advice on live events needed

Gholimoli

right,
i suck at live games.
I’ve only played 8 live events ever and I don’t feel comfortable.
feel im too impatient.
Also I cant seem to understand what peoples bets mean.
Online im much more comfortable with putting people on hands and also figuring out what people are at after playing with them for a while.
Live I feel like my abilities are limited to taking the pot only with the best hand and we all know that’s not good enough to do well.
I know it’s the lack of practice but I was just wondering if you could give me some tips on how to make this transformation quicker.

Daithio

It takes a while to be totally comfortable playing live. Just keep on plugging away at the cheap buy in tourneys around Dublin. You'll get a win soon enough and then it will all fall in to place. You'll probably have to lose a little bit of cash at first, but just look at it as an investment. Once you start winning live you'll find it's much more enjoyable than online poker.

JoeyJJ

I find it harder to push in live games and sometimes harder to read the game but I much prefer the live games, I have started playing online more now and I am getting used to winning STT's and my confidence is rising, now I'm going to go back to playing a few live MTT's, over the next couple of weeks to see if my renewed confidence will last.

fixer

I'm the opposite of Gholimoli. I started playing live, and just can't get the hang of online play. I find my game changes, like I am channeling someone else when online!

roryc

Im the same, I just cant get my head around online play. The standard is so bad online it makes my head hurt. At least in live games (for the most part) you don't find these as much. I would be embarrased to play with some online players face to face.

POKERKING

im the same as fixer im totally comfortable live and have made a few quid over the past 2 years but i suck at online only got my first decent win last week after a few months of losing i think both need time to get used to. i find its easier to get impatient online cos if your not involved in a hand i end up just looking at th wall or getting bored and playing crap hands but live theres a bit of banter and craic at the table and the atmosphere is great esp in casinos which makes it much easier for me to concentrate because of the environment im in!!

ntlbell

I've pretty much given up online poker as I have the complete opposite problem as you, I can't put most players online on a hand and alot of their play absoloutley baffles me.

Patience when I first started playing live was one of my biggest downfalls also, the only thing I've done to change it was _really_ concentrate on the players around you, tone of voice, how they reach for the chips the humour they're in, do they seem bored, tired how they interact with other players on the table, are they watching other players? are they watching you? can i sell a few tells here for a move later on? are they overly concerned about winning or no real intrest, building a small profile of each player at the table all this takes up alot of time and stops you from getting bored.

When I started playing live there was alot of fear in my game and felt intimadted by good aggresive players thinking they always had the nuts, Once i got a win or two in against a good field of strong players I just loosened up and played my own game and the fear factor was pretty much gone which made everything else alot clearer.

Like daitho said just keep playing live and everything does just start to fit into place, and nothing online can give you that buzz of live play imo

Gholimoli

i love to be able to play live with a bit more confidence.
when i play online i can understand the situation what ever in may be and can make my play based on that.live i can only base my play on the cards im holding and that sucks.

JoeyJJ

Yeah I enjoy the banter and it keeps me occupied when I'm not in play live too.

What I find is that I play at a low level online are the action is chaotic, usually alot tighter in live games, which we all prefer.

ntlbell

Gholimoli wrote:

i love to be able to play live with a bit more confidence.
when i play online i can understand the situation what ever in may be and can make my play based on that.live i can only base my play on the cards im holding and that sucks.

The confidence will come with expirience and when it does, like you do online you'll be working out "the situation" your thought process will be alot clearer.

Culchie

I think it's easier to adapt from online play to live poker rather than the other way around.

Takes about 5 or 6 live tourneys I think to get comfortable, after that it's great.

Gholimoli

Culchie wrote:

I think it's easier to adapt from online play to live poker rather than the other way around.

Takes about 5 or 6 live tourneys I think to get comfortable, after that it's great.

but ive played 8 and i still suck :mad:

Ste05

Gholimoli, I'm in the exact same situation as you. Everytime I play live, (not much, probably about the same level of experience as you) I just don't play my normal game. When I know I should be re-raising I don't or I'll try to bluff when I shouldn't, and so I'm hoping this thread will give some nice insights. I get the feeling that NTL and Diathio's advice is probably the way to go, and I'll just have to get my arse out there again.

Keep the tips coming people....

Culchie

Gholimoli wrote:

but ive played 8 and i still suck :mad:

You just a greedy b..b..b. baseball hat

Didn't you win in Drogheda ffs, even though I wasn't there:p

I think you develop a sixth sense for danger and trouble as well, that's hard to pick up online.
Learning to trust your instincts is an important step to take.

JoeyJJ

People are more inclined to check down a pot while playing live so even when they have 2nd / 3rd nuts

Culchie

Ste05 wrote:

Gholimoli, I'm in the exact same situation as you. Everytime I play live, (not much, probably about the same level of experience as you) I just don't play my normal game. When I know I should be re-raising I don't or I'll try to bluff when I shouldn't, and so I'm hoping this thread will give some nice insights. I get the feeling that NTL and Diathio's advice is probably the way to go, and I'll just have to get my arse out there again.

Keep the tips coming people....

I was the same, played like a bloody rock.

Harrington's books is definitely the best few quid you could ever spend.

Glowingmind

Gholimoli wrote:

when i play online i can understand the situation what ever in may be and can make my play based on that.live i can only base my play on the cards im holding and that sucks.

