The TSM Question thread

nutball

Does anybody know anything about this? Apparently you major in one subject in SS and then take a fifth year to major in the other. I can't find anything about it on the College website, but that's no great surprise. Any ideas?

PHB

Talk to your department, I don't think you actually get a double major on your degree, you just get it for post grads to say you've done it

Goebels

I was wondering something about this too - email them too, but never got a reply.

So i want to do theology (around 385 points) and English Lit (around 505 points) so would the points be a median between those two or what?

Dubliniensis

It's called a "double Moderatorship". AFAIK, you can do one in Maths and Natural Sciences (Physics)....which are two separate Moderatorships. Not sure about TSM. First thing to do would be to look up the College Calendar...

Pugwash

m, no, its the higher points value of the two.

make sure you're getting your points reading from the tsm section of tcd cao, i believe english was 505 single honour, it's usually higher as a tsm (520 ballpark).

Does anyone know if this would also apply to BESS courses? That is if it exists.

Nietzschean

Dubliniensis wrote:

It's called a "double Moderatorship". AFAIK, you can do one in Maths and Natural Sciences (Physics)....which are two separate Moderatorships. Not sure about TSM. First thing to do would be to look up the College Calendar...

ye what now?
the only thing resembling a tsm of physics and maths is theoretical physics, which is its own degree....

Andrew 83

Pugwash wrote:

m, no, its the higher points value of the two.

make sure you're getting your points reading from the tsm section of tcd cao, i believe english was 505 single honour, it's usually higher as a tsm (520 ballpark).

Does anyone know if this would also apply to BESS courses? That is if it exists.

At the end of second year in BESS you decide what you're doing for your degree. You can do single honours Business, Economics, Sociology, or Politics or else you can do joint honours in any combination of them except for Economics and Sociology (as that's a TSM course). I did joint honours Sociology and Politics.

Boston

Nietzschean wrote:

ye what now?
the only thing resembling a tsm of physics and maths is theoretical physics, which is its own degree....

In fairness, I know what he's getting at, their used to be a similiar thing the the hamilton end courses, but on a much smaller scale. Engineering & Business, electronics and physics, ect ect. But most of those courses where scrapped, and never of the same "pick and mix" scale of the arts faculty.

Dubliniensis

Prof Miller in the School of Maths has a double Mod.... Check out his CV:
http://www.maths.tcd.ie/~miller/briefcv.html

TP is a combo of maths and physics courses but it is a separate Moderatorship. AFAIK, to do a double Mod you'd take the experimental physics Mod. and then an extra year to do the maths Mod.

Dubliniensis

Here's an exerpt from the 2001-2002 Calendar on page P5.

Double moderatorship in mathematics and physics
Junior Sophister students reading the theoretical physics course who show exceptional ability and promise may, provided they have completed the requisite mathematics courses in their Freshman years to entitle them to transfer to mathematics, apply to the Dean for persmission to proceed in physics and mathematics simultaneously. The Dean will only grant permission if, in the judgement of the Head of Department of Pure and Applied Mathematics and the Head of Department of Physics, candidates have a resonable expectation of a first class honor result in both degree examinations.

This regulation does not appear in any later Calendars...

Nietzschean

thats nifty, wonder if its still doable...though not really of much usefullness to me...

Attractive Nun

Hey, (depending on LC results) I will hopefully be in Trinity in a few months time studying History and Political Science. I've been set on this course for well over a year and a half at this stage, but now I'm beginning to feel that I might prefer my second choice, TSM History and English. I'd just like to know if anyone does either course - or knows someone who does either - what their opinions of the two courses are.

Andrew 83

Political Science probably isn't what you're imagining it to be. Before I did it (I did Sociology and Political Science) I imagined that it would be not that different from history but more current things or looking at current political happenings around the world and the politics underlying them. While there is a bit of this in some of the courses (there's an excellent fourth year course on the Transformation of War in the Post-Cold War era), a lot of it is just looking at structures and things. You'll know what every type of parliamentary (or dictatorship!) system in the world is, all the different forms of voting that can be used, and all the different coalition theories.

