Did I get enough

JustMac

I think I played this fine but its a type of hand I encounter a lot so just wanted to check is there any way I could have got more from it or should I be happy with what I got. First level in the STT so I don't really have any info on others at the table. From what I've seen both gekko11ws and roseroyse are both fairly loose. With KTo on the BB I call a raise of 40 as I'm getting 5-1 pot odds. I hit top 2 pair on the flop but with 2 hearts and straight possibilities I put in a pot sized raise and everyone folds. Was the flop bet too big? Would 150 have been enough? If I put in a smaller raise that was called should I be willing to fold to a raise if any scare card hits on the turn? (Scare card would be any heart, A, J, Q, 9)

NL Texas Hold'em $11 Buy-in Trny:23392300 Level:1 Blinds(20/40) - Thursday, May 11, 11:05:44 ET 2006
Table Michigan Blues (Real Money)
Seat 9 is the button
Total number of players : 9
Seat 8: Gregthebuff ( $1670 )
Seat 6: gekko11ws ( $2470 )
Seat 1: JutMac ( $1980 )
Seat 2: goldengirl56 ( $1880 )
Seat 9: javah409 ( $1780 )
Seat 10: roseroyse ( $2900 )
Seat 5: Tricky_Joe ( $2240 )
Seat 4: farkinriver ( $1880 )
Seat 7: B45t4rd111 ( $3200 )
Trny:23392300 Level:1
Blinds(20/40)
** Dealing down cards **
Dealt to JutMac [ Ks Th ]
goldengirl56 folds.
farkinriver folds.
Tricky_Joe folds.
gekko11ws raises [80].
B45t4rd111 folds.
Gregthebuff folds.
javah409 folds.
roseroyse calls [60].
JutMac calls [40].
** Dealing Flop ** [ Td, 4h, Kh ]
roseroyse checks.
JutMac bets [250].
gekko11ws folds.
roseroyse folds.
JutMac does not show cards.
JutMac wins 490 chips

Norwich Fan Rob

if they are both quite loose, the pf raiser or button may well throw 200 at it, i check raise here, as u are ahead, but they may well have missed.
They wont call your 250 without a K, and if they have a K, and u re raise, they may even put u on a flush draw and make a bad call.
Let them bet, then kill the hand because of the draws.
(if no draws, i check call, lead turn if they both check).

JustMac

Norwich Fan Rob wrote:

if they are both quite loose, the pf raiser or button may well throw 200 at it, i check raise here, as u are ahead, but they may well have missed.
They wont call your 250 without a K, and if they have a K, and u re raise, they may even put u on a flush draw and make a bad call.
Let them bet, then kill the hand because of the draws.
(if no draws, i check call, lead turn if they both check).

Thanks for the reply. I only have the pre flop raiser behind. I suppose in hindsight he is likely to put in a continuation bet. However, if I check and he checks then they're both getting a free card. If a scare card hits then should I lead the turn if checked into me and fold to a re-raise.

RoundTower

I like the way you played it, no guarantee the pfr will bet now into 3 opponents, and you don't really want to give a free card.

Norwich Fan Rob

i suggest 80% of the time a loose player makes a continuation bet on this flop in position.

If he has 4 to a str8 or a flush, he will almost definetely bet, and will have to either fold or make a bad call if u re raise enough.

If he has nothing, he will also often bet, which is good, but he will lay down if u lead as this pot.

If he checks, he doesnt have a flush draw or an up and down normally, so no need to worry hugely about a free card imo.

Importantly, checking here gives the villian a chance to make a mistake.

marius

Norwich Fan Rob wrote:

If he checks, he doesnt have a flush draw or an up and down normally, so no need to worry hugely about a free card imo.

I would have though most people on a draw would be more than happy to check and take the free card.

I sometimes bet my draws to build the pot and disguise my hand but I am beginning to realise this may be a leak in my game.

ArmaniJeanss

marius wrote:

I sometimes bet my draws to build the pot and disguise my hand but I am beginning to realise this may be a leak in my game.

I don't think betting draws is a leak. Never or rarely betting them would be a leak.

Goodluck2me

depending on the sizes of the bet it def adds value to your game...

JustMac

Norwich Fan Rob wrote:

i suggest 80% of the time a loose player makes a continuation bet on this flop in position.

If he has 4 to a str8 or a flush, he will almost definetely bet, and will have to either fold or make a bad call if u re raise enough.

If he has nothing, he will also often bet, which is good, but he will lay down if u lead as this pot.

If he checks, he doesnt have a flush draw or an up and down normally, so no need to worry hugely about a free card imo.

Importantly, checking here gives the villian a chance to make a mistake.

Very good points which I think would sway me to think that checking might be the best option. The pfr had put in a continuation bet in the very first hand and folded to a bet on the turn.
Still if he checked I think though I would have to lead with a pot sized bet on the turn and think long and hard if I was re-raised.

JustMac

ArmaniJeanss wrote:

I don't think betting draws is a leak. Never or rarely betting them would be a leak.

Interesting, I rarely bet my draws. Thinking about it I suppose for the reasons Marius suggests, building the pot and disguising you hand, that betting a draw is something I should include in my game.

Thanks for the replies all.

RoundTower

Norwich Fan Rob wrote:

i suggest 80% of the time a loose player makes a continuation bet on this flop in position.

If he checks, he doesnt have a flush draw or an up and down normally, so no need to worry hugely about a free card imo.

Importantly, checking here gives the villian a chance to make a
mistake.

I don't really agree with this. Firstly I think even a loose villain gives up often with AJ or 66 here having got so many callers.

Secondly, yes he will probably bet if he has a draw, but one of the players up front may well have checked a draw, so a free card is quite dangerous, and if you bet now you get called by plenty of hands that you are beating.

Thirdly, the villain has a chance to make a mistake if you bet just as much as if you check (and the other villains in the front get an even better chance). If he pushes with a big K or calls with JJ he is making a mistake. Also, checkraising may fold out something like KQ which otherwise will go all the way with you.