Outplayed????

AmarilloFats

Villain in the hand is a winner at 1/2. My notes say He plays a normal TAG game.
Me$200
Villain$300
SB$30
2 Limpers
I'm on button with JJ and make it $8. SB calls as does Villain.

Flop Th Tc 5d

Checked to me I Bet $20, SB goes allin in for $30, Villain minraises to $60..

>...................I FOLDED!!!

SB turn over KdQd
Villain turnsover 5s6s and his hand stands up......He said after that once the SB went all in that most players would fold an over pair to his minraise!!

Any comments????

Mr. Flibble

Looks like you were...

Gholimoli

wow what a play .i like it .something to learn though.

fuzzbox

Check the flop

AmarilloFats

fuzzbox wrote:

Check the flop

NO

fuzzbox

AmarilloFats wrote:

NO

Well then you get outplayed .

Mr. Flibble

In hindsight he would have given the flushdraw and overcards a free card if he checked the flop. That can't be good.

fuzzbox

Mr. Flibble wrote:

In hindsight he would have given the flushdraw and overcards a free card if he checked the flop. That can't be good.

Flop Th Tc 5d

What flush draw?

I'll take my chances with overs. I want SB to bet into BB, with me having to act behind him having checked a TTx flop.

See how he likes his hand now.

PS - playing it the way he played it, made him lay down the best hand .... is that good?

Gholimoli

fuzzbox wrote:

Flop Th Tc 5d

What flush draw?

I'll take my chances with overs. I want SB to bet into BB, with me having to act behind him having checked a TTx flop.

See how he likes his hand now.

PS - playing it the way he played it, made him lay down the best hand .... is that good?

what if SB dosent bet and the hand is checked around.
turn : A
SB bets out now.
whats your line?

fuzzbox

Gholimoli wrote:

what if SB dosent bet and the hand is checked around.
turn : A
SB bets out now.
whats your line?

If BB calls./raises - then I fold
If BB folds, then I call

What if the turn is a 7, and SB bets, and BB folds?
Aint that much better?

Now I push and lets turn the cards over.

BB made a pretty stupid play in any case - but there you go.

Mr. Flibble

Oh yeh, no flush draw. What the smeg was did the SB go all in for. . .

AmarilloFats

Checking this flop is bad

fuzzbox

AmarilloFats wrote:

Checking this flop is bad

No it is not - however folding the best hand is bad !!!

Gholimoli

fuzzbox wrote:

If BB calls./raises - then I fold
If BB folds, then I call

What if the turn is a 7, and SB bets, and BB folds?
Aint that much better?

Now I push and lets turn the cards over.

BB made a pretty stupid play in any case - but there you go.

you said you check the flop and you said hero played it bad and folded the best hand becuase he didnt check.

fuzzbox wrote:

If BB calls./raises - then I fold
If BB folds, then I call

hands being the same and BB min raising the turn after the A.you say you will fold .how is this different from folding to BB's min raise on the flop?

its true that BB may now have the A or the T which both beat you but did you not allow that A to fall in the first place?

fuzzbox

Look - bet the flop if you like.

Selecting a worst case scenario - where an A falls on the turn - SB bets and BB minraises on a bluff (which would take even bigger balls than doing it on the flop) is a bit OTT n'est pas?

If he does indeed minraise the turn after BB bets out, then good for him, and I bow to his greatness ...although I will kill him when I do indeed have a T.

However - when I check and an Ace turns ... what hand does BB put me on?

AmarilloFats

fuzzbox wrote:

No it is not - however folding the best hand is bad !!!

Check many flops in position with over pairs against 2 opponents after you've PFR'd Fuzz? I tend not to.
Folding the best hand ain't great, but it happens.
The villain was out of line here hence I folded my winner.

fuzzbox

Btw - change your notes on BB - cos he is a moron.
minraising into a dry side pot after a bet and a raise, with just overcards is not a great play by any stretch of the imagination.

AmarilloFats

fuzzbox wrote:

Btw - change your notes on BB - cos he is a moron.
minraising into a dry side pot after a bet and a raise, with just overcards is not a great play by any stretch of the imagination.

How about I change my notes on you???:eek:
Only kiddin'...
He had 56s, not overs.../

fuzzbox

AmarilloFats wrote:

How about I change my notes on you???:eek:
Only kiddin'...
He had 56s, not overs.../

Oh - sorry, misread the results.

Still - check the flop.

fuzzbox

AmarilloFats wrote:

Check many flops in position with over pairs against 2 opponents after you've PFR'd Fuzz? I tend not to.
Folding the best hand ain't great, but it happens.
The villain was out of line here hence I folded my winner.

How much money do you tend to win when you have these overpairs, and you bet these flops?

Its not overpairs in particular by the way - its overpairs on THIS board. I check a lot of things on THIS board.

AmarilloFats

I will often get action from any pair on this board. 99-66 esp. shucks they'll even call with AK...

OK so I think beetting is good because:
I have a good hand and I think worse hands will give me action
Image:Because I usually bet when I have raised.
Free cards

So convince me why checking is better///

fuzzbox

I'm just offering an alternative my good man.

what if 99-66 raises you?
Oh oh.

Giving free cards is over abhored.

AmarilloFats

fuzzbox wrote:

I'm just offering an alternative my good man.

And I appreciate it.

fuzzbox wrote:

Giving free cards is over abhored.

Absolutely.