discuss the album, if you've downloaded it, you shouldn't have. I'll leave this thread open once it's only about the concept of leaking but I'd prefer to take a hardline approach towards illegal downloading on this forum. It's in the charter about leaked albums anyway.

A come on you cant be serious?
I can understand banning links to illigal downloads on a public forum but not being able to discuss an album till its officials released is a load of crap
Ive bought tons of radiohead albums and paid to see them a number of times I cant see how discussing an album by thom yorke will harm him in any way as I will probably buy it anyway.
Altough its a completly different argument I beleive downloading wheather legal or illigal increases sales the music industry would be in a far worse state it if wasnt for downloads keeping demand at a decent level.

RE*AC*TOR

lets all bury our heads in the sand!!

I hear its all the rage.

RE*AC*TOR

I don't even care about Radiohead - but because of this horse****, i might reconsider. Now its forbidden fruit.

It was bad enough that Karl decided to pursue this puritarian line on rock/metal - this is authoritarian puritarian crap.

What is the reason for this? John2 - does this really benefit the forum? Conversely would allowing the discussion hurt anyone?

This is not a boards.ie policy, this is a moralistic stance taken by Karl Hungus and Doctor J.

Utter ****ing nonsense.


http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2054939982

John

RE*AC*TOR wrote:

I don't even care about Radiohead - but because of this horse****, i might reconsider. Now its forbidden fruit.

It was bad enough that Karl decided to pursue this puritarian line on rock/metal - this is authoritarian puritarian crap.

What is the reason for this? John2 - does this really benefit the forum? Conversely would allowing the discussion hurt anyone?

This is not a boards.ie policy, this is a moralistic stance taken by Karl Hungus and Doctor J.

Utter ****ing nonsense.

Right, I've discussed this with Doctor J and I agree with him. Illegal downloading is a sticky legal area, the last thing I want is for boards.ie to become a target for IRMA or some other ****ehawks. I see it like discussions on drugs, they're illegal but discussion about them is fine but you don't want people openly discussing when, where and how they've scored their latest hit. There should be enough music out there that's legally released for healthy discussion on a forum like this. Yes a new album by Thom Yorke or Tool is going to be hotly anticipated but remember that ten years ago you'd just have to wait for it to come out.

As far as I'm concerned, unless a band makes an official statement that it is ok to download a leaked album I don't think it should be discussed.

Anyway, being a reasonable man I'm leaving this thread open for debate. If anyone has any informed thoughts on this from any side of the argument, please speak up.

Karl Hungus

RE*AC*TOR wrote:

I don't even care about Radiohead - but because of this horse****, i might reconsider. Now its forbidden fruit.

It was bad enough that Karl decided to pursue this puritarian line on rock/metal - this is authoritarian puritarian crap.

What is the reason for this? John2 - does this really benefit the forum? Conversely would allowing the discussion hurt anyone?

This is not a boards.ie policy, this is a moralistic stance taken by Karl Hungus and Doctor J.

Utter ****ing nonsense.

It is not nonsense by any stretch of the imagination!

Boards.ie is liable for what is posted on it. Fact. Music companies and certain bands have been extremely vigorous when pursuing music pirates. Fact. Now think what might happen if any music authority wanted to pursue boards? It's not a stretch of the imagination that boards might have to hand over the identities of the people who are discussing illegally downloaded material.

Don't mistake this for a moralistic stance. If you're downloading things illegally, then it's hardly any of my business, but just don't get boards.ie into trouble aswell.

And honestly, is it too much to ask that people hold their tongues untill the album is officially released? Are you that much of a prick that you'd go out of your way and download an album, and discuss it, even when you know boards.ie is responsible for the content of the site, all out of sheer spite? That's an incredibly childish stance to take on an issue that has serious repercussions for boards.

Lunar Junkie

Fine, deleted my post on the album. Though I have to agree, banning discussion of it seems more than a little paranoid - do you really think Boards.ie will be liable for actions that people who happen to post on it have committed? It's not like we're posting links for where to get hold of it.

honru

Isn't it impossible to prove that people in question downloaded it illegally?

I'm sure promoting the actual act and publishing links would make boards liable, aswell as uncredible, but I haven't really seen anything that would make my eye twitch, and I have an understanding that everyone has a positive intention.

