Potential awkward situation with friends

Jonny Arson

Hi, ok story is me and friend have been at each others throats over email. I called him out on something he did and he refuses to acknowledge his misgivings. Elementary argument really, I strongly believe and know I'm in the right on this one and he's being highly stubborn about it and won't budge. I don't feel the exact ins and outs of the argument need to be discussed here but it's how this argument has developed into the burning of bridges that concerns me. Like any argument I expected this to boil over after a while with some common sense and ration but he has decided to burn bridges which I find to be absolutely outrageous. I'm worried about how this is going to affect our social circle.

I never had any intention of this argument leading to this. Burning bridges is a total last resort in my opinion and should only come about if someone has done something highly disgraceful. I know I've done absolutely nothing to deserve this and I feel he's been entirely selfish on this and leads me to believe he has quite a large ego and won't allow it to take any bruising.

So basically we are in the same social circle, go to the same college and live just down the road from each other. Awkward enough already but I'm deeply concerned that this is going to drag my friends and I apart. I don't won't anyone else being involved in this confrontation but I'm in great fear that this will happen. There will be cases such as I won't be asked to go out with them when I normally would, there will be cases when me and this bloke will enevitably come face to face and I don't want any tension to spill over into our group.

In his last couple of emails he has made some cheap sinsiter personal insults towards me and I don't feel I can ever look at this guy in the eye ever again. Arguments are arguments, they all should boil over but with his selfish burning of the bridges stance and his insults I am in no position to ever reason with this bloke again. I was prepared to go face to face with him on this but after all this I can't. I'm in the position where I can't possibly reason with this bloke. If I swallow my pride then I'm lowering myself and losing respect for myself. Since he burned bridges do I feel the ball in his court over this and he is the only one who can make amends.

I'm wondering how do you think I should approach this with regards to my social circle? I don't want anyone to be dragged into this debacle but I feel this is inevitable. What approach should I take? Any of you ever been in situation where a confrontation between friends has led to tension within a group?

Thanks

Faith

So he's refusing to budge from his position and you're refusing to budge from yours, yet you come on here and complain that he's doing the exact same thing as you...

Let him burn the bridge. You don't sound like you particularly care about him anyway. If your social circle is affected, which it really shouldn't be, just say "X and I had an argument and he decided we couldn't be friends anymore. I respect his decision", and move on.

Crucifix

So what happened you called him on it, and he decided to burn the bridges straight off the bat?

Rockstar*

Hi, I dont know if my situation is simlar enough but I recently had a major fall out with what i thought was a friend let alone one of my best friends! he's totally unforgivable but my friends all know this and have told him he's completely at fault etc...

but we still come face to face when out with friends-he tries to talk to me and im very short with him if i HAVE to talk to him--might sound a bit childish but you have to take my word for it he really did someting unthinkable to deserve this...

anyway i think that if youre in the right your friends will know this from a neutral point of view and really shouldnt take sides--by not asking you out etc cause he is going in my opinion is sorta taking sides--im afraid you'll probably just have to wait and see what actually happens=best of luck though

Jonny Arson

Faith wrote:

So he's refusing to budge from his position and you're refusing to budge from yours, yet you come on here and complain that he's doing the exact same thing as you...

As far as I'm concerned, (and I've stated this) I've got nothing to budge on. After him choosing to burn the bridge and his out of order insults I would be mad to offer any peace gesture. The ball is in his court of his own accord and whatever happens next is down to him.

Faith wrote:

Let him burn the bridge. You don't sound like you particularly care about him anyway.

That's a highly unfair comment. I had never any intention in the world of this dispute coming to this conclusion. I think the fact he chose the option to burn bridges infact shows that he couldn't give much of a toss about me.

Crucifix wrote:

So what happened you called him on it, and he decided to burn the bridges straight off the bat?

I called him out, he disputes, I confront him, he continuingly disputes, I put hard questions to him based on what he has said on where he has contradicted himself and he fails to answer them and just ends it like that in a fit of angst.

I'm not keen on going too much into the actual dispute since I feel it would deserve another thread for another day but that was something I should have stated so thanks for giving me the opportunity to clear that.

Rockstar* wrote:

Hi, I dont know if my situation is simlar enough but I recently had a major fall out with what i thought was a friend let alone one of my best friends! he's totally unforgivable but my friends all know this and have told him he's completely at fault etc...

but we still come face to face when out with friends-he tries to talk to me and im very short with him if i HAVE to talk to him--might sound a bit childish but you have to take my word for it he really did someting unthinkable to deserve this...

The thing is I don't know if all our group know what is exactly happening but I do suspect going on his comments that he has been talking to some of them but I don't know whether he's like me and not getting anyone involved or he's actually trying to get people to take sides (I do fear this). I'm not getting them involved. The original incident doesn't involve any of them so none of them should be in a position to take sides anyhow (if any of them did I'd be disapointed). I know he's at fault for the original dispute, I can let that go with dialogue and some common sense on both sides and this really should all be in the past but I feel now there's a no return point on his part and of his own choosing.

Rockstar*

sounds like a poxy situation to be in-from what you've said so far I think you're doing the right thing so far....

not getting anyone involved is a good thing although youre prob right Im sure he has being saying a thing or two to some of the others--its a cowardly thing to do and im by no means eexcusing him but to be honest i think a lot of people in this situation would probably do the same thing as him in the heat of the argument if you know what i mean, thats life unfortunatly!

Ive realised the best thing to do in my own personal situation is to try and be dignified about it, not involve anyone else and keep on with my other friends as normal - i know im coming out of it looking far better----so that would be my advice to you-it just seems a more mature way of dealing with things which i think will be respected

youre also dead right not to make any peace offering-some people are far too stuborn and totally incapable of swallowing their pride and i know you've a lot on the line here but people like this dont deserve half of the respect theyre given-whether hes a "mate" or not

Macker

You sound like a pair of sissys ,so he lives down the road from you and you are argueing by email ,why not knock down to him and have it out face to face

dar83

Dont you post this story every few weeks?

Just have a chat with him and sort it out, you just have to decide if he's worth it as a friend and if he is, then possibly take one for the team. You have to possibly really bite your lip on the whole thing but either decide to talk it out or just move on once and for all.

Good luck.

metrovelvet

Im in a similar position OP with a woman ive been friends with for over 15 years.

Let me see if I understand you...

You still want to be his friend but dont feel safe reconciling until you know that he realises what he has done was abusive and that he wont do it again.

I think your right to stand your ground. If hes a bully, giving in will only enable his ways and make him stronger.

When you ask him questions does he feel as if your testing him when all he wants is empathy? My friend has been bullying someone in our group and Ive told her I think what shes doing is mean so she got nasty with me. I told her she had rage issues and is scary. She asked me what you do about it. I told her therapy and she got angry with me and started giving me the third degree. At that point I threw my hands up.

Do not involve anyone else in this. Its not fair on them.

As my dad said during my parents divorce, you cant reason with the insane.

snorlax

people often act more confident via email/ the internet. remember 90% of body language is non verbal, so subtle reactions are often missed.

best thing to do is take a breather from this person for a day or two or even a week. give yourself and himself a chance to defuse and to think about the situation more objectively. to be honest most people here can't really advise you the best way to react as they're not you and more then likely don't think like you/ don't know your friend.
when your ready decide if you'd rather fester over a fight/ (can the friendship be rebuilt? if you want to say sorry humour can be pretty powerful or maybe do something thoughtful)/ otherwise let it go. im not sure if telling millions of other friends is a good solution as it could amplify the situation if people take sides.

Laguna

So what you want to happen is everyone in your social circle to ostracise him in the way you will do when you cease talking to him?, sounds really mature tbh.

You say you know you're definetely in the right on this one and say how he won't budge and admit he's wrong?, in fairness, who likes to admit they're wrong?, why are you pressing the issue with him? - to score one over him?, are you even 100% you're in the right about the subject?..

It actually bugs me when people take this stance on issues, granted, I don't even know what the problem is between you and your friend, but the person who takes on the high and mighty, holier than thou attitude is just as bad as the person who doesn't admit to what they did wrong imo.

metrovelvet

laguna you sound a little high and mighty yourself.

Nevyn

Lets keep this on topic lets not get have bannings do unhelpful post and personal insults.

Thaedydal

BuffyBot

I don't feel the exact ins and outs of the argument need to be discussed here

Well maybe, but how are we to know that your right. Fair enough, you're convinced of your position - but that doesn't make it right. It's a bit unfair to ask us to help without giving us the whole story.

