Help re primary school

ST*

I know by far I'm not the only one in this position but -
could anyone tell me on what basis a primary school can refuse your child a place?

The primary school that I want my son to go to wouldn't take names before a certain date. On the actual date of registration I was third in line, with all the nessesary documents, filled out the enrolment form and was given an information booklet on the school with its rules & regulations enclosed.

I've been infomed by the school that unless I've received a letter of acceptance out, your child does not have a place.

There is no good reason why my son shouldnt get a place, he was 4 last month, he has had a year of playschool and if I do not get him into a school this year he will be 5 and fast approaching 6 in junior infants the following year.

I've been to other schools in the area and they are fully enrolled with waiting lists out the door also.

I've been told by another principal to fight my case, speak to the dept of ed and appeal (Act 29) - Is this what it has come to when trying to get your child into school?

The son im trying to get into a school is the eldest, so its my first time doing all of this. But I'm furious that not so much as a note went out to parents of children that didnt get a place.

I've been onto the dept this morning, and they are sending me out appeal forms etc. Has anyone else gone through this and won their case?

Nevyn

First off it is a chiristain/catholic school ?
Those schools build thier cachement on the bases of the parish they are attached to.
Preference is given to children of that parish and then nearby parishes and finally children that are not of the religion of the school.

Legally your child is entitled to be edcuated but not in the school of your choice

ST*

Thanks for the reply Thae, much appreciated because I'm at my wits end with this one.

There is two national schools in the area. The school at the opposite end of the town is full up also, I've gone outside of the town, same situation, and they are only taking names for cancellation lists - and at that, locals will be favoured.

Now you asked about religon, we are catholics, as is the school (although other religon 'friendly') The school and the local church are linked (both are St. Peter and Pauls). I've heard some people are arguing their cases based on that fact.

Its such a mess - I've no idea whether there is a point in my appealing or not, quite a few other parents are.

Nevyn

One of the other reasons for slection is if there are other siblings in the school,
as children who have other siblings already enrolled will get slected over those who don't.

The school should be able to give you a copy of thier enrollement policy which should outline thier cirtiea for slecting children.

You should certainly appeal.

It is not that the birth rate exploded over the last 6 years but more that new communities have sprung up due to housing developements and the communites are struggling to keep up and schools are one of those pressure points.
There are schools that have lists that are for the next 3 years with children on them and in some cases longer.

I would also if I were you have a word with your local parish priest as he would be the patron of the school and on the board of management and see if any of your local TD's can help.

I can understand that this must be incredibly frustrating for you.
It would seem that primary schools while they can enroll children from the age of 4 upwards they seem to prefer to wait until the child is 5 or going to be 6 with in the first year.
I certainly had to argue to get my daughter to start school 3 months after she had turned 4 she was 5 at the end of her first school year.

ST*

Thaedydal wrote:

I would also if I were you have a word with your local parish priest as he would be the patron of the school and on the board of management and see if any of your local TD's can help

I'll do that Thae - and when I get the appeal forms, I will get them out asap too. You are right, it is really annoying - but I had to smile when all of the 'catholics' seemed to come out of the woodwork once they found out their child hadnt got a place..

off I go to join the hypocrital band wagon

Thanks again.

gonker

As said before a school should have an acceptance policy. My kids old school was
1. living within 3 miles of the school (we lived in a rural area)
2. Brothers & Sisters of pupils in the school (if they lived outside the 3 miles)
3. Children of Teachers
4. Any other child (outside the other 2) in the order they apply to the school.

I would appeal big time. Your child is old enough to start school, its not as if he will be just 4 starting school.
Appeal appeal appeal.
And good luck

ST*

gonker wrote:

As said before a school should have an acceptance policy. My kids old school was
1. living within 3 miles of the school (we lived in a rural area)
2. Brothers & Sisters of pupils in the school (if they lived outside the 3 miles)
3. Children of Teachers
4. Any other child (outside the other 2) in the order they apply to the school.
I would appeal big time. Your child is old enough to start school, its not as if he will be just 4 starting school.
Appeal appeal appeal.
And good luck

Thanks for that - well, after a visit to the church I was informed that they have no sway in the schools decision. After that again I went back to the school and spoke to the principal (now in the boot of my car*), who said they were waiting on a letter from the dept of ed to allow extra students to attend. She said there should be one more small round of acceptance letters going out, and I should hear back mid next week one way or the other.

She herself was suprised to hear that my son wasn't given a place taking his DOB, living nearby, having playschool under his belt etc.

Fingers crossed anyway










**I'll release her as soon as he is given a place

gonker

Good luck let us know how you get on. I was surprised too to see your son was refused.