This wasn't really my cup of tea however. I found Sociology was much better from the point of view of what I was expecting from Politics. We did nothing for instance in politics (in the courses I did anyway) on the effect globalisation has had on the world, the different movements against it, and the newly emerging movements around the world. If you're expecting Political Science to be these kind of things that I thought it may not end up what you expect. No idea what English or History are like from the point of view of someone studying them though.

(I should add that some people I know loved Political Science and really enjoyed all the structures etc. It's just not really my favourite end of things so if you like the sound of that go for it!)

PHB

History and English is a serious amount of work, like a serious amount.

His Pol is pretty cool, I do it, going into 4th year. Pol Sci isn't great in Trinity anymore, but History is pretty ****ing cool, and if you do Hist Pol, you get to do whatever History courses you want to do, while if you do History and English you will be very restricted in your course choices, and will probably end up just doing European and Irish history with no real options in 1st and 2nd year.

I'd pick Hist Pol, but then again, I did.

Worst case scenario,
you get into Hist Pol, don't like it, and swap out after Christmas or First year. Not a huge amount of hassle.

p.s. Sociology is a load of ****e and isn't really a subject. If you are interested in Globalisation [and if you are god help you], you can do it in Politics.

You can also do quite cool stuff within politics.

First year is a joke, but it's for drniking anyway.
2nd Year: You get to do history of political thought, which is pretty slick. At the same time you do introductary courses in institutional political science and modern transformation (dictatorship to democracy) politics.

3rd year is where it starts to get interesting
You can do an advanced course in Transition politics which is quite cool.
Then you can do Irish politics, which is the study of current Irish politics.
There is also International Political Theory, and research methods if you want.

4th year you can do very cool courses, which you can find outlined here.

http://www.politics.tcd.ie/courses/undergrad/Undergraduate%20Lectures%200405.html

claire h

PHB wrote:

if you do History and English you will be very restricted in your course choices, and will probably end up just doing European and Irish history with no real options in 1st and 2nd year.

There's a good bit of choice in 2nd year as far as History goes - first year is a bit more restricted (you have to do Europe 1000-1250 plus pick one more out of three; HisPol can pick any two or, I think, any three depending on what else they're doing).

English there is virtually no choice in what courses you take 'til you get to third and fourth year, but that's not terribly unusual for courses in Trinity.

History and English TSM: tons of reading. And you'd think you might get lucky and be studying a historical period at the same time as studying the literature from that particular period, but it never seems to work out that way. But the kind of analysis you're doing in both subjects isn't too different (not like, say, doing English and Maths), and in English you get wacky and cool lecturers who refer to Scooby Doo and Monty Python and James Bond, which is always fun.

History is, y'know, history. It's a lot more in-depth than second-level history, a whole lot of reading various perspectives and putting things together for yourself instead of having a single account in a textbook. It's interesting but demanding, and can be tough in first year when you've got quite a limited range of courses (plus they're all medieval-ish, which isn't everyone's cup of tea).

English is a lot more focussed on theory and criticism than you might expect. Obviously there's a whole lot of reading novels and poetry and plays, but there's also reading up on what Critic X has said about this novel and how Critic Y feels that this text is a particularly good example of something and Critic Z's reading of the novel, and there's also an entire year-long course dedicated to Critical and Cultural Theory, which is all about various theories and critical essays people have written, many of which tend to be shrouded in completely impenetrable language and be overly waffly and theoretical. And it's been a 9am lecture for the past couple of years, which doesn't help.

On the other hand, it is incredibly cool to know that you can just read lots and learn tons of interesting stuff and get a degree out of it in a few years.

Hope that helps.

Stargal

PHB wrote:

p.s. Sociology is a load of ****e and isn't really a subject.

Yeah yeah, whatever...

Mordecai

you know those post-cao deadline regrets? i decided in 5th year i didn't want to do history, but may have made quite a ****-up. i like pol too. ****.