Apart from that though, maybe it's time to be a bit grown up about it and talk face to face, and stop firing emails at each other. Stop worrying about your social circle and face the actual issue - you and your friend.

Slash/ED

I was talking to you, (Zane from MTV2) in person on friday and you brought this up and gave your version of events pretty much as you described above. Taking you at your word, I thought you had a case and maybe the friend in question was over reacting and that a falling out over an incident as trivial as the one that started this whole debate (A nothing incident) was just stupid. So I was talking to the friend in question on saturday and brought up the whole issue asking for his side of the story and why something so minor had come to this, and all he did was simply showed me the e-mails. Now, there's quite a number of key facts in those e-mails you omitted both here and talking to me on friday, the real chain of events runs something like this...

1 - The first incident, you don't want it brought up. Suffice to say, it was a stupid little joke that really was harmless and pretty forgettable and wasnt even really at your expence. If you want to get into the ins and outs of this incident you can but it's actually pretty irrelevent, it's what followed that has the friend in question saying the things he has.

Also, it has to be said, if you told the person in question to take back the joke outright he would have, I believe him when he says that and he would be a bit of a pr*ck if he didn't. But you didn't do that, which leads us to....

2 - The first e-mail. You say you "called him out" on this, and make it sound like what you did was outline your objections to the first incident (Again we can get into that if you want....). What you actually said was

"I saw that. You've just shown what a ****ing arsehole you are. Are you looking to get your head kicked in coz you're not far off it.

Oh BTW I know you'll forward this to email to everyone else since you quite obviously take the piss behind my back"

So, what you actually did was threaten to kick the head in of one of your mates (Who lives four doors down from you) via e-mail, aswell as calling him a ****ing arsehole. Do you genuinley expect that you can engage people like that and them to remain civil? I wouldn't mind if you were provoked over something big but this was a nothing issue.

The last bit is pure paranoia, I only saw the e-mails when I confronted him about it after talking to you on friday.

3 - He replys, tells you to get a sense of humour, basically, as this wouldnt be the first time you have reacted badly to anything remotely at your expence and asks why exactly you reacted the way you did, that if you had of asked him to take it back or whatever he would have and the incident was a nothing incident.

4 - You reply. This is where you start absolutley loseing it and why, if being called a ****ing arsehole and threatened wasn't enough, you really píss off the friend in question.

In this e-mail you begin by throwing in a few personal insults towards him like calling him sinister and whatnot. But more to the point, you start throwing in other names aswell. You outright call one of our mutual friends fat (This friend wasn't involved or even around on the day of the incident, why you brought him up with no previous mention of him whatsoever is beyond me), as well as throwing in a few insults for a few other people (Myself included). You omitted the reference to me on friday I notice, and it was nothing on what you said about the original person. This personal attack for no reason whatsoever on a so called mate is not exactly going to win you any respect.

I can tell you know, the person you insulted has seen that e-mail. How do you think he feels about you and this incident now? And you speak of burning bridges? You bring up the social circle but it you who involve us all here.

It may suprise you to know but mates stick together and insulting mutual friends like that is not the way to go to impress anybody or win an argument. Bringing other names into it without any call (none of them were involved) and then insulting them wasn't exactly a wise move if your concerned with burning bridges or even if you actually consider them mates.

5 - The e-mails that follow show more personal insults coming both ways and eventually it lead to this.

The original thing that caused this was a nothing incident, one joke that offended nobody but you decided to completley go over the top on somebody you call a friend, the original incident isn't what lead to this, it was your first e-mail and follow up. The only person who has burned bridges here is you, and the friend in question has not rounded anybody up against you, but if anybody asks him he will show them the e-mails and they speak for themselves.

I'm not out to get you here (Quite the opposiate if anything I was on your side after the talk on friday) and nobody else is, obviously the group could do without the tension, but do not try and take the moral high ground with your pretty selective version of events. How else you expected someone to react to what you said which was over something that was otherwise completley forgotten is beyond me and this is all your doing. I say this not as someone who has been rounded up by anyone (hence why I didn't try hide my identity) but as someone who actually brought this up with the friend in question after your version of events to me on friday. I hope this doesn't lead to some major fall out but as it stands things do not look good and it's no use trying to blame anyone else and that is simply an honest opinion.

This isn't about him "not admitting his misgivings" as you tried to say, it's about your over reaction over the e-mail and all the stuff you said. The original so called misgivings have nothing to do with anything anymore. It is also hardly ideal to be talking about this in the open as it is an issue between few people and no more but I felt since you opened this a few things had to be put right so at least the story here is straight.

ferdi

Let your circle of friends hear the full details for themselves, if you are as you say, completely in the right, they will see that and side with you so you have nothing to worry about.

ferdi

Slash/ED wrote:

I was talking to you, (Zane from MTV2) in person on friday and you brought this up and gave your version of events pretty much as you described above. Taking you at your word, I thought you had a case and maybe the friend in question was over reacting and that a falling out over an incident as trivial as the one that started this whole debate (A nothing incident) was just stupid. So I was talking to the friend in question on saturday and brought up the whole issue asking for his side of the story and why something so minor had come to this, and all he did was simply showed me the e-mails. Now, there's quite a number of key facts in those e-mails you omitted both here and talking to me on friday, the real chain of events runs something like this...

1 - The first incident, you don't want it brought up. Suffice to say, it was a stupid little joke that really was harmless and pretty forgettable and wasnt even really at your expence. If you want to get into the ins and outs of this incident you can but it's actually pretty irrelevent, it's what followed that has the friend in question saying the things he has.

Also, it has to be said, if you told the person in question to take back the joke outright he would have, I believe him when he says that and he would be a bit of a pr*ck if he didn't. But you didn't do that, which leads us to....

2 - The first e-mail. You say you "called him out" on this, and make it sound like what you did was outline your objections to the first incident (Again we can get into that if you want....). What you actually said was

"I saw that. You've just shown what a ****ing arsehole you are. Are you looking to get your head kicked in coz you're not far off it.

Oh BTW I know you'll forward this to email to everyone else since you quite obviously take the piss behind my back"

So, what you actually did was threaten to kick the head in of one of your mates (Who lives four doors down from you) via e-mail, aswell as calling him a ****ing arsehole. Do you genuinley expect that you can engage people like that and them to remain civil? I wouldn't mind if you were provoked over something big but this was a nothing issue.

The last bit is pure paranoia, I only saw the e-mails when I confronted him about it after talking to you on friday.

3 - He replys, tells you to get a sense of humour, basically, as this wouldnt be the first time you have reacted badly to anything remotely at your expence and asks why exactly you reacted the way you did, that if you had of asked him to take it back or whatever he would have and the incident was a nothing incident.

4 - You reply. This is where you start absolutley loseing it and why, if being called a ****ing arsehole and threatened wasn't enough, you really píss off the friend in question.

In this e-mail you begin by throwing in a few personal insults towards him like calling him sinister and whatnot. But more to the point, you start throwing in other names aswell. You outright call one of our mutual friends fat (This friend wasn't involved or even around on the day of the incident, why you brought him up with no previous mention of him whatsoever is beyond me), as well as throwing in a few insults for a few other people (Myself included). You omitted the reference to me on friday I notice, and it was nothing on what you said about the original person. This personal attack for no reason whatsoever on a so called mate is not exactly going to win you any respect.

I can tell you know, the person you insulted has seen that e-mail. How do you think he feels about you and this incident now? And you speak of burning bridges? You bring up the social circle but it you who involve us all here.

It may suprise you to know but mates stick together and insulting mutual friends like that is not the way to go to impress anybody or win an argument. Bringing other names into it without any call (none of them were involved) and then insulting them wasn't exactly a wise move if your concerned with burning bridges or even if you actually consider them mates.

5 - The e-mails that follow show more personal insults coming both ways and eventually it lead to this.

The original thing that caused this was a nothing incident, one joke that offended nobody but you decided to completley go over the top on somebody you call a friend, the original incident isn't what lead to this, it was your first e-mail and follow up. The only person who has burned bridges here is you, and the friend in question has not rounded anybody up against you, but if anybody asks him he will show them the e-mails and they speak for themselves.

I'm not out to get you here (Quite the opposiate if anything I was on your side after the talk on friday) and nobody else is, obviously the group could do without the tension, but do not try and take the moral high ground with your pretty selective version of events. How else you expected someone to react to what you said which was over something that was otherwise completley forgotten is beyond me and this is all your doing. I say this not as someone who has been rounded up by anyone (hence why I didn't try hide my identity) but as someone who actually brought this up with the friend in question after your version of events to me on friday. I hope this doesn't lead to some major fall out but as it stands things do not look good and it's no use trying to blame anyone else and that is simply an honest opinion.

