What do we put our faith in?

BrianCalgary

This has been questioned on another thread.
What is it that we put our faith in? As Christians

And what is it that non-Christians put their faith in?

Your beliefs, I suppose.

Scofflaw

Wouldn't it depend on which non-Christians?

cordially,
Scofflaw

Asiaprod

Scofflaw wrote:

Wouldn't it depend on which non-Christians?

It sure would.
I agree with Bluewolf, the only logical answer would be in my own individual belief, which really means I put my faith in myself.

Which if I am not mistaken is the same principle applied by christians but with more emphasis placed on the God portion. i.e I put my faith in God, means I base my faith on my belief....... which ultimatly means I put my faith in myself.

How about that, we have a Universal formula for Faith

Open to debate here, take it as an opening shot:rolleyes:

Yossie

Asiaprod wrote:

.... I put my faith in God, means I base my faith on my belief....... which ultimatly means I put my faith in myself.

How about that, we have a Universal formula for Faith

Open to debate here, take it as an opening shot:rolleyes:

How about if I put my faith in gravity? Am I really just putting faith in myself, for my belief in gravity, or is there an objective reality that justifies my belief?

That universal formula of yours seems to me to be equivalent to Hume and Descartes’ - "we can only be sure of our own existence" etc. For me the more interesting question is where do we go from there.

Then again, I don’t really have that much faith in myself so don’t thrust what I say:v:

Excelsior

A healthy dose of self-skepticism must always be maintained to get anywhere in this search. So like Yossie, don't hold me forever to what I say.

I put my faith in a psychological crutch that I create to make my life easier because I don't have the moral courage to face up to the fact that I am a random collection of proteins that arose from dust and to dust I shall pass. This psychological crutch does permit me to use the "I" notifier with a flexibility that proves very useful in relation to others and to ethical dilemmas- it helps me be helpful.

But the problem I have is that my psychological crutch is so designed that it poses me lots of difficulties I struggle with. The crutch talks to me and says that I'd be better off blind, deaf and dumb with it than alone. It tells me things I don't understand like that he planned to be held by me from before time and there was no way that I wouldn't end up holding him but at the same time I had to choose to hold him. He also says that some things I really enjoy are actually bad for me. He is a pain actually.

Still, the relevant question is: am I insane to think that a crutch talks to me?

Flatulently yours,

Excelsior (the person, not the Dutch soccer team)

Asiaprod

Yossie wrote:

How about if I put my faith in gravity? Am I really just putting faith in myself, for my belief in gravity,

You do every time you put on your trousers:)

That universal formula of yours seems to me to be equivalent to Hume and Descartes’ - "we can only be sure of our own existence" etc. For me the more interesting question is where do we go from there.

Thats interesting since I have never read anything by either of those eminent gentlemen, and a great question to ask, where indeed do we go from there.

Then again, I don’t really have that much faith in myself so don’t thrust what I say:v:

Then that sounds like the perfect place to go from there. develop some confidence. In my book, any one who is prepared to risk life and limb on these boards has confidence. Now develop it.:)

Asiaprod

Asiaprod wrote:

In my book, any one who is prepared to risk life and limb on these boards has confidence. Now develop it.:)

Risk it how? o.o

Asiaprod

A healthy dose of self-skepticism must always be maintained to get anywhere in this search. So like Yossie, don't hold me forever to what I say.

Do we ever

I put my faith in a psychological crutch that I create to make my life easier because I don't have the moral courage to face up to the fact that I am a random collection of proteins that arose from dust and to dust I shall pass.

Psychological crutch. I assume you are referring to GOD, though I don't think he will like being referred to as a psychological crutch

it helps me be helpful.

Thats a nice turn of phrase, I like that

He also says that some things I really enjoy are actually bad for me. He is a pain actually.

I have the same problem, but I am working at making those bad things good for me.

Still, the relevant question is: am I insane to think that a crutch talks to me?

Well as you doctor, What do you think?

Flatulently yours,

Pardon???

Excelsior (the person, not the Dutch soccer team)

God forbid, support Liverpool, they are your only salvation.

Yossie

Asiaprod wrote:

You do every time you put on your trousers:)

Who says I wear any;)

Asiaprod wrote:

Thats interesting since I have never read anything by either of those eminent gentlemen

Join the club.;)

Asiaprod wrote:

....a great question to ask, where indeed do we go from there

The best analogy, imho, of the predicament we are in is that of a ship in a world of only sea. A complete overhaul, from keel up simply isn’t possible, so we are forced to work with what we have without sinking the ship. I believe that our best way forward is through non-dogmatic, rational thought and rational enquiry. Hence, I’m a big fan of the science, (but don’t regard it as having exclusivity over rational enquiry) and a committed atheist.

