Could a Shotokan Karate expert beat a killer whale?

memtalman

I was watching a nature programme on TV the other night and a killer whale was helping himself to some seal pups in the South Atlantic, I thought it was very cruel. I couldn't help myself wondering if a Shotokan karate expert was walking by could he do anything to help save the seals from this very one-sided carnage?

The shotokan expert would probably have to swim out quite a bit from the shore, and then I wonder would traditional martial art techniques work in salt-water? Even if they did, he would surely be at an added disadvantage in the turbulent seas near Antarctica.

I did notice the whales had a tendency to temporarily beach themselves at times. I suppose an experienced mixed martial artist would be able to use ground and pound if he got his timing right - but a Shotokan expert? I don't mean to be controversial but I don't think so !!

What do you MMA guys think? Do you have advanced choke techniques that could defeat a killer whale? I dunno, I'm not an expert - but it's an interesting thought!

Cake Fiend

I've successfully used Shotokan techniques against dolphins and sharks, I'd imagine some could be used against killer whales. It's all about adaptation. Kicking techniques would, of course, be severely hindered in water, but the many strikes and locks of karate could easily be made to work. The lack of grounding for the hips would weaken punches significantly, but soft targets such as the eyes could still be valid.

The circumference of a whale's neck, and its lack of limbs, would prove a severe problem for many grappling techniques. I believe, therefore, that striking-centered arts would have the upper hand in such a situation.

However, this is quite an unrealistic scenario. Far more sensible a discussion would be respective arts' effectiveness against land-based predators such as alligators and siberian tigers.

The Bollox

OK, am I the only one who pictures Chuck Norris there instead of a Shotokan master?

memtalman

Sico,

Thanks for your comments, they've really given me the self-confidence to take my life forward. Can you believe I never even thought about the whale's lack of limbs, I can just imagine Randy "The Natural Pain in the Dick" Couture getting handed his ass by the undisputed heavyweight champion of the ocean.

But I do disagree with your comment that "this is quite an unrealistic scenario", ask the poor little baby seals with thier big brown eyes, getting mauled to death by these killing machines (sometimes I get so angry with God for inventing killer whales) - oh yeah, the baby seals thinks it's a pretty realistic scenario - and as usual, not a Shotokan master in sight !!!

MaxBax

whales have limbs. they're not snakes nor are they worms.

MaxBax

and killer whales can hold their breath for like 45mins so i'd assume it would be pretty hard to choke them out.

StrateBlastJim

Man i think the karate guy would become an appetizer.

As for the mma guy trying to ground and pound a beached whale again my money is on the whale, killer whales have been known to beach themselves in an attempt to catch seals on the beach.

if the mma guy approached the whale my money would be on another whale coming out of the water and eating him as the other whale was a diversion.

tricksy hobbits's,, i mean whales.

Musashi

At least the nice man with the baseball bat stuns the seals, so they don't have to see it coming

Cabelo

I have used Mick Kwon Do against most marine mammals and once a Giant Squid... Needless to say 2 arms pwns 10 (or eight and two tentacles if you're one of those pedantic cephalapod jerks!)

Ph3n0m

why attack the killer whale - their record of attacking humans is less frequent, in fact they seem to like us....its just those seals....damn untrustworthy animals...thank christ for sharks, killer whales and seal clubbers

loz

MaxBax wrote:

and killer whales can hold their breath for like 45mins so i'd assume it would be pretty hard to choke them out.

being choked is about blood flow to brain - not air to lungs...............

Roper

hmm, good point, but let's not forget we're talking about a Shotokan Kratty expert and not someone who trains submissions. So I'm invisioning it now... he takes a deep long stance, puts his hand on his hip, and.... chomp, he goes the way of the baby seal. I think my imagination has taken away the need for debate on this topic.

Quillo

loz wrote:

being choked is about blood flow to brain - not air to lungs...............

Choking is about interrupting breathing.
Strangulation is about compressing blood vessels.

Important to know these things when filling out Garda forms

MaeveD

hmmmmm.....Strangulation is also about cutting off oxygen

how about changing its name to 'rear naked stroke' boys?? :rolleyes:

Roper

Reminds me. I was trying to explain 'tapping out' to a bloke I used to work with, and he asked me "what if he doesn't tap out?" I said, "well, then he goes unconscious", to which he replied, " ah yeah, but what if he's into that..." ugh...

Quillo

MaeveD wrote:

hmmmmm.....Strangulation is also about cutting off oxygen

Strangulation: Cutting off oxygen by compressing the blood vessels of the neck through which the oxygenated blood flows to the brain.

As opposed to choking, where the oxygen itself is cut off.

End result is the same - no oxygen gets to the brain, you pass out, and if the process continues, you die.

However, being choked generally results in a violent panic reaction as the person being choked is very much aware that they can not breathe. Compression of the blood vessels at the side of the neck is a lot more sneaky as the first you know about it is typically as you start to pass out......

el tel

Through empirical observation, it would seem to me that the most efficient technique against a beached killer whale would be the prodigiously effective art of Muay Thai. It is for this reason ALONE that killer whales NEVER take baby seals from Thailand's beaches.