This isn't about him "not admitting his misgivings" as you tried to say, it's about your over reaction over the e-mail and all the stuff you said. The original so called misgivings have nothing to do with anything anymore. It is also hardly ideal to be talking about this in the open as it is an issue between few people and no more but I felt since you opened this a few things had to be put right so at least the story here is straight.

jesus man, what a burn!

honru

BuffyBot wrote:

Apart from that though, maybe it's time to be a bit grown up about it and talk face to face, and stop firing emails at each other. Stop worrying about your social circle and face the actual issue - you and your friend.

Seems like the most sensible thing to do in such a situation.

And yes, that post was quite a burn.

Slash/ED

Well I didn't mean to 'burn' anyone and I don't want to lose any friends, I hope this whole thing gets resolved and sorry if it came across as a bit aggressive or whatever I just object to your version of events (if you do want to talk about this here at least give the whole story) and am trying to show exactly why he reacted the way he did.

Jonny Arson

Slash/ED wrote:

1 - The first incident, you don't want it brought up. Suffice to say, it was a stupid little joke that really was harmless and pretty forgettable and wasnt even really at your expence. If you want to get into the ins and outs of this incident you can but it's actually pretty irrelevent, it's what followed that has the friend in question saying the things he has.

To say that was a ''joke'' is entirely untrue. I'm not getting into the incident, it was borderline childish (and is childish in your eyes) but at the same time it was sinister, the evidence is there (you know what I mean), you must be a quite harsh person like him if you believe that was nothing but a ''harmless joke''. I presume you know the exact incident and I know you have laughed and found it amusing on one occassion so naturally your going to take this line. Maybe I'm just more grown up than you guys and know where crossing the line is and isn't.

Slash/ED wrote:

2 - The first e-mail. You say you "called him out" on this, and make it sound like what you did was outline your objections to the first incident (Again we can get into that if you want....). What you actually said was

"I saw that. You've just shown what a ****ing arsehole you are. Are you looking to get your head kicked in coz you're not far off it.

Oh BTW I know you'll forward this to email to everyone else since you quite obviously take the piss behind my back"

So, what you actually did was threaten to kick the head in of one of your mates (Who lives four doors down from you) via e-mail, aswell as calling him a ****ing arsehole.

I don't believe that is a threat. I was furious and as far as I'm concerned it was a very heavy handed and justified warning. What it meant that he was asking for trouble, I never categorically threatened to kick his head in.

Slash/ED wrote:

Do you genuinley expect that you can engage people like that and them to remain civil? I wouldn't mind if you were provoked over something big but this was a nothing issue.

He wasn't civil with his original dose of being an arsehole but of course since you believe it's a ''nothing issue'' you would disagree with that wouldn't you.

Slash/ED wrote:

3 - He replys, tells you to get a sense of humour, basically, as this wouldnt be the first time you have reacted badly to anything remotely at your expence and asks why exactly you reacted the way you did, that if you had of asked him to take it back or whatever he would have and the incident was a nothing incident.

Bottom line is he wouldn't give any intellectual response to me when he continuingly failed to show any sense or cop on over his reckless actions.

Slash/ED wrote:

You outright call one of our mutual friends fat

Lie. I never said that. :mad: You are painting a picture here as if to say I ridiculed him, you know thats not true and I'm very surprised you have resorted to this. I did make an observation while arguing my point of view with our friend and you're looking for something that isn't there. You are milking his exact false allegations by which he infact entirely contradicted himself. You say that I'm out of line (for something which I never did or say) but for which the original incident is perfectly harmless? Your post and your stance has lost it's entire credibility there in one fell swoop - oh how I wish I could mention the original incident now.

Slash/ED wrote:

as well as throwing in a few insults for a few other people (Myself included).

I never insulted you or anyone else.

Slash/ED wrote:

It may suprise you to know but mates stick together and insulting mutual friends like that is not the way to go to impress anybody or win an argument.

Again I never insulted you or anyone else.

Slash/ED wrote:

Bringing other names into it without any call (none of them were involved) and then insulting them wasn't exactly a wise move if your concerned with burning bridges or even if you actually consider them mates.

You continue to lie over me insulting you or anyone else. Good man. I did mention you in my email and with regards to what I said, I believe I've been proven completely and utterly correct here by your one sided stance.

Slash/ED wrote:

The original thing that caused this was a nothing incident, one joke that offended nobody

So it's ok to insult and ridicule somebody behind their back? Oh wait you have laughed at what we're talking about before in someone's gaf so yeah that's acceptable in your eyes.

Slash/ED wrote:

The only person who has burned bridges here is you, and the friend in question has not rounded anybody up against you, but if anybody asks him he will show them the e-mails and they speak for themselves.

Show them as much as you like I don't care. Going by your post it's very much like you know who has been writing it instead of yourself.

Slash/ED wrote:

How else you expected someone to react to what you said which was over something that was otherwise completley forgotten is beyond me and this is all your doing.

All this would have been forgotten if I was a harsh prick and ignored the original foul play (which again you are deluded enough to think it was nothing). I'm glad I took my stance, I know I did the right thing.

Slash/ED wrote:

I hope this doesn't lead to some major fall out but as it stands things do not look good and it's no use trying to blame anyone else and that is simply an honest opinion.

I stand by my stance. He was out of order in the first place and I'm shocked that you can condone that.

Slash/ED wrote:

This isn't about him "not admitting his misgivings" as you tried to say, it's about your over reaction over the e-mail and all the stuff you said.

You're so wrong. He deservedly got called out, I now wish I could mention the incident (I have a justified reason for not doing so and I'm not hiding anything, I have PM'd Slash/ED about this) to prove this but your response has been ridiculously one sided and has put me in a bad light. I'm terribly disapointed in that. I have to ask you do you know the exact ins and outs of the original incident? If you do then my point is proven. I didn't start this incident as much as you like to think and all this wouldn't have happened in the first place if he had a bit of cop on and a bit of sensitivity.

Simply if you believe his original actions are acceptable then you'll think I'm on a rage. I know I called him spot on and if I asked everyone here whether I was right or not about this the majority would agree with me but since I state this can't for my own reasons I look like the bad guy now. I stand by everything I said and will continue to do so.

I'm bitterly disapointed that you have accused me of insulting a friend not involved in this when I never did. You crossed the line yourself there. You know who made up that original allegation I cannot believe for the life of me that you have fallen for that, the emails that are now being distributed left right and centre prove that I never did that. I responded and knocked that allegation to him in the email. I can sleep tight on that one thank you very much.

I don't want to fight, I don't want to fight with him or you but I'm left with no other choice to stand up for myself and I can only predict that there's going to be a backlash against me which is totally unfair and if anything should be the other way actually. I didn't want you guys involved, I never involved you the other night but I told you of the situation and my stance. It looks he's got you and everybody involved now so it looks like it's gonna be all out war isn't it. I'm not backing down Jam, with regards to the original incident I'm in the right whether you think so or not and I have to stand up for myself and more importantly for someone else.

I don't know what happens from here but I don't want this, I don't wanna fight but I'm sticking to my guns. You know where to contact me if you wish.

arbeitsscheuer

Just a short post to say I've been in a similar position as Zane, and tbh, if stubbornness is gonna be a characteristic both of you insist on sharing, then no progress will be made on this.

However, time does heal all wounds, especially if this is as much of a "nothing incident" that Slash/ED reckons it is.

Give it a while, it'll probably sort itself out.

I didn't speak to my best mate for about 2 months when we had a similar falling-out, but things are much better now. From what you've told us about this incident, IMO you'll be able to say the same about this problem in a while...

Slash/ED

I'm not sure how the mods feel about something like this taking up boards space but if the thread stays open I'm happy to continue

Zane from MTV2 wrote:

To say that was a ''joke'' is entirely untrue. I'm not getting into the incident, it was borderline childish (and is childish in your eyes) but at the same time it was sinister, the evidence is there (you know what I mean), you must be a quite harsh person like him if you believe that was nothing but a ''harmless joke''. I presume you know the exact incident and I know you have laughed and found it amusing on one occassion so naturally your going to take this line. Maybe I'm just more grown up than you guys and know where crossing the line is and isn't.