Karl Hungus

f®eak s&#169 wrote: »

Isn't it impossible to prove that people in question downloaded it illegally?

It's not impossible for the police to raid your house if they suspect you're doing something illegal.

Zaph

Does anyone know when the official release date is?

honru

I don't think a post giving an opinion about an album has any grounds for illegal action.

Karl Hungus

f®eak s&#169 wrote: »

I don't think a post giving an opinion about an album has any grounds for illegal action.

Even an album that hasn't been legally released yet, and the only way you could have heard it is by obtaining by illegal means? Are you saying the authorities wouldn't get suspicious about that?

honru

The poster could have been sent a promo copy for review. Someone could know the band. Someone could have listened to tracks from the album on MySpace etc.

These are not likely scenarios, but they are not impossible either.

Don't get me wrong, I fully agree with the "no disscussing downloading" rule, but who am I to judge how people are listening to what they're talking about?

John

If someone posts "I just heard this at myspace" or "I've gotten a promo of the new album by X" then I'll give them the benefit of the doubt (unless everyone starts using these statements as euphamisms). I get promos all the time but usually wait until the album is out before discussing it. However, when a thread is called "Thom Yorke - The Eraser, Leaked!" and people start discussing the album, it doesn't take Hercule Poirot to put two and two together.

RE*AC*TOR

John2 wrote:

Right, I've discussed this with Doctor J and I agree with him. Illegal downloading is a sticky legal area, the last thing I want is for boards.ie to become a target for IRMA or some other ****ehawks.

that's fine I agree, nobody wants that.

John2 wrote:

I see it like discussions on drugs, they're illegal but discussion about them is fine but you don't want people openly discussing when, where and how they've scored their latest hit. There should be enough music out there that's legally released for healthy discussion on a forum like this. Yes a new album by Thom Yorke or Tool is going to be hotly anticipated but remember that ten years ago you'd just have to wait for it to come out.

Ten years ago? well ten years ago there was no boards.ie. Why stop there? Perhaps you would like us to mail our contribution to the Alt/Indie forum in by post?

John2 wrote:

As far as I'm concerned, unless a band makes an official statement that it is ok to download a leaked album I don't think it should be discussed.

Why not? This forum is for the discussion of music. Leaked music is still music. As long as boards.ie didn't facilitate the leaking, or help people download it, then I don't see how anything could EVER come of it. People discuss leaked things all the time. Leaked government documents, leaky taps etc.

RE*AC*TOR

Karl Hungus wrote:

It is not nonsense by any stretch of the imagination!

yes it is.

Karl Hungus wrote:

Boards.ie is liable for what is posted on it. Fact. Music companies and certain bands have been extremely vigorous when pursuing music pirates. Fact. Now think what might happen if any music authority wanted to pursue boards? It's not a stretch of the imagination that boards might have to hand over the identities of the people who are discussing illegally downloaded material.

Point out to me one case (in any jurisdiction) where a forum was pursued because somone posted on it discussing an album not yet commercially available (without giving information on how to get it, or any of the other "real world" liabilities that we are familiar with).

Karl Hungus wrote:

Don't mistake this for a moralistic stance. If you're downloading things illegally, then it's hardly any of my business, but just don't get boards.ie into trouble aswell.

You're right, its not any of you business. Also its common knowledge to the extent of a forums liability. This doesn't fall within that bracket. That's why its not DeV or CLoud making this decision, instead a zealot mod. I thought it was a mods job to enforce the rules, not make them up?

Karl Hungus wrote:

And honestly, is it too much to ask that people hold their tongues untill the album is officially released?

Yes. It is. Especially because your reasons are nonsense.

Karl Hungus wrote:

Are you that much of a prick that you'd go out of your way and download an album, and discuss it, even when you know boards.ie is responsible for the content of the site, all out of sheer spite? That's an incredibly childish stance to take on an issue that has serious repercussions for boards.

I am a HUGE prick. I would download a leaked album I didn't even like out of spite (maybe even 2 leaked albums I have no interest in).

As I said, boards.ie would not be liable, if it doesn't facilitate the illegal part (ie the downloading). The discussion of the material, well that's 100% legal.