Make sure you feed her wouldnt want murder on your hands....bread and water is good enough..:D

ArthurDent

If it still isn't sorted out by the next round of offers - make sure you ask for their enrolment policy , in writing, they are legally obliged to provide you with a copy. If there are no ground according to the policy that allowed for you son to be denied a place write a letter to the Board of Managment and copy it to the local NEWB (national education wefare board) officer.You can then decide to take a section 29 appeal.

I know this sounds awfully formal, but if you are to be sucessful in appealing this decision it is vital that you do this according to procedures.

best of luck

luckat

Is there a local Protestant school?

lostexpectation

how does the princippal know why your son was refused?

jimmy rodgers

I might be wrong, but I think the education act doesnt kick in until a child is 6 years old.... i.e., section 29 of ed act and NEWB do not become involved until a child is out of school and is 6

ST*

jimmy rodgers wrote:

I might be wrong, but I think the education act doesnt kick in until a child is 6 years old.... i.e., section 29 of ed act and NEWB do not become involved until a child is out of school and is 6

Oh dont say that! :eek: I'll have to find that out now..

Outside of that, I went back to the school Tuesday. they told me to come back today. I went back today. they then told me that it will be later in the week. The thing is, they have a list on standby if they get the go ahead from the dept. they wont even tell me if he is on that list of 'maybes'.
So frustrating

ST*

I just got home and found a letter on the door mat.

He got a place!!!

Of course down the end of the page I was advised what registration fees etc that has to be paid first :rolleyes:

Anyway, I won't complain - he has his place and I've let the principal out of the boot

gonker

Oh thats great. Thats a load off your mind I'd say.:D

TempestSabre

I was going to say get on to you local politicians. Always good to make a large noise on issue like this. We have the same issues in our area with kids places. With all the money floating around its a scandal that people have to fight tooth and nail to get their kids into schools.

ArthurDent

TempestSabre wrote:

I was going to say get on to you local politicians. Always good to make a large noise on issue like this. We have the same issues in our area with kids places. With all the money floating around its a scandal that people have to fight tooth and nail to get their kids into schools.

No offence but comments like this make me want to scream! If an enrolment policy is being applied correctly - (and I say if - because if it isn't by all means take a section 29 case) - why should he who has access to the politician with the biggest pull get a place that they are not entitled to.

If you want to tackle politicians about schools - by all means do so, but do so on the right grounds - not enough funding, too many kids per class, not enough schools, very little access to multidenominational schooling, schools that refuse entry to special needs kids.

All schools are obliged to have an enrolment policy - it may be one that you don't like but that's basically tough - we the people have allowed an educational system that is to a very large extent controlled by denominational authorities. Most schools have enrolment policies based on parish boundaries and most problems that arise are becuase parents percieve that their "parish" school is not one they want to send their kids too.

You want to chage the system do so - but don't try and circumvent it.

TempestSabre

I'm amused that you immediately associate contacting a politician with using "pull". I merely meant if its a issue in the area make you politician work towards that. We got extra classroom approved from the dept after pressure was applied.

Most problem in our area are from lack of resources and a planning policy that has crammed every nook and cranny with more housing and no facilities. Of course we know why the housing gets approved... :rolleyes:

ArthurDent

TempestSabre wrote:

I'm amused that you immediately associate contacting a politician with using "pull". I merely meant if its a issue in the area make you politician work towards that. We got extra classroom approved from the dept after pressure was applied.

Most problem in our area are from lack of resources and a planning policy that has crammed every nook and cranny with more housing and no facilities. Of course we know why the housing gets approved... :rolleyes:

I apologise if you weren't telling op to contact politician and make a big noise about his child not getting a place in the school he wants to send him to - to me that sounded like trying to use pull. I agree with you 100% that making politicians do something to resolve school accomodation is absolutely appropriate - its just I've been on the other side of "helpful" letters* from politicians suggesting that we might see our way to allowing a particular child access ( and hence deprive another child) to a school place they were not entitled to.

* such letters tend to get filed where they deserve to be - in the bin, along with those that arrive around election time remininding us how much the politicians have done for us over the past x years - some even have the damn cheek to try and hand out their leaflets on school property

TempestSabre

Its a poor reflection on the politicans isn't it.

Nevyn

It was I that suggested speaking to the local TD's and I would suggest it again.

Shock_treatment is a parent new to the fun and games that is the education system in this country and I do agree that all parents should be lobbying thier TDs about the pitfalls and short falls facing all schools and the lack of multidenominal schools.

We should all be active in making those that are ment to be working for us
be aware of what needs to be done and try make them at least try to do something constructive.