You read FAR too much into it. It's all about intent, he never intended it to be anything offencive or to hurt anybody. There was nothing sinister about it, it was childish yeah but that's the extent of it. Your smug "maybe it's because I'm a better person" theme you have running here and in the e-mails win you know favours, you don't seem to understand (And i've talked to person in question over this) the reason he's said the stuff he has has nothing to do with the joke itself, purely your reaction which he took offence too. Maybe every single person bar you is "quite harsh" and not grown up, or maybe you need to consider why you're the only person who seems to think this.

And anyway, the point is, even if the joke did cross the line (I don't think it did), there's other ways to deal with it. You don't send a message like you did then expect a civil response. You either talk to him and say why you didn't like it or do the same via e-mail, you don't send the e-mail you did.

I don't believe that is a threat. I was furious and as far as I'm concerned it was a very heavy handed and justified warning. What it meant that he was asking for trouble, I never categorically threatened to kick his head in.

How does warning someone you'll kick their head in differ from threatening to do it? You're arguing semantics here and frankly I'm lost, if you wanted to say he was asking for trouble you'd have said "Your asking for trouble", which is pretty much a threat anyway it just leaves the consequences undefined. You said what the consequences would be, an attempt to 'kick his head in', which is a pretty farcical way to talk to a mate.

He wasn't civil with his original dose of being an arsehole but of course since you believe it's a ''nothing issue'' you would disagree with that wouldn't you.

You can't compare what he did to your reply. You've gone about this completley the wrong way.

Bottom line is he wouldn't give any intellectual response to me when he continuingly failed to show any sense or cop on over his reckless actions.

Well I've read the e-mails and that's just not true. He did write a fairly civil reply initially, you returned by bringing up and insulting others who weren't even involved, then the personal insults went back and forth.

Lie. I never said that. :mad: You are painting a picture here as if to say I ridiculed him, you know thats not true and I'm very surprised you have resorted to this. I did make an observation while arguing my point of view with our friend and you're looking for something that isn't there. You are milking his exact false allegations by which he infact entirely contradicted himself. You say that I'm out of line (for something which I never did or say) but for which the original incident is perfectly harmless? Your post and your stance has lost it's entire credibility there in one fell swoop - oh how I wish I could mention the original incident now.

Yes you did - don't try and spin the truth with someone who's read the e-mail. I will copy and paste what you said if you want, but I know the person in question has read it and reads it exactly the way I read it too. If you believe this is being taken out of context (I find this hard to beliee) I'd strongly advise you to get in touch with the person who's name you brought up for no reason at all as to say he isn't impressed is an understatement. What I make of what you said is pretty secondary to that.

This isn't about credibility or some sense of victory for the love of god, honestly, look at the bigger picture. You've managed to offend not only person you were arguing with but others too, is everybody bar you wrong or is it the other way around?

I myself haven't really taken a stance on the original issue. It was childish as I've said but it did not warrent the response it got.

I never insulted you or anyone else.


Again I never insulted you or anyone else.

Again not true, if not to insult tell me why did you go mentioning other names who weren't even involved in the original insult? What possible logic could you have there? I didn't take offence to it because I'm not farcially thin skinned but I do genuinley wonder why you saw fit to mention me and others out of the blue.

You continue to lie over me insulting you or anyone else. Good man. I did mention you in my email and with regards to what I said, I believe I've been proven completely and utterly correct here by your one sided stance.

Stop dismissing anyone who disagrees with you as one sided. On friday when I talked to you I thought the other person has over reacted and you were probably correct, since then I talked to him and now this is my conclusion. What I'm saying is based entirely on what I made of reading your e-mails, is this all some conspiracy to get you or is there simply truth to what I'm saying? Everybody bar you isn't wrong.

So it's ok to insult and ridicule somebody behind their back? Oh wait you have laughed at what we're talking about before in someone's gaf so yeah that's acceptable in your eyes.

If you objected to what was being said why on earth did you not say anything?

Show them as much as you like I don't care. Going by your post it's very much like you know who has been writing it instead of yourself.

I'm not showing anybody anything, that's up to the other person, and I'm not him.

Stop being so f-cking paranoid and accept people can disagree with you.

All this would have been forgotten if I was a harsh prick and ignored the original foul play (which again you are deluded enough to think it was nothing). I'm glad I took my stance, I know I did the right thing.

See how glad you are if you've gone and alienated most of your mates. Simple fact of life, groups of lads together our age say alot of things that could be deemed offencive, you have to be able to accept that. Stop trying to be some kind of moral superhero all you're doing is alienating people who are genuine mates over something that's simply not worth it. Honestly, think about what your actions here might mean, take it from someone involved in that circle, it's just not worth it.

iI stand by my stance. He was out of order in the first place and I'mshocked that you can condone that.

It's not a matter of condoneing it, it was fairly childish and if you had have told him that outright he would have taken it down. You can't seem to grasp that, the reason he's annoyed isn't because he was "called out" it's because of what you said in the e-mail and following ones.

You're so wrong. He deservedly got called out, I now wish I could mention the incident (I have a justified reason for not doing so and I'm not hiding anything, I have PM'd Slash/ED about this) to prove this but your response has been ridiculously one sided and has put me in a bad light. I'm terribly disapointed in that. I have to ask you do you know the exact ins and outs of the original incident? If you do then my point is proven. I didn't start this incident as much as you like to think and all this wouldn't have happened in the first place if he had a bit of cop on and a bit of sensitivity.

Yes I know the original ins and outs of the incident, it's fairly straight forward. Weather he was out of order or not isn't the issue for the last time, read what I said above, if you had of once, just ONCE raised an objection to any of this you'd have a case as he'd have been a príck to ignore you (And I would have been the first to condem him if he had of ignored you if you'd raised an objection, but you didn't). You didn't call him out, you wrote an e-mail that was absolutley ridiculas. If you find my response one sided (I'm the last person who wants tension) then you will probably find anyone else who read the e-mails thinking pretty much the same. Does this not tell you something? Can you not even stop and consider maybe for one second that you in fact have not gone about this in the best way, or will you refuse to listen to someone who just genuinley wants to see this whole thing over. This isn't about painting anyone in a bad light but if you refuse to accept any criticism from someone entirely inpartial and entirely uninolved in the incident or following argument (Bar when you saw fit to mention me) then there is no hope.

Simply if you believe his original actions are acceptable then you'll think I'm on a rage. I know I called him spot on and if I asked everyone here whether I was right or not about this the majority would agree with me but since I state this can't for my own reasons I look like the bad guy now. I stand by everything I said and will continue to do so.

Easy to say that, why does nobody who knows everything agree? Again, this isn't about the acceptableness of the original incident. I'm not trying to make you look like the bad guy, I do however think your actions have been hideously misguided and unless loseing friends was your intention the tone of your replys were stupid. Can you not see this?

Slash/ED

I'm bitterly disapointed that you have accused me of insulting a friend not involved in this when I never did. You crossed the line yourself there. You know who made up that original allegation I cannot believe for the life of me that you have fallen for that, the emails that are now being distributed left right and centre prove that I never did that. I responded and knocked that allegation to him in the email. I can sleep tight on that one thank you very much.

Well if I were you I'd be more concerned that said friend has been insulted by what you said about him. My reading on the situation isn't relevent, if he's insulted for the love of god does that not tell you anything? Maybe, just maybe, you're wrong?

E-mails are not being distrubed left right and centre. I talked to the person about them after what you told me and he showed them to me rather letting me misinterpurate things, it makes sense really. The insulted friend got shown them for obvious reasons. If you are so innocent here why does the other person not agree? You can dig your head in the sand, say I'm right you're all wrong or for one mintue can you even raise a question over your own actions? The reactions from three seperate people who you hang around with say alot.

I don't want to fight, I don't want to fight with him or you but I'm left with no other choice to stand up for myself and I can only predict that there's going to be a backlash against me which is totally unfair and if anything should be the other way actually. I didn't want you guys involved, I never involved you the other night but I told you of the situation and my stance. It looks he's got you and everybody involved now so it looks like it's gonna be all out war isn't it. I'm not backing down Jam, with regards to the original incident I'm in the right whether you think so or not and I have to stand up for myself and more importantly for someone else.

I'm not involved, but having read the e-mails and read this I felt some things needed to be said. And if you take your head out of the sand you can maybe at least see why people are offended here.

But instead you dismiss it as some kind of paranoid he's gotten everyone to rise against me kind of thing. This isn't true and you know he's not like that either. Why would he bother?

I don't know what happens from here but I don't want this, I don't wanna fight but I'm sticking to my guns. You know where to contact me if you wish.