Its none of your business where any member of boards got the music they are discussing. Don't ask/ Don't tell would be a good policy. Unless someone comes on and start shouting on about torrents or limewire or newsgroups etc etc.

eth0_

What repercussions? IRMA don't give a rats ass about things being discussed on an insignificant internet message board, they're not exactly prolific in their prosecutions of file sharers ffs!

What possible consequence can there be to DISCUSSING the songs? Radiohead albums have been leaked before and I don't remember any boards mods or admins having a heart attack because people discussed the songs they downloaded.

It's not like anyone has posted links to torrent sites.

Doctor J

RE*AC*TOR wrote:

This is not a boards.ie policy, this is a moralistic stance taken by Karl Hungus and Doctor J.

Utter ****ing nonsense.

It is up to the moderator of the forum regarding what is acceptable content, there is no boards.ie policy except for the burden of proof of legality to lie with the poster. My moralistic stance is that this is no place for discussing illegally obtained items or material, be they music, drugs, car stereos, Nike trainers or anything else. You may choose to differ, but as long as the responsibility of modding a forum lies with me, I will do things my way until told otherwise and I will make no apologies or excuses for that. I fully back John2 in whatever choice he makes too. We have discussed this before, so there is no point going through the legalities of the matter again. Your copy of the music is in breach of Irish copyright law. End of story.

As I see it, all this does is announce to everyone that it's available through torrents, that it can be accessed illegally and will, no doubt, be all some people need to head to their client of choice. Should people be allowed to discuss things they stole? I don't believe this is the appropriate place, though I will raise this matter on the moderators forum to see if the smods and admins want to draw up an official Boards.ie policy.

PiE

Whatever about discussing illegal blah blah...

More likely than not Thom doesn't care if its out there in the public domain, I really doubt he's made this record for financial reasons.

You gotta be sh*tting me!

dream brother

Its all gone abit 1984!!!!
Boards.ie aren't hosting any server where you can download Thom Yorke's album so how can they be opened to be sued! By afew posts that someone else put on here! All that's happening is that afew words are getting strung together to discuss his album, hardly life threating.....as long as no one posts "I got the album on www.X.com" cause then you might have a problem! But now.....

scargill

Doctor J wrote:

As I see it, all this does is announce to everyone that it's available through torrents

thanks Doctor J - I was wondering how I might get a hold of it

goo

Doctor J wrote:

I fully back John2 in whatever choice he makes too.

Even before you know what it is?

Doctor J

Yes. He moderates this forum, it's his say what stays and what goes. We're both grown ups so if he does things differently to me I don't lose sleep about it.

dohboy

I got a leaked copy of people discussing the new Thom Yorke album, if anyone's interested.

Doctor J

dohboy wrote:

I got a leaked copy of people discussing the new Thom Yorke album, if anyone's interested.

Nicely done

dream brother

dohboy wrote:

I got a leaked copy of people discussing the new Thom Yorke album, if anyone's interested.

Give me three please!

RE*AC*TOR

Doctor J wrote:

there is no boards.ie policy except for the burden of proof of legality to lie with the poster.

Well you just made that up. If that were true then I couldn't discuss anything without first proving I legally obtained it. If that were true, the Lost forum would be dead. I can go on.

Doctor J wrote:

My moralistic stance is that this is no place for discussing illegally obtained items or material, be they music, drugs, car stereos, Nike trainers or anything else. You may choose to differ, but as long as the responsibility of modding a forum lies with me, I will do things my way until told otherwise and I will make no apologies or excuses for that. I fully back John2 in whatever choice he makes too. We have discussed this before, so there is no point going through the legalities of the matter again. Your copy of the music is in breach of Irish copyright law. End of story.

Is my discussion of that material illegal? Nope. Your moralistic stance has no place in the rules of any forums. Its your own opinion and should be kept as such, otherwise - no foul - no problem.

Doctor J wrote:

As I see it, all this does is announce to everyone that it's available through torrents, that it can be accessed illegally and will, no doubt, be all some people need to head to their client of choice. Should people be allowed to discuss things they stole?

#1 there is a difference between copyright infringement and stealing.

