That's a bit Irish.

lostexpectation

Where exactly did this phrase come from,

Im loathe to admit mother issues but my mother says this everynow and again if somebody talks about doing something stupid.

"That's a bit Irish"

*squirm*:mad:

If she responded saying "that's typical of the Irish" I wouldn't mind so much, sure doesn't that get said every day on the boards here.

But it the transformation of the word Irish into a verb meaning stupid and thoughtless that bothers me. I can only think of it being used as a put down by non-Irish people.

My mother (born and lived in Ireland) is 60 and is quite bigoted/ignorant/old fashioned.

MorningStar

Most countries have a similar phrase about themseleves. It is a self denegrating phrase as far as I am concerened. If somebody non-irish said in front of me I would consider it offensive and make sure they knew it.

Most people I have seen say it are often wrong.

I was in the airport and the bags hadn't arrived particulalrly quickly one guy say "It is a bit Irish... you know you are home now.... bloody Aer Renta" standard Irish moaning. The fact Aer Renta are not responsible for the movement of baggage doesn't matter it is a bit Irish to moan whether you know the facts or not.

nuttz

You have given yourself the answer in the question!

"That's a bit Irish" = "that's typically Irish" = "stereotypically Irish"

lostexpectation wrote:

the transformation of the word Irish into a verb meaning stupid and thoughtless that bothers me.

This is a misinterpretation of the phase on your part, IMO.

Blackjack

MorningStar wrote:

Most countries have a similar phrase about themseleves. It is a self denegrating phrase as far as I am concerened. If somebody non-irish said in front of me I would consider it offensive and make sure they knew it.

Most people I have seen say it are often wrong.

I was in the airport and the bags hadn't arrived particulalrly quickly one guy say "It is a bit Irish... you know you are home now.... bloody Aer Renta" standard Irish moaning. The fact Aer Renta are not responsible for the movement of baggage doesn't matter it is a bit Irish to moan whether you know the facts or not.

It's a phrase that's unfortunately used extensively in Scotland.

MorningStar

Blackjack wrote:

It's a phrase that's unfortunately used extensively in Scotland.

Doesn't Scotland have a pretty strict anti-bigotry law?

I remeber TV in the 80s had tons of such pharses said on respecatable shows including the news in the UK

Blackjack

MorningStar wrote:

Doesn't Scotland have a pretty strict anti-bigotry law?

I remeber TV in the 80s had tons of such pharses said on respecatable shows including the news in the UK

not that I'm aware of TBH. It's still quite sectarian in a lot of places.

lostexpectation

I guess it could be like black people using n****** to describe themselves, my mother is hip
I'm not going to start using it.

WhiteWashMan

got to admit, ive used it myself.
usually when i hear something about ireland that is completely stupid.

you know, like the issues with the port tunnel etc.

the tunnels too small.
the trucks can let their tyres down.

yep, thats a bit irish really.

MorningStar

Blackjack wrote:

not that I'm aware of TBH. It's still quite sectarian in a lot of places.

Last year new laws were brought in the UK (including Scotland I thought) where an bigoted statement in public could mean a 6 months sentence. Can't remember all the details but worth looking at.

When I lived in the UK I could never get over the racism there. While over with work once (arrived on BA flight which was late) the client started going on about how the Irish are always late and lazy and he didn't blame me. For some reason he thought I was an American (accent was a bit distorted from living there a while)working for an Irish company suffering the fools. When I told him I was Irish he thought I was joking. I showed him my passport and explained I was raised in Dublin as were my parents. I said he could keep his views but his bosses decided we were the best company.Of course everybody found out what he said to me and he was moved off the project.

MorningStar

WhiteWashMan wrote:

got to admit, ive used it myself.
usually when i hear something about ireland that is completely stupid.

you know, like the issues with the port tunnel etc.

the tunnels too small.
the trucks can let their tyres down.

yep, thats a bit irish really.

There is the prime example of people suggesting they themselves as Irish people are stupid. Self denograting rather than acknowledging that equally stupid things happen when a group of people make a decission. Desgin by comiittee is the problem the world over nothing amazingly Irish about it. So people just will never see that and would rather put the country down.

Do you blame the Irish for when a join UK US rocket goes wrong becasue the US side used miles and the UK kilometres?