Cabelo

I'm made this diagram... it's based on ThaiGuy needing a sparring partner and this thread combined.




I won because he taps like a bitch.


Edit: I've just realised someone could take this the wrong way and I might be banned

I hope you guys would start a "Bring back Cabelo" thread.

BaldiePablo

Has anybody considered the possibility that the Killer Whale could be sporting a knife in his back pocket? Or worse still, a gun. These are killer whales and could well have the tools to allow them live up to their name!! Be careful out there. We're not all Chuck Norris!

el tel

Cabelo wrote:

I'm made this diagram... it's based on ThaiGuy needing a sparring partner and this thread combined.




I won because he taps like a bitch.

LOL!!

Wait a minute... a thai/killer whale cross- never mind the baby seals, we'd all be finished!

MaxBax

loz

my interpretation as always been that chokes are about the trachea and airways. and also soreness via compression.

strangulations are about blood flow, the cartoid arteries.

like you choke on some food? are you choking because the piece of meat trapped in your throat is stopping blood supply to your brain?

i think not

dlofnep

memtalman

I'm just back in from my swim, why did you post the image of the troll?

I'm learning a lot from this thread - I didn't realise that Killer Whales don't mess around with the seals in Thailand. But to the guy who thinks a killer whale could pull a gun, laugh out loud - at this point in thier evolution they don't even have opposable thumbs!!

Looks like my innocent little question has the best martial artists in the country stumped.

Choking is out because of neck circumference, and ground and pound is unlikely to work because not only did God come up with the concept of a large, instatiable, water-borne killing machine he actually gave those bad bastards the ability to hunt in packs (a twist that honestly makes me wonder if He really is all-powerful and all-loving)

TMA boy is rendered impotent because he can't get any leverage on his amazingly powerful thousand year old kicking techniques - so what are we left with ?

Negotiation? I don't think so - whales have no language skills
Retreat? not on my watch

The only thing left is the most powerful of the powerful, the art that stands above all arts ... Judo. The thing is, the particular Judo black belt I have in mind also happens to be the harpoon operater on a Japanese whaling ship - Mr Scary whale, you're busted - inevitably humans win again and Judo marches on !!

MaeveD

the consise oxford dictionary says:

Choke: hinder or impede the breathing by constricting the windpipe

Strangle: Squeeze the windpipe or neck

Stroke: A sudden disabling attack or loss of consciousness caused by an interruption in the flow of blood to the brain

It mat be ugghhh but rear naked stroke sounds more correct

What if the killer whales have concealed badgers???

Beware the Badger :cool:

Quillo

The verbs strangle and choke are generally synonymous in every day use. They both literally mean to restrict the flow of something.

(Though, even in common parlance, to choke on something is widely understood to mean something restricting the airway.)

However, to distinguish between the very different processes involved in restricting airflow in the larynx and compressing the blood vessels in the neck my instructors in the past have usually used the verb "choke" to describe the former and the verb "strangle" or "strangulate" to describe the latter.

I continue to use this approach as it clearly distinguishes between two very different processes.

My Penguin Dictionary (not as authoritive perhaps !) uses both "choke" and "strangle" to describe airflow restriction and "strangulate" to discribe blood flow restriction.

Cabelo

Badgers were the only thing I'd not accounted for, but here's the scene before I used my kratty to choke him...



I cleverly used my Au (that's capoeira talk for cartwheel; keep up) to dodge his bullets before using my patented TMA disarm to relieve him of both his gun and his knife and then choked him out.

Roper

This might sound like a silly question, and I'm sure the answer is obvious, but... why do you have two green willys????

Cabelo

You silly man, that's my cord. Like in other dance classes I've got a thingy around my waist that tells anyone who'll look how deadly I am without me ever having to move.


JEEZ! You've seen my one. In capoeira it serves the secondary function of actually keeping up the pants.

Cake Fiend

Here's an artist's impression of what happened last time a killer whale tried that crap with me:

memtalman

Sico wrote:

Here's an artist's impression of what happened last time a killer whale tried that crap with me:

slightly off-topic ... that's THE worst drawing of a killer whale I've ever seen !!

Cabelo

That thing on the left isn't much better! Not even got fins!

Boru.

Guys you're all forgetting that the true martial arts master is at one with all things. The master would sipmly walk across the water and explain to the whale, non verbally of course, that what it was doing wasn't very nice. Whereupon the wahle woulod immediately recant and asked to be trained by the master and become the sworn protector of all little fishes...oh and a vegetarian.

I know this because i was once that whale....and so began my training in Shotokan....

TwoKingMick

http://youtube.com/watch.php?v=4YNyh3RbcyE

Rev Hellfire

I was so impressed with your takedowns of those nasty killerwhales that I to decided to help those ohh so fluffy baby seals, using my stealthy ninpo training.

Roper

That whale looks depressed. Still, nice to see him sitting down to a nice meal with Casper the ghost...

Rev Hellfire

Its the senseless violence which is getting him down.

Roper

Well, that would get anyone down.