#2 if it doesn't but boards.ie in legal jeoprady, what's the problem (except your little crusade).

Doctor J wrote:

I don't believe this is the appropriate place, though I will raise this matter on the moderators forum to see if the smods and admins want to draw up an official Boards.ie policy.

I think the Feedback forum would be more appropriate and more transparent.

dream brother

RE*AC*TOR wrote:

Is my discussion of that material illegal? Nope.

I'm agreeing with RE*AC*TOR here because again its a discussion board not file transferring board!

Doctor J

RE*AC*TOR wrote:

Well you just made that up. If that were true then I couldn't discuss anything without first proving I legally obtained it. If that were true, the Lost forum would be dead. I can go on.

Not at all. It was put to me like that by an smod referring to the questionable legalty of the Russian mp3 sites. That is, as I said, the only Boards.ie policy I have been made aware of.

RE*AC*TOR wrote:

Is my discussion of that material illegal? Nope. Your moralistic stance has no place in the rules of any forums. Its your own opinion and should be kept as such, otherwise - no foul - no problem.

You're the one who brought up the moralistic stance as you put it. I am not the moderator of this forum. I have no say in how this forum is moderated as I have already stated. I do, however, have a say in the running of the forums I moderate. That is the job of a moderator. If you don't feel I am doing a good job or you don't like that feel free to start a thread on feedback. There is no drug discussion forum. The difference between Lost and this is that this music has not been released anywhere legally. Lost has already been released in different regions. Big diffference.

Just because I am a moderator doesn't mean I shouldn't express my opinion on the subject. I am as entitled as you to have my say, so get used to it.

RE*AC*TOR wrote:

#1 there is a difference between copyright infringement and stealing.

They are both crimes. What's the difference?

RE*AC*TOR wrote:

#2 if it doesn't but boards.ie in legal jeoprady, what's the problem (except your little crusade).

Get a grip. I have no crusade so cool the jets. You previously claimed you weren't in breach of copyright by copying music. You were wrong. We've been through this before. I do not see the point of going through it again. I have, as I said I would, put a thread asking for the smods and admins opinion on this matter. Whatever they say goes, whether I like it or not. I have my own opinion on the matter, as do you, and I am entitled to express it.

RE*AC*TOR wrote:

I think the Feedback forum would be more appropriate and more transparent.

Start a thread. The moderator forum is the quickest way I know to get the attention of the smods and admins which is the only reason I started a thread there, since it is they who will have to make the call here.

RE*AC*TOR

Doctor J wrote:

Not at all. It was put to me like that by an smod referring to the questionable legalty of the Russian mp3 sites. That is, as I said, the only Boards.ie policy I have been made aware of.

That's an entirely different scenario, and you know it. If one of these sites was legally ambiguous then linking to it would put boards.ie (potentially) in hot water. If i started discussing music that music I has purchased there - that would be fine.

Doctor J wrote:

You're the one who brought up the moralistic stance as you put it. I am not the moderator of this forum. I have no say in how this forum is moderated as I have already stated. I do, however, have a say in the running of the forums I moderate. That is the job of a moderator. If you don't feel I am doing a good job or you don't like that feel free to start a thread on feedback.

I am not familiar with any of the forums you moderate, so that's cool.

Doctor J wrote:

There is no drug discussion forum. The difference between Lost and this is that this music has not been released anywhere legally. Lost has already been released in different regions. Big diffference.

Its not a big difference. There are plenty of examples of games and movies that get leaked before release as well. Its a flag of convenience for you to wave to pursue this angle.

In reality, from boards.ie's liability worries there is no difference.

Doctor J wrote:

Just because I am a moderator doesn't mean I shouldn't express my opinion on the subject. I am as entitled as you to have my say, so get used to it.

Your opinion is your own. But when you artificially apply unneccessary boundaries to conversation its called **** moderating.

Doctor J wrote:

They are both crimes. What's the difference?

Rape and jay-walking are both crimes, what's the difference?

Doctor J wrote:

Get a grip. I have no crusade so cool the jets.

From your previous statements on the matter, its apparent that you would prefer a decidedly authoritarian stance on this matter (for various reasons - depending on which suits the particular topic).