If you didn't want to fight you went around this completley the wrong way. Read over your first e-mail, if you can't see that I give up. I have no interest in any kind of fight either, why on earth would I? When have I ever shown anything to the contrary? I'm probably the most passive person who ever walked the earth, but if you can't accept any wrong doings on your part then you will find yourself coming out of this very badly and I for one do not want to see that.




Finally, I can't emphasise enough here, nobody is out to get you. My reply wasn't one sided, it was an honest reading of the situation and your refusal to accept another point of view will get you nowhere. Nobody wants to see any tension in our little circle, so it is in nobodys interests to try and create any, so if others including myself think you could have acted differently maybe it's because you could have acted differently. That's an honest opinion, based not on the friend saying anything to be, it is based SOLEY on reading the e-mails in their entirity. No spinning of the truth, just my reading of the situation, simple as that. Take it on board without just dismissing it as it isn't your line of thinking, please.

Hopefully sebthebum is right, but something needs to be done to fix some of the wounds this has all created and soon before they get worse.

Sangre

Classic Zane. Post a joke and you fúcking fly off the handle. You don't have any grip on social reality.
You even went to the admins complaining of online bullying.
Are you for real?

Chinafoot

Yea I seem to recall a thread by Zane accusing me of bullying him and rounding up mods to help me do it.

Tbh Zane, you really do seem to fly off the handle and get horribly offended at the mere mention of any disagreement with your opinion. Fair play to slash/ed for giving what appears to be a fairly impartial view of things.

My advice would be to cut the paranoia and actually sit down and talk to your mate about what happened.

Jonny Arson

Slash/ED wrote:

You read FAR too much into it. It's all about intent, he never intended it to be anything offencive or to hurt anybody. There was nothing sinister about it, it was childish yeah but that's the extent of it.

It was abusive, it ridiculed the person - for an intelligent bloke how on earth
can you not understand that? You are condoning this. For the record it was disguised so the person wouldn't understand what it meant, then cowardly lying about it from him to the person in question, also a harmless but devious (now conveniently deleated) comment towards me to attract the victims attention and then a further comment by him to say that this ''joke'' involved me. I could go on and on, it was abusive, end of.

Slash/ED wrote:

there's other ways to deal with it. You don't send a message like you did then expect a civil response. You either talk to him and say why you didn't like it or do the same via e-mail, you don't send the e-mail you did.

I'll state again I was furious (I still am furious), it was heavy handed, maybe it looks like its a threat but I can guarantee you it wasn't. He has used this as his whole argument against me to defend the original incident.

Slash/ED wrote:

You can't compare what he did to your reply. You've gone about this completley the wrong way.

Two different things obviously but nothing makes his actions excusable no matter how much you or he like to think it was acceptable.

Slash/ED wrote:

Well I've read the e-mails and that's just not true. He did write a fairly civil reply initially, you returned by bringing up and insulting others who weren't even involved, then the personal insults went back and forth.

I've just proofed over the emails to make 100% sure I'm spot on and again I never insulted you or others. You and someone else were metioned in relation to your previous lets say ''light hearted'' attitude towards this and I make a perfectly acceptable presumption that you would take this stance. There's no insulting of you or others, where on earth are you getting this from?

Slash/ED wrote:

Yes you did - don't try and spin the truth with someone who's read the e-mail. I will copy and paste what you said if you want, but I know the person in question has read it and reads it exactly the way I read it too. If you believe this is being taken out of context (I find this hard to beliee) I'd strongly advise you to get in touch with the person who's name you brought up for no reason at all as to say he isn't impressed is an understatement. What I make of what you said is pretty secondary to that.

NO I DID NOT EVER INSULT THE PERSON IN QUESTION HERE!

I made a point in releation to the original incident about this person on how I felt there was a sense of irony. CD took it upon himself to throw this allegation at me for which you have followed up. Maybe there wasn't much of reason to throw it up but to make an allegation like this out of nothing is outrageous.

I have nothing to hide, here is what I said in the email....
''(person in question) was been an arsehole by taking the piss out (victim of original incident) so don't make him out to be an innocent party here. I believe I made a comment before to (person in question) in relation to the comment and how he isn't in great trim himself and was contradicting himself by it at a time when you weren't around us and he took it well because he knew he struck the first blow and was only going to recieve criticism in return. It's no secret that (person in question) is no Brad Pitt. Have I gone and berated (person in question) over his appearance? No I f**king have not so don't cut that lie out with me.''

Where have I insulted him? Is saying he's no Brad Pitt classified as an insult? No it isn't because if it is I'm insulting every man on this planet. Is saying he isn't in great trim himself to state his contradiction an insult? No it isn't. Here in this paragraph I've knocked that allegation right back. I have stated that I did confront him about this before in more of a light hearted manner and I stated he took it well. This did happen as I wouldn't have stated otherwise, if he disputes this then he has a bad memory. He can have nothing to mope or cry about since has taken the piss out of the original victim himself and has done on many an occasion.

I've done nothing there. If he has taken this (nothing) to heart then thats his problem. The fact that CD is forwarding this to him with your backing when its nothing proves to me dirty tactics is played out here and that CD is only but trying to recruit troops for his cause. How do I even know that M has taken any offence? You could be lying for all I care and have done with this allegation.

Oh again (I'll bold this so everyone can see) with regards to your allegation here and CD's allegation you and him have shown a disturbing hypocracy that is frankly astonishing. You say that the original incident is a ''nothing matter'' but what I said (or didn't say as far as I'm concerned) is insulting? Don't you dare insult my intelligence or make me out to be the bad guy here. And don't you conveniently avoid your hypocricy next time you post here!!!

Slash/ED wrote:

Again not true, if not to insult tell me why did you go mentioning other names who weren't even involved in the original insult? What possible logic could you have there? I didn't take offence to it because I'm not farcially thin skinned but I do genuinley wonder why you saw fit to mention me and others out of the blue.

I stated this in the email and stated in my previous post you have laughed in relation to the original incident before. The mentioning of you was warranted as far as I'm concerned because as has been proven with your stance, you were only going to take one side due to your known attitude in releation to the original incident. I stated a fact that was perfectly acceptable. There was nothing insulting in the slightest.

Slash/ED wrote:

Stop dismissing anyone who disagrees with you as one sided. On friday when I talked to you I thought the other person has over reacted and you were probably correct, since then I talked to him and now this is my conclusion. What I'm saying is based entirely on what I made of reading your e-mails, is this all some conspiracy to get you or is there simply truth to what I'm saying? Everybody bar you isn't wrong.

I've talked over the incident and showed two of them what I was talking about with three people who you wouldn't know (no not my mum or dad), people who weren't biased in the slightest and every single one of them agreed that the original incident was disgraceful and they questioned as to why I associate with someone who would do that and to someone who can condone those actions. I doubted myself slightly before this but I'm happy know that I called the shots correctly.

Slash/ED wrote:

If you objected to what was being said why on earth did you not say anything?

I thought you said you read the emails? The answer is there in them, full and frank explained.

Slash/ED wrote:

See how glad you are if you've gone and alienated most of your mates.

I have not done that. I've been alienated because I spoke out against someone. I stick by that and to say I have aleinated you guys is untrue and deeply hurtful.

Slash/ED wrote:

Simple fact of life, groups of lads together our age say alot of things that could be deemed offencive, you have to be able to accept that. Stop trying to be some kind of moral superhero all you're doing is alienating people who are genuine mates over something that's simply not worth it. Honestly, think about what your actions here might mean, take it from someone involved in that circle, it's just not worth it.

I'm defending myself, I'm not going to bullied by his or your put all the blame on me agenda.

Slash/ED wrote:

Yes I know the original ins and outs of the incident, it's fairly straight forward. Weather he was out of order or not isn't the issue for the last time, read what I said above, if you had of once, just ONCE raised an objection to any of this you'd have a case as he'd have been a príck to ignore you (And I would have been the first to condem him if he had of ignored you if you'd raised an objection, but you didn't).

Nothing takes away from the fact that he was out of roder. Sweep the original incident under the carpet why don't you.

Slash/ED wrote:

Easy to say that, why does nobody who knows everything agree? Again, this isn't about the acceptableness of the original incident. I'm not trying to make you look like the bad guy, I do however think your actions have been hideously misguided and unless loseing friends was your intention the tone of your replys were stupid. Can you not see this?