The fall of communism is probably our fault somehow too! Nothing to do with groups of people trying communicate.

You know we do progressive things too such as the smoking ban and plastic bag charges that other countries follow.

impr0v

preventing the sale of alcohol on some random friday in spring, becuase of some religion or something, that's a bit irish.

WhiteWashMan

MorningStar wrote:

There is the prime example of people suggesting they themselves as Irish people are stupid. Self denograting rather than acknowledging that equally stupid things happen when a group of people make a decission. Desgin by comiittee is the problem the world over nothing amazingly Irish about it. So people just will never see that and would rather put the country down.

Do you blame the Irish for when a join UK US rocket goes wrong becasue the US side used miles and the UK kilometres?

The fall of communism is probably our fault somehow too! Nothing to do with groups of people trying communicate.

You know we do progressive things too such as the smoking ban and plastic bag charges that other countries follow.

no, i say thinkgs like, stupid americans.

no one said it was a logical thing, and as such, trying to make a logcial discussion out of it is not going to solve the world 'a bit irish' saying problem.

Hagar

impr0v wrote:

preventing the sale of alcohol on some random friday in spring, becuase of some religion or something, that's a bit irish.

Or everyday, that's a bit arabic, or in some dry states in the US, that's a bit American.

"That's a bit Irish" is not a self-depreciating (as in false modesty) saying at all.

It's an insult we have heard so often against our race that we are using it ourselves.
Call a child stupid often enough and will think he is stupid.
Adults, even whole nations, are much the same.

WhiteWashMan

impr0v wrote:

preventing the sale of alcohol on some random friday in spring, becuase of some religion or something, that's a bit irish.

rofl

touché

MorningStar

impr0v wrote:

preventing the sale of alcohol on some random friday in spring, becuase of some religion or something, that's a bit irish.

I suggest you go to other countries and check out their laws.

Is it Norway after 7 pm Frifday you can't buy alcohol in an off licence untill monday.

Boston sunday sales are not allowed. Many towns in the US are also dry towns which means no alcohol.

As I said earlier most people who use the expression have no idea what they are talking about.

scojones

MorningStar wrote:

As I said earlier most people who use the expression have no idea what they are talking about.

Is that a generalisation I see before me?

hullaballoo

lostexpectation wrote:

But it the transformation of the word Irish into a verb

What? In the sentence "that is a bit Irish", the verb is "is". "Irish" is an adjective.

I don't see what the problem is with saying that certain human flaws are particularly attributable to the Irish nation.

Dun

Which "certain human flaws" would those be? And why would they be more attributable to us than other countries.

impr0v wrote:

preventing the sale of alcohol on some random friday in spring, becuase of some religion or something, that's a bit irish.

Complaining about having a day that you can't buy alcohol, would that be a bit Irish too?

Dave!

MorningStar, do you have to disect bloody everything? It's just a phrase, move on....

I do not use it, but I may add it to my stock phrases now.

hullaballoo

Dun wrote:

Which "certain human flaws" would those be? And why would they be more attributable to us than other countries.

Stupidity, laziness, apathy, greed, bigotry and racism.

impr0v

irish people visibly irked about a phrase promoting the idea of a national predilection towards stupidity, yet going to great lengths to try and prove its inaccuracy, that's a bit irish.

Hagar

hullaballoo wrote:

Stupidity, laziness, apathy, greed, bigotry and racism.

And your answer to the second part of the question is...

is_that_so

impr0v wrote:

preventing the sale of alcohol on some random friday in spring, becuase of some religion or something, that's a bit irish.

Yep, one of the few ways left of trying to stop us getting rat-arsed on one day of the year.

"A bit Irish" to me is just an expression to describe how we go about things. Once example that springs to mind is the resolution of the "abortion" question - often described as "an Irish solution" to a problem. I 'd suggest that it means we have identifiable way of going about things. As for its usage abroad, well I suspect we're into bigotry territory.

Gordon

I think you Irish people should be happy that people recognise you for being quirky. There are much worse generalisations out there - Greeks and buggery, Americans and complete and utter stupidity, English and violence, Russians and crafty people never to be trusted, Icelandics and Bjork, Belgians and burping and Germans as Nazis. Plus many many more..