London2005

ill be starting this hopefully in a few weeks, was wondering how it is, the workload in the first year, the amount of choice you have (cause on the website the history looks really limited?) and your career prospects when you graduate

thanks

John

I don't know if anyone around here does those subjects but from friends I gather that the English course is really enjoyable apart from the Old English modules which are quite difficult (but not too difficult). I suppose that depends on what you find interesting in English. I'm not sure how much choice you'll have in first year, generally the first two years of any course are usually set in stone and it's only later on in a degree that you get to pick and choose anything (and even then that depends on the course).

sharona

English/History combination is very popular and with good reason, it's a great course - as long as you love reading.

English in first and second year are fairly standard but you get to do a wide variety of stuff - legend has it that English courses in other colleges teach you things like how to appreciate apostrophes, but that's not the case here. There's a good mix of styles/genres/forms etc and as long as you're happy to read three or four books/works a week then you're sorted. Remember you'll want (and need) the books again in May for your exams so even though reading them in the library may seem like a good idea in October, when exams come around you'll be glad to have bought the €3.95 copies in hodges figgis that you can scribble your notes on...

As far as History is concerned, the first couple of years are again fairly formulaic, you have a couple of choices and that's it (this may have changed in last couple of years but somehow I doubt it). Professor Robinson's History of Europe 1000-1250 is absolutely incredible and Robinson is an absolute legend. Not quite as much reading here, just keep up with your weekly tutorial reading list and you'll be grand.

Once you get to third year you have options in both subjects, but unfortunately these are quite limited. The simple fact is they can only teach what they know, and in a relatively small department of a relatively small college this means limited options. In History this hurts most if you want to study anything modern (and I do mean anything). In English, you get to put down a list of preferences for your course, and if you're a 3rd year you might get some of them but there are no guarantees. Once you're in 4th year English (if that's what you choose) you'll almost definitely get your choices. The thing to remember is that you may not get your top choice, or in terms of History you may end up studying something that at this point seems obscure, but in the end they're all interesting courses so the best thing you can do is embrace them.

The only other thing I'd say is that by the time you get to 3rd year doing TSM (two subjects) you'll notice that those around you doing Single Honours (one subject) have a significantly lighter workload, especially in History. It's the price you pay for getting a bit of both worlds, and anyone that has gone through the system would I'd imagine say it's worth it.

Clichés aside, when you graduate you can do what you like - people go into incredibly varied areas, from phD work to conversion courses (law and education being most popular from what i can see) etc. Students in general arts areas tend to figure out where they're meant to be as they go along and having a base like Eng/Hist is a good springboard to wherever they want to go.

Always carry a book from your reading list with you and that way you'll get through them in no time (bus journeys are a godsend, trust me). If you like books/reading it's a perfect course, because you get to spend four years doing what you love and you get a degree out of it, so enjoy

Zoodlebop

I know that there aren't any people doing this here, but I was wondering if anyone could tell me where I will have most of my lectures.

Thanks,

Z

Nietzschean

is there a real need for a new thread for each fresher's question? we have lots of fresher threads......


And you will probally have most of your lectures in the arts block, but lecture timetable'n changes from year to year.........

Zoodlebop

sorry. you can delete it if u want. it was kind of an idle posting.

Maybe merge this one in a to a 'Freshers Questions' thread?

ApeXaviour

original_psycho wrote:

Maybe merge this one in a to a 'Freshers Questions' thread?

Done.. well merged but into a TSM thread

Bartronilic

Andrew 83 wrote:

At the end of second year in BESS you decide what you're doing for your degree. You can do single honours Business, Economics, Sociology, or Politics or else you can do joint honours in any combination of them except for Economics and Sociology (as that's a TSM course). I did joint honours Sociology and Politics.

Well at the end of first you decide whether to be more businessy/economicy or sociologyey/politcsy or a mixture.

Then at the end of second year you decide on your degree whter single or joint.