For some who apparently has read the emails you are painting a bad picture of me and you have made wild allegations against me. That is disgraceful. Sharing confidential emails is aslo disgraceful. I'm not going to be bullied or intimidated into a corner by him, you or anyone else. I'm stronger than that, my conscience is clear. Both of you want to continue to milk this incident by putting the entire blame on me for your egos. That's pathetic.

In the eyes of the boards users CD is getting away with blue murder. You are looking the superhero too but if I could mention the exact details of the original incident all of that would turn around.

I know the original incident was his fault, I know I never intended to be threatening in my response, I know he never tried to reason in his response to the incident, I know I never insulted you or anyone else and I know I never insulted M.

Again I'll say I don't want to fight but I'm standing up for myself and for someone else and I'm gonna let nothing deter me in doing so.

Jonny Arson

- Well this thread has gone wildly off course. If Slash/ED wants to argue my post then let him do but its down to you mods at the end of the day.

Victor

Chill folks, especially Sangre & peachypants

Slash/ED

Zane from MTV2 wrote:

It was abusive, it ridiculed the person - for an intelligent bloke how on earth
can you not understand that? You are condoning this. For the record it was disguised so the person wouldn't understand what it meant, then cowardly lying about it from him to the person in question, also a harmless but devious (now conveniently deleated) comment towards me to attract the victims attention and then a further comment by him to say that this ''joke'' involved me. I could go on and on, it was abusive, end of.

I do not remember this harmless but devious now convinently deleted message towards you, PM me if you don't want to talk about it here. It was just childish but ultimately did no harm whatsoever. To react like this is stupid.

I'll state again I was furious (I still am furious), it was heavy handed, maybe it looks like its a threat but I can guarantee you it wasn't. He has used this as his whole argument against me to defend the original incident.

How can you read it as anything other than a threat? What exactly did you mean then? Don't say it was a warning, I mean literally, what EXACTLY did you mean!?

Two different things obviously but nothing makes his actions excusable no matter how much you or he like to think it was acceptable.

Excusable is a strong word. I've told you, it was stupid but it did not harm anyone. To possibley throw away a good friend or more, ask yourself, is it worth it? If you think it is frankly you're going about this well.

I've just proofed over the emails to make 100% sure I'm spot on and again I never insulted you or others. You and someone else were metioned in relation to your previous lets say ''light hearted'' attitude towards this and I make a perfectly acceptable presumption that you would take this stance. There's no insulting of you or others, where on earth are you getting this from?

Why did you need to mention people though? You said something about me and others "they're hiding behind their keyboards laughing away" "I was put in a very ****ing difficult position surrounded by 8-9 blokes laughing away like the big men they are and me the only one having a bit of cop on", why bring others into it? Why go and insult pretty much the entire group? What are you hopeing to achieve here? It's not a huge insult, but on your part it's f*cking stupidity, can you not see this!?

NO I DID NOT EVER INSULT THE PERSON IN QUESTION HERE!

I made a point in releation to the original incident about this person on how I felt there was a sense of irony. CD took it upon himself to throw this allegation at me for which you have followed up. Maybe there wasn't much of reason to throw it up but to make an allegation like this out of nothing is outrageous.

For the last time...

Who are you arguing with here? It's not an allegation and I'm not following up on anything, I'm making my own opinions and as I've stated it's an opinion he himself shares. That says it all and is all you should be concerned with.

I have nothing to hide, here is what I said in the email....
''(person in question) was been an arsehole by taking the piss out (victim of original incident) so don't make him out to be an innocent party here. I believe I made a comment before to (person in question) in relation to the comment and how he isn't in great trim himself and was contradicting himself by it at a time when you weren't around us and he took it well because he knew he struck the first blow and was only going to recieve criticism in return. It's no secret that (person in question) is no Brad Pitt. Have I gone and berated (person in question) over his appearance? No I f**king have not so don't cut that lie out with me.'

Where have I insulted him? Is saying he's no Brad Pitt classified as an insult? No it isn't because if it is I'm insulting every man on this planet. Is saying he isn't in great trim himself to state his contradiction an insult? No it isn't. Here in this paragraph I've knocked that allegation right back. I have stated that I did confront him about this before in more of a light hearted manner and I stated he took it well. This did happen as I wouldn't have stated otherwise, if he disputes this then he has a bad memory. He can have nothing to mope or cry about since has taken the piss out of the original victim himself and has done on many an occasion.'

That's not the e-mail in question it was the one where you said it was "major irony" him calling anyone fat. It's just not something you say about a mate, not one you want to remain mates with anyway. He's píssed off, talk about it with him not me.

He also says you have never said anything to his face about it, again talk to him about it.

Whatever about what he's done in the past there's a difference between how you talk about mates and how you talk about complete strangers who don't even live in the city you live in, if you can't see this I give up.

I've done nothing there. If he has taken this (nothing) to heart then thats his problem. The fact that CD is forwarding this to him with your backing when its nothing proves to me dirty tactics is played out here and that CD is only but trying to recruit troops for his cause. How do I even know that M has taken any offence? You could be lying for all I care and have done with this allegation.

If it's his problem it's your problem unless you don't care about offending him.

There are no ****ing dirty tactics, STOP WITH THE CONSPIRACY THEORYS. SOME PEOPLE CAN DISAGREE WITH YOU WITHOUT THERE BEING OTHER MOTIVES. LEARN THIS.

There is no recruiting. Stop this utter nonsense it's plain embarassing.

Oh again (I'll bold this so everyone can see) with regards to your allegation here and CD's allegation you and him have shown a disturbing hypocracy that is frankly astonishing. You say that the original incident is a ''nothing matter'' but what I said (or didn't say as far as I'm concerned) is insulting? Don't you dare insult my intelligence or make me out to be the bad guy here. And don't you conveniently avoid your hypocricy next time you post here!!!

Again, learn the difference between mates and complete strangers. It may be a hypocracy but it's a way of life.

I stated this in the email and stated in my previous post you have laughed in relation to the original incident before. The mentioning of you was warranted as far as I'm concerned because as has been proven with your stance, you were only going to take one side due to your known attitude in releation to the original incident. I stated a fact that was perfectly acceptable. There was nothing insulting in the slightest.

My stance, once more, was the original incident was childish. This isn't about the original incicent. A concept lost on you.

I've talked over the incident and showed two of them what I was talking about with three people who you wouldn't know (no not my mum or dad), people who weren't biased in the slightest and every single one of them agreed that the original incident was disgraceful and they questioned as to why I associate with someone who would do that and to someone who can condone those actions. I doubted myself slightly before this but I'm happy know that I called the shots correctly.

I don't mean to sound harsh here, but will you still think your happy if you lose most of your friends over this?

I have not done that. I've been alienated because I spoke out against someone. I stick by that and to say I have aleinated you guys is untrue and deeply hurtful.

You didn't speak out against someone, you said you'd kick their head in. For the love of god are you in total denial about your first e-mail and the way it could be precieved?

I'm defending myself, I'm not going to bullied by his or your put all the blame on me agenda.

THERE IS NO ****ING AGENDA. There is not a capital letter large enough to emphasise that point.

Nothing takes away from the fact that he was out of roder. Sweep the original incident under the carpet why don't you.

So were you, and far more so, that's the issue here.

For some who apparently has read the emails you are painting a bad picture of me and you have made wild allegations against me. That is disgraceful. Sharing confidential emails is aslo disgraceful. I'm not going to be bullied or intimidated into a corner by him, you or anyone else. I'm stronger than that, my conscience is clear. Both of you want to continue to milk this incident by putting the entire blame on me for your egos. That's pathetic.

The only allegation is over something that doesn't involve me, once more I suggest you talk to the other person about it. Sharing confidental e-mails isn't a disgrace if you're going to be discussing others in it, you see if a mate sees another being talked about he's going to tell them. The concept of freindship seems lost on you.

Nobody is tyring to bully you. Nobody is trying to intimate you. If you can't get over your farcial paranoia you'll end up with nobody. What the **** has my ego got to do with anything? Why would I want to milk this incident? Why why why!? Talk some sense and get some ****ing perspective. This utter nonsense is annoying me now, you can't talk to you and offer a different point of view without agenda and other utter rubbish. Can you not accept others can disagree!? Do you not wonder why they do!?

Slash/ED

I know the original incident was his fault, I know I never intended to be threatening in my response, I know he never tried to reason in his response to the incident, I know I never insulted you or anyone else and I know I never insulted M.

Again I'll say I don't want to fight but I'm standing up for myself and for someone else and I'm gonna let nothing deter me in doing so.