Doctor J wrote:

You previously claimed you weren't in breach of copyright by copying music. You were wrong. We've been through this before. I do not see the point of going through it again.

Nor do I. However, I went down that route because you started quoting american law to me. Either way, I conceede that I was wrong on that point. However, it still doesn't affect the principle, that discussion in the absence of providing links / info to obtain illegal material should be permissable.

Doctor J wrote:

I have, as I said I would, put a thread asking for the smods and admins opinion on this matter. Whatever they say goes, whether I like it or not. I have my own opinion on the matter, as do you, and I am entitled to express it.

So you've said. Should your opinion get in the way of open (legal) discussion?

Doctor J wrote:

Start a thread. The moderator forum is the quickest way I know to get the attention of the smods and admins which is the only reason I started a thread there, since it is they who will have to make the call here.

maybe i will.

Doctor J

Look man, as I keep saying, whatever the smods and admins say goes. Law is law and how they choose to apply it goes. There is no forum for discussing drugs and other illegal items (and music held in breach of copyright is illegal) so I will continue to err on the side of caution until told otherwise.

scargill

anywhoo....

Eraser Website (official!)

dream brother

Doctor J wrote:

The difference between Lost and this is that this music has not been released anywhere legally. Lost has already been released in different regions. Big diffference.

i think you'll find that you still not suppose to download the Lost shows as they haven't been broadcasted in Ireland. No one on that board discusses where they got the shows but they discuss what the US shows were about! The same principle should apply here, do you not think so?

RE*AC*TOR

ok I've opened the thread in feedback

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2054940200

Doctor J, I'm not interested in a tete á tete with you, I respect your opinion and I think you have great knowledge of music in general. We just disagree on how far speech should be restricted surrounding this (contentious) issue.

Doctor J

Who says it isn't people who've seen it in the US discussing it? Moot point and totally off topic, can't be proven, my cousin sent it over, saw it on satellite, etc etc etc. I suggest this thread returns to being about Thom Yorke and if you want to discuss downloading then start a thread in feedback and get an admin's view on it.

RE*AC*TOR

Doctor J wrote:

Who says it isn't people who've seen it in the US discussing it?

who's to say that I didn't hear Thom Yorke broadcast on a radio station. Who's to say I didn't get legally sent a review copy? Who's to say I even heard the album and I'm not just a crazy person who hallucinated that i heard it.

Doctor J

RE*AC*TOR wrote:

Doctor J, I'm not interested in a tete á tete with you, I respect your opinion and I think you have great knowledge of music in general. We just disagree on how far speech should be restricted surrounding this (contentious) issue.

I understand. Please just bear in mind that on any forum I don't moderate, I am just a regular user and my opinion carries no more authority than anyone elses. It is up to John2 how he moderates this thread.

themire

what bulls**t

dream brother

Doctor J wrote:

Who says it isn't people who've seen it in the US discussing it? Moot point and totally off topic, can't be proven, my cousin sent it over, saw it on satellite, etc etc etc. I suggest this thread returns to being about Thom Yorke and if you want to discuss downloading then start a thread in feedback and get an admin's view on it.

I not discussing downloading it, the point I was trying to make was related to this thread, for example: Your cousin still shouldn't be sending you over the show, same applies to cd's dvd's etc! But to chastise someone for discussing it is hardcore!

John

Right, as this is now been taken to both feedback and the moderators' forum I'm locking this. For the meantime, I'm still not allowing the discussion of leaked albums because let's face it, you can count on one hand the number of people here who would be receiving a promo copy. As far as I'm concerned, until I'm told otherwise by the admins, this forum will be free as possible from illegal downloading. Big Brotherish? Possibly but frankly I don't care. There's enough music being released daily for your discussion. Illegal downloading may not harm the major labels as much but this is the Alt/Indie forum, most of the bands being discussed here are the ones that get downloaded the most. And these are the bands that a major label will drop like a hot potato if their sales aren't reaching a certain threshold. Granted this is unlikely to happen in Thom Yorke's case but a rule for one is a rule for all.

As soon as I hear official word from the admins, I'll update the charter accordingly. If you've any comments to make, here's a link to the thread in feedback. If you're a mod, here's a link to the other thread.