As for us Scots, we have no faults and everybody loves us and our hairy skirts.

hullaballoo

Hagar wrote:

And your answer to the second part of the question is...

Eh, because they are traits that we possess to a greater degree than other nations. I ignored that part of the question for rhetoric.

Hagar

Has your account been hijacked?
If not, I will give you the benefit of the doubt and hope that you are trolling.

Dun

It does smell like a troll to me. Although I'd love to see any argument that could possibly lend that viewpoint any backing at all.

Manchegan

Sigh,

lostexpectation wrote:

Where exactly did this phrase come from

Sadly, it is well attested. I've yet to find out what "bull-making" refers to, though.

3greenrizla's

impr0v wrote:

preventing the sale of alcohol on some random friday in spring, becuase of some religion or something, that's a bit irish.

or the fact that the day with the highest alcohol sales is holy thursday..........

thats a bit irish.

or as my Canadian sister in law pointed out at the express checkout in a spar supermarket, approx 10 items or less - thats a bit irish.

although i hate that saying - thats a bit........

lostexpectation

Manchegan wrote:

Sigh, Sadly, it is well attested. I've yet to find out what "bull-making" refers to, though.

Chambers Concise 20th Century Dictionary, Cambridge University Press, 1985

Thats still in the dictionary in 1985 (unless its a historical dictionary). That just goes to show it not about quirkyness but a jingouistic putdown.

I just don't think its healthy to use about oneself either, especially using it in those very same disparaging terms.

simu

BS phrase tbh. Human stupidity and bad organisation don't stop at any national boundary.

MorningStar

simu wrote:

BS phrase tbh. Human stupidity and bad organisation don't stop at any national boundary.

well said

mackerski

is_that_so wrote:

Once example that springs to mind is the resolution of the "abortion" question - often described as "an Irish solution" to a problem.

Is sloppy attribution of quotations a bit Irish too? That description was applied to Charles Haughy's legislation allowing only married couples to be prescribed contraception.

Dermot

murphaph

Yeah I've heard it used in Scotland but nowhere else tbh. I've only heard people with irish surnames using it too so it wasn't in a setarian manner. It's just an expression for something stupid that they use in Glasgow anyway.

Blackjack

It's used quite a bit by people without Irish Surnames in Scotland, and in a derogatory manner.

is_that_so

mackerski wrote:

Is sloppy attribution of quotations a bit Irish too? That description was applied to Charles Haughy's legislation allowing only married couples to be prescribed contraception.

Dermot

Quotations in the public domain are regularly used and reused. It has been applied or "misapplied" many times. Merely an "exempli gratia". Can't see the fuss tbh.
Amazing what that man was responsible for.:p

Slutmonkey57b

It's no more bigoted and anti-Irish than the other classic Irish phrase
"Aren't there any Irish people working here it's all bloody forigners"
or
"The Brits are all ****"
or
"Oh be de holy god"

Personally, I have no problem with the phrase "that's a bit Irish". It's usually used as an acknowledgement that life in Ireland can be lived to different rules, rather than to say that the Irish are inherently stupid. For instance, it's "a bit Irish" that there are traffic lights on exit ramps of the busiest motorway in the country. It's "a bit Irish" that Dublin council introduced a new one-way scheme and lashed up the signposts without talking to the police or the public about it. There's an element of stupidity involved, but it's not a case of "all Irish people are stupid"

legalimmigrant

hullaballoo wrote:

Lostexpectation wrote:

But it the transformation of the word Irish into a verb

What? In the sentence "that is a bit Irish", the verb is "is". "Irish" is an adjective.

Yes. A fellow grammar Nazi salutes you.

Additionally in some US usage 'Irish' is used as a verb. It means 'to add alcohol (to)'. It's something you can do to coffee, for example.

So no additional stereotypes involved there, then.

Me, I've lived slightly to the east of here for most of my life (second generation) so today was my first Fundamentalist Friday. I'm actually stunned that a bunch of [unnecessarily offensive verbal adjective deleted] men in frocks still wield such an ability to impose their will on everyone else.

They can do what they want in the name of their unsupported beliefs. The moment they force me to comply is when I start getting rather unpleasant flashbacks to everything that used to be wrong about Ireland.