You're not acting like you don't want to fight. Lets run through this

1 Joke
2 Threatening to kick someones head in
3 a few e-mails exchanged
4 Anyone who disagrees with your stance has an agenda and is out to bully and intimate you.

Look, if you don't drop this paranoid everybodys out to get me bullsh*t that is not exactly unusual from you you'll lose all of your friends given enough time. I don't want to be harsh, but that's a simple fact.

For me, your attitude here is simple. You've stuck your neck out and to go back now would be a sign of weakness and you can't do that as everyones out to get you so you have to be "strong". In reality it makes you look anything but strong but more to the point if you have that attitude you'll never survive in a big group as frankly people say offencive things. If you have skin as thin as yours you'll end up in this situation more than once as you have. I've no interest in loseing friends but I've also no interest in humouring people over utter f*cking stupidity. This incident doesn't involve me I just happen to be the one registered here. Take it up with the two people you've really píssed off, if you don't who knows what will happen. Nobody wants to see that, but I do know if you continue with this utterly ridiculas mentality you wont get very far at all.

It's a group of friends late teenage/early 20s friends, we have a laugh alot of the time at some peoples expence. Ask yourself, can you take this? If yeah then just give as good as you get, if no you're better off alone. It's as simple as that.

Chucky the tree

sigh..

back in my day it would a trip to the local green for a straightner, then a game of footie afterwards.

Infairness lads, arguing through email? Thats fairly pathetic. Both of yous seem to admit its something thats really stupid to be having a fight over, let neither of you are willing to sort it out properly?

Grow a pair of balls, meet up face to face and get it sorted. Not in a violent way, but jsut sit and chat about it. If you arent mature enough to have a talk with someone face to face but need email to do it, thats pretty sad.

honru

Zane, I don't think forcing an apology out of this person is very productive. Are you really going to stay budged to this position for the rest of your life? Look at the amount of effort put into this arguement as evidenced by this thread. You could have spent that time working on a hobby, or socialising with new people.

You also could have called out on his shít in a civil manner FACE TO FACE without having to resort to physical violence through email. OK, we all get furious sometimes, but if someone treats you with disrespect, I would not lose my cool about it. You're just burning too much emotional energy, while (in your case) effecting your social peer group in the process. Is it really all worth it?

Instead, I would reconsider this person in your life. Does he add to it, or bring negativity? Did he acknoledge his actions, or refute them? Use your own judgement and simply remove or limit this person from your life. Be strong about it, and don't show that his actions, heavy-handed as they might be, effect you. In the end, it's your life man. The time is ticking and you've got to move on at some point.

DapperGent

lol Zane's a nutcase.

PI is always good for a laugh.

Jonny Arson

Slash/ED wrote:

How can you read it as anything other than a threat? What exactly did you mean then? Don't say it was a warning, I mean literally, what EXACTLY did you mean!?

I said it was a heavy handed warning. I was the one who typed it and I know what it meant. Draw your own conclusion on it if you want but I know what I meant.

Slash/ED wrote:

Excusable is a strong word. I've told you, it was stupid but it did not harm anyone. To possibley throw away a good friend or more, ask yourself, is it worth it? If you think it is frankly you're going about this well.

It didn't ''harm'' anyone because it was behind someone's back yet in a way rubbing it in their face. The intent behind it (to insult and ridicule) doesn't change if someone doesn't know what it's about.

Slash/ED wrote:

Why did you need to mention people though? You said something about me and others "they're hiding behind their keyboards laughing away" "I was put in a very ****ing difficult position surrounded by 8-9 blokes laughing away like the big men they are and me the only one having a bit of cop on", why bring others into it? Why go and insult pretty much the entire group? What are you hopeing to achieve here? It's not a huge insult, but on your part it's f*cking stupidity, can you not see this!?

But its true though so it's relevent to an extent. I mentioned you and other people because 1. I knew what your attitudes would be towards the insult and 2. I knew what your reactions would be when I spoke out. Both counts have been proven true. Don't dare accuse me of insulting you or others when I didn't

Slash/ED wrote:

Who are you arguing with here? It's not an allegation and I'm not following up on anything, I'm making my own opinions and as I've stated it's an opinion he himself shares. That says it all and is all you should be concerned with.

You have backed up his intital allegation word for word literally. There's nothing there.

Slash/ED wrote:

That's not the e-mail in question it was the one where you said it was "major irony" him calling anyone fat. It's just not something you say about a mate, not one you want to remain mates with anyway. He's píssed off, talk about it with him not me.

I stated a fact that is an irony to an extent. I never insulted him or ridiculed him like CD and you want to make out. I made a comment and observation in relation to the original incident in order to back up my beliefs. It probably wasn't necessary but to state that I have insulted my friend in derogatory manner when I never did is untrue.

Of course as with the original incident your moral highground here is beyond hypocisy its unreal.

Slash/ED wrote:

He also says you have never said anything to his face about it, again talk to him about it.

I did in relation to his constant pisstaking of the person in question.

Slash/ED wrote:

Whatever about what he's done in the past there's a difference between how you talk about mates and how you talk about complete strangers who don't even live in the city you live in, if you can't see this I give up.

Insulting a person is insulting a person and if you can't see this I give up.

Slash/ED wrote:

There are no ****ing dirty tactics, STOP WITH THE CONSPIRACY THEORYS. SOME PEOPLE CAN DISAGREE WITH YOU WITHOUT THERE BEING OTHER MOTIVES. LEARN THIS.

CD stated in his email that he wasn't going to forward it to M. He has, he lied and I knew he would do this. That is dirty tactics.

Zane from MTV2 wrote:

Oh again (I'll bold this so everyone can see) with regards to your allegation here and CD's allegation you and him have shown a disturbing hypocracy that is frankly astonishing. You say that the original incident is a ''nothing matter'' but what I said (or didn't say as far as I'm concerned) is insulting? Don't you dare insult my intelligence or make me out to be the bad guy here. And don't you conveniently avoid your hypocricy next time you post here!!!

Slash/ED wrote:

Again, learn the difference between mates and complete strangers. It may be a hypocracy but it's a way of life.

You flawed your entire argument and stance here which was flawed anyway.

You have stated that it is perfectly acceptable to insult a person who is a friend of a friend but it isn't acceptable to insult a direct friend (which I never did). Your double standards and you hypocrisy is absolutely vile and disgraceful. You have no logic. You've acknowledged that you are hyprocritical, good to see some sense from you all of a sudden but know stop being delusional and acknowledge that the original incident was insulting.

Slash/ED wrote:

My stance, once more, was the original incident was childish. This isn't about the original incicent. A concept lost on you.

All this hullabaloo would have never happened if the original incident hadn't of happened in first place so stop deluding yourself by acting as it never happened.

Slash/ED wrote:

I don't mean to sound harsh here, but will you still think your happy if you lose most of your friends over this?

Lose friends over sticking up for someone when my good aul mates were insulting them.? Lose friends over false allegations? Lose my friends over their hypocracy and denial over the orignal incident?

I don't think I'm losing friends, I don't believe I had them in the first place.

Slash/ED wrote:

You didn't speak out against someone, you said you'd kick their head in. For the love of god are you in total denial about your first e-mail and the way it could be precieved?

I don't have time for you or ''him'' when both of you continue to delude yourselves over the original incident. Why are both you in denial that's the question that must be answered first.

Slash/ED wrote:

THERE IS NO ****ING AGENDA. There is not a capital letter large enough to emphasise that point.

With lies, false allegations, denial over the original incident, forwarding confidential emails, backtracking on saying that they wouldn't be forwarded? Yes there is a ****ing agenda.

Slash/ED wrote:

So were you, and far more so, that's the issue here.

Continue to deny the original incident ever happened for your buddy. All of this sh!t wouldn't have started if wasn't for him.

Slash/ED wrote:

The only allegation is over something that doesn't involve me, once more I suggest you talk to the other person about it. Sharing confidental e-mails isn't a disgrace if you're going to be discussing others in it, you see if a mate sees another being talked about he's going to tell them. The concept of freindship seems lost on you.

Again I never insulted anyone. Made perfectly reasonable statements. You don't see to have much of an appreciation of friendship either when both of you make up false allegations that I insulted people.

Slash/ED wrote:

Nobody is tyring to bully you. Nobody is trying to intimate you. If you can't get over your farcial paranoia you'll end up with nobody.

Paranoia over when he insulted someone? That isn't paranoia, thats fact.

Slash/ED wrote:

What the **** has my ego got to do with anything? Why would I want to milk this incident? Why why why!? Talk some sense and get some ****ing perspective. This utter nonsense is annoying me now, you can't talk to you and offer a different point of view without agenda and other utter rubbish. Can you not accept others can disagree!? Do you not wonder why they do!?