Excelsior wrote:

I put my faith in a psychological crutch that I create to make my life easier because I don't have the moral courage to face up to the fact that I am a random collection of proteins that arose from dust and to dust I shall pass.

Giving up psycological crutches is all part of growing up. It's hard to the face the realities of death, pain, etc., as the weak humans we are. But perhaps in a world with an honest view of death (and the lack of a god) we could live a life with more meaning because of those facts.

Asiaprod wrote:

Then that sounds like the perfect place to go from there. develop some confidence. In my book, any one who is prepared to risk life and limb on these boards has confidence. Now develop it.:)

That’s sweet. Thank you.:) But alas I fear we are doomed to have diametrically opposed opinions on everything.:o

Asiaprod

Who says I wear any

Cheeky, are pants gender specific?

The best analogy, imho, of the predicament we are in is that of a ship in a world of only sea. A complete overhaul, from keel up simply isn’t possible, so we are forced to work with what we have without sinking the ship. I believe that our best way forward is through non-dogmatic, rational thought and rational enquiry. Hence, I’m a big fan of the science, (but don’t regard it as having exclusivity over rational enquiry) and a committed atheist.

I have heard this argument many times and don't have a problem with it. It is definitely one approach of many. If it is the one that serves you the best then fine, but always keep an open mind.

That’s sweet. Thank you. But alas I fear we are doomed to have diametrically opposed opinions on everything.

This one problems me, why are we doomed to have opposed opinions on everything? . Is that not like closing the door. You were the one who said .....I believe that our best way forward is through non-dogmatic, rational thought and rational enquiry. I don't for one moment believe we will have opposing opinions on everything unless you purposely make it so.

John Doe

As Nick Cave said "Where do we go now but nowhere?". I don't know, but it seems anywhere would be better than nowhere. Anyhoo, I put my faith in the essential decency of humans, and even more in the essential decency of myself. I believe both these things are caused by (or possibly are) God, who is unknowable and is the cause of all benevolent thoughts and deeds. He is all-powerful in that if we all follow our most perfect, kind and loving impulses anything can be achieved. That's my faith in a nutshell.

bmoferrall

John Doe wrote:

... God, who is unknowable...

Well, the apostle Paul referred to Jesus as follows:

Colossians:1 wrote:

15He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn over all creation. 16For by him all things were created: things in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or powers or rulers or authorities; all things were created by him and for him. 17He is before all things, and in him all things hold together. 18And he is the head of the body, the church; he is the beginning and the firstborn from among the dead, so that in everything he might have the supremacy. 19For God was pleased to have all his fullness dwell in him, 20and through him to reconcile to himself all things, whether things on earth or things in heaven, by making peace through his blood, shed on the cross.

That would imply that, by knowing Him, you would also know God.

John Doe

Him being Jesus? Sorry, can't say I knew the fella.

Dades

In the absence of "a faith", I guess I'd put my faith in anything that has earned it.

UU

Geesh what a broad topic but better broad than too narrow!

I put my faith in a lot of things and have put my faith in many things which have failed me - one being a supreme power called God.

Above all, I put my faith in Destiny. I believe things happen for a reason. To think that every action we do alters destiny but some parts of destiny we can never avoid. One is dying as we all will die and move on but we can look after our health and then perhaps we can change destiny so that we live longer.

I put my faith in myself and others. I believe in myself and others completely sort of like in that beautiful song in Andrew Lloyd Webber's musical Starlight Express:

Only you have the power within you,
Just believe in yourself and the sea will part before you,
Stop the rain, turn the tide.
If only you, use the power within you,
Needn't beg the world to turn around and help you,
You can draw on what you have within you,
Somewhere deep inside.

I have faith in that bad things happen due to an imbalance of the three aspects of human consciousness and the three precepts of human society as defined by the Church Of Scientific Humanism which really makes sense to me.

I also have faith in all just beliefs as all just religions and beliefs are equally valid and we can learn something inspiring from each. My own beliefs don't just reflect Humanism but also Buddhism, Hinduism, Judaism, Christianity, Islam, Paganism and Gnosticism (what a blend, eh?) As I say why have just vanilla ice-cream when you're offered toffee, honeycomb, chocolate and half a dozen others? Might as well sample each and see which I like.