Sorry you've contradicted your point of view already. I can't take anything you write seriously from now on.. You resorted to making false allegations agasint me based on nothing. You've rehashed the original culprits story word for f**king word. You've had no imparitality here.

I'm getting fed up of your one sided loyal stance. You know he's in the wrong yet you won't admit that even though you've contradicited yourself on it.

You can and ''him'' can continue to try and put the blame game on me but I'm not buying that. He's got no case, you've got no case (you've flawed that with admitting above that you are hyprocritical towards the original incident).

dudara

The next poster(s) to continue this silly argument will be banned, no warnings given.

Dapper Gent, you're on thin ice. Stick to the OT.

Slash/ED

Zane from MTV2 wrote:

I said it was a heavy handed warning. I was the one who typed it and I know what it meant. Draw your own conclusion on it if you want but I know what I meant.

What on earth is heavy handed warning supposed to mean if not a warning you'll kick his head in. Please tell me LITERALLY what exactly you were saying would happen.

It didn't ''harm'' anyone because it was behind someone's back yet in a way rubbing it in their face. The intent behind it (to insult and ridicule) doesn't change if someone doesn't know what it's about.

If the intent was to ridicule they'd have ridiculed. It was just a childish thing that happened, nobody was hurt, you reacted like he'd killed one of your relatives or something.

But its true though so it's relevent to an extent. I mentioned you and other people because 1. I knew what your attitudes would be towards the insult and 2. I knew what your reactions would be when I spoke out. Both counts have been proven true. Don't dare accuse me of insulting you or others when I didn't

Did you not read what you wrote? You can't just deny what's in black and white.

You have backed up his intital allegation word for word literally. There's nothing there.

Well others disagree. That's more relevent.

I stated a fact that is an irony to an extent. I never insulted him or ridiculed him like CD and you want to make out. I made a comment and observation in relation to the original incident in order to back up my beliefs. It probably wasn't necessary but to state that I have insulted my friend in derogatory manner when I never did is untrue.

He disagrees, who cares what I think?

Of course as with the original incident your moral highground here is beyond hypocisy its unreal.

WILL YOU LEARN TO F*CKING READ. I have said numerous times the original incident was childish.

I did in relation to his constant pisstaking of the person in question.

Not what he said, for the last time, take it up with him.

Insulting a person is insulting a person and if you can't see this I give up.

If you can't take people being insulted don't hang around with a group. Looks like you've taken measures to ensure this is the case already.

CD stated in his email that he wasn't going to forward it to M. He has, he lied and I knew he would do this. That is dirty tactics.

Actually he didn't, he was asked on saturday about it and showed him the e-mails. It's not dirty tactics it's being a friend.

You flawed your entire argument and stance here which was flawed anyway.

You have stated that it is perfectly acceptable to insult a person who is a friend of a friend but it isn't acceptable to insult a direct friend (which I never did). Your double standards and you hypocrisy is absolutely vile and disgraceful. You have no logic. You've acknowledged that you are hyprocritical, good to see some sense from you all of a sudden but know stop being delusional and acknowledge that the original incident was insulting.

It's not acceptable it's just what happens, it happens with everyone not just us, get used to it.

All this hullabaloo would have never happened if the original incident hadn't of happened in first place so stop deluding yourself by acting as it never happened.

Where have I done this? Stop being an idiot.

Lose friends over sticking up for someone when my good aul mates were insulting them.? Lose friends over false allegations? Lose my friends over their hypocracy and denial over the orignal incident?

Okay, it's real simple so pay attention. Groups of people our age will insult other people and people within the group. If you can't handle this, then you're doing the right thing. It makes you the most thin skinned person I've ever come across but it's better for you in the long run that you just don't hang around with people, who knows what you might hear?

I don't think I'm losing friends, I don't believe I had them in the first place.

You believe this over someone insulting someone? Jesus H Christ That's one of the funniest things I've ever read. If you believe that why are you arguing with anyone? If you never had friends in the first place and this was some agenda to get rid of you nobody would bother, we'd simple stop talking to you. It would not be difficult.

I don't have time for you or ''him'' when both of you continue to delude yourselves over the original incident. Why are both you in denial that's the question that must be answered first.

READ WHAT I SAID ABOUT THE ORIGINAL INCIDENT AROUND A BILLION TIMES.

With lies, false allegations, denial over the original incident, forwarding confidential emails, backtracking on saying that they wouldn't be forwarded? Yes there is a ****ing agenda.

What lies and false allegations? There is no denial about the original incident and the e-mails were shown to anyone who asked which is fairer than giving a one sided report on what happened in them.

Tell me, please, what is the agenda. To get you? Why would we bother? If we'd a problem with you we'd just stop hanging around with you, something which will probably happen now tbh but only because of your own reaction. We wouldn't bother with this.

Why do you always think there's an agenda? The mods here are conspiring against you, lecturers in UCD wanted people to fail, I think I remember you accusing GH of something similar and now we all have an agenda against you. WHAT AGENDA? WHY WOULD WE BOTHER?

Continue to deny the original incident ever happened for your buddy. All of this sh!t wouldn't have started if wasn't for him.

Shut the **** up and learn to read.

Again I never insulted anyone. Made perfectly reasonable statements. You don't see to have much of an appreciation of friendship either when both of you make up false allegations that I insulted people.

"I saw that. You've just shown what a ****ing arsehole you are. Are you looking to get your head kicked in coz you're not far off it.

Oh BTW I know you'll forward this to email to everyone else since you quite obviously take the piss behind my back"

No insults, perfectly reasnoable statements? That was the opening e-mail!

Nobodys making up allegations. The people in question seem to think they were insulted based on the e-mail. Mass lets all get you agenda that everybody on the planet shares or something less sinister?
Paranoia over when he insulted someone? That isn't paranoia, thats fact.

Sorry you've contradicted your point of view already. I can't take anything you write seriously from now on.. You resorted to making false allegations agasint me based on nothing. You've rehashed the original culprits story word for f**king word. You've had no imparitality here.

So by agreeing with someone I've no impartiality? I was impartial, I read the e-mails and now this is my point of view. PEOPLE CAN DISAGREE WITH YOU WITHOUT IT BEING A CONSPIRACY.

I'm getting fed up of your one sided loyal stance. You know he's in the wrong yet you won't admit that even though you've contradicited yourself on it.

My stance is based on what I read and nothing else.

You can and ''him'' can continue to try and put the blame game on me but I'm not buying that. He's got no case, you've got no case (you've flawed that with admitting above that you are hyprocritical towards the original incident).

Nobodys putting the blame on anyone, if we were out to get you we'd simply ignore you, an ever more attractive looking proposition.



You seem to think of this as some kind of battle, and you can't stand down as you need to be 'strong' and it's all some kind of power struggle of some kind. It's pathetic. Your paranoia and talk of agendas is pure fantasy but you've managed to annoy me now as well as others with your utter nonsense on here. I've no more interest in this debate, I've said what's happened and told you why he reacted the way he did. You proceded to tell me I had an agenda, accused me of being the original person and all sorts. The simple truth here is, you cannot take other opinions on board. You just can't. You're incapable of doing that without accusing everyone of everything, people can't disagree with you because you always have to be right.

For the love of god all this is over someone insulting someone. Without being harsh, if you can't take that you'll never be capable of hanging around with friends, anywhere. It's that simple. You're the most thin skinned on edge reactionary person I've met in my entire life and this incident is one of many that show that. If you can't get used to something like this you're better off without any mates and you're going some way to achieveing that target. Honestly, think about this in time if indeed you end up cutting yourself off from the entire group and loseing most of your mates. Maybe you were wrong. Maybe reacting like you have was the stupidest thing I can possibley imagine and maybe the world isn't out to get you and you've simpley brought it on yourself.

I doubt I'll reply again unless you come out with some complete lies. This isn't between me and you yet you seem to want to make it one you against the world thing. Talk to the people in question if you must, I'm finished with it and I just don't care anymore. Continue to think the worlds out to get you and you must stand tall against the forces of evil if you must, see how far it gets you, I've lost all patience with you despite doing my best to be as impartial and neutrul as possible initially and I'm done here.

Victor

2:32am No time to read the above.

Guys take it to PM or Real Life™.

dudara

Slash/ED banned for completely ignoring what I said in an earlier post.

If anyone else wants a banning, please feel free to continue posting in a similar vein.