When you started playing online it was probably a similar situation, in that you were basing your play on the cards you were holding and that alone. In the same way that you've adapted to that in terms of reading the game you'll adapt to live play - and you'll most likely do it quicker than most. I'm still pretty new to live play, in terms of playing in casinos (lots of playing in house games, but it's not really the same). For the most part i suck live(online too, just not quite as badly), but can feel myself getting better each time i play, because the novelty is wearing off, i'm a lot more comfortable sitting at a table face to face with strangers now and have loosened up a lot (both in terms of play, and attitude). You answered your own question at the beginning, as have most folks, it's just a case of practice.

ionapaul

I remember a post from DeV sometime after I started reading and occasionally contributing (poorly) to this forum, must have been in Autumn 2004, where he stated once you play live, playing online would never seem as exciting again, nor would match the feeling of holding your cards in your hand rather than on your screen. I remember feeling very sceptical...but he was dead right, I find it extremely hard to play online anymore, live is so much more enjoyable to me. But the first few times are nerve-racking alright!

mewso

Amazing to think I haven't played live since September last year. Where has the time gone? For me the buzz of live play can't be beaten but it also means I am always more nervous in a live game. I learnt to use this to control myself early in a live game. The nervousness only lasts a short while but for that time I am mentally holding back and making sure I do nothing silly. Once I relax I can play my game and I have had the time to get a feel for the players around me.
Experience is even more important in live play imo as you will get to know players that you are playing against regularly over time. I think all you can do is keep playing and eventually the results will come. If you are more comfortable online it may be because you like making decisions quickly. Live play affords you more time and you should use it when you need to.

barrera

First time I played live, I was utterly terrified. However, it stood me in good stead, as I tended to play strong hands only. As a result, when the field started to thin out I relaxed a bit. I made the final table, and although I made a monumental error at it, the overall result was enough to get me into live play.

I do find I have to almost tell myself a few rules before live play to ensure I don't screw up. I've done OK live overall, but don't have any illusions that I am anything other than a novice who is still learning much. If my concentration isn't there or I get anyway impatient, I find you get punished way more than online. However, the reverse is that if you play well, you're more likely to get the reward. Which is as it should be, hence I agree with the majority that live play kicks online's ass.

ntlbell

Gholimoli wrote:

but ive played 8 and i still suck :mad:

You can't really say after X amount of games you will be comfortable it'll happen when it happens, I tried to play about 4/5 nights a week for about two months and somewhere along the way of that two months things started to click.

You can do this fairly cheaply if money's an issue.

Fitz run 3 freerolls a week and you have the 30e on a sunday the 50 dc on tuesday or whatever night it is, SE's 50 and 75 DC etc etc.

DeVore

I was/am like NTLBell. I feel comfortable live but online I feel like a 6th-sense has been cut out of me. I feel like a blind man kinda making guesses about what to call and not.

I hear a lot of people say (about online play) "i called because I thought he had missed his flush". Now some people genuinely can do that, they play at levels where thats possible and they might also know the player. Most of the time , if we are being really honest, its more like "I wanted him to have missed his flush and be betting the river, it could as easily have been trips getting brave because of no flush, a value bet of a straight or any number of other things but since I wanted to call it, I convinced myself thats what he had".

I do like playing online, I'm playing right now as I type this (62s utg... fold) but playing live is the real deal and still what I love, be it a 5 euro game in my mates with beers and smokes or a 1000 deep stacked game in city west.

The first time I went into the Fitz I was terrified, in fact I was terrified for weeks and weeks and its not like I'm a particularly shy person now is it
It takes time and confidence in your game.There is a whole aspect to live poker you just don't get online, and its the bit that really brings in some depth to the game.

DeV.

roryc

Dev...nail...head

kincsem

I agree with Daithio. Eight live games is nothing. You could play 20 and not cash if the fields are large. I used to play 15 to 20 times a month over a couple of years. After a while you will know everyone by name, you will know their style, and you should be able to rank the players at the table. Play freerolls and €20 tourneys.

When online I like to roll along in the early stages playing quality hands only. I don't worry if I lose some ground but will loosen up a lot when more than half the field are eliminated. One advantage online is you know exactly how you are doing. You know exactly how many chips you have, how many players remain, where you rank in the field. This info means you know when to change gears. A disadvantage online is that you seldom see the same players twice in big field MTT, although you will get to know the players in Sit & Gos.

kincsem

DeVore wrote:

The first time I went into the Fitz I was terrified
DeV.

My first ever hand of Texas Hold Em was in the Merrion on a Wednesday night in November 2002. I did not even know how the game was played. I learned by watching the play as I participated. At my table (table 1) was Noel Furlong, the 1999 WSOP champion ($1,000,000 prize) and Liam Flood. I had seen Noel a half dozen times winning the WSOP on the Discovery Channel, and seen Liam Flood many times on Channel 4 Late Night Poker.

So I've gone from a rabbit in the headlights to "You talkin to me, you talkin to me".

califano

kincsem wrote:

So I've gone from a rabbit in the headlights to "You talkin to me, you talkin to me".

What?, from a rabbit in the headlights to talking to yourself in front of a mirror?:D

5starpool

For me the 2 main things that I can use live that cannot transfer online are confidence (not arrogance) and timed aggression. Live, confidence is something that you can convey to other players, and use timed aggression to take advantage of favourable situations.

Similiar to Dev, online I am more hoping than reading a lot of the time.

Then again I play live about 4-5 times a week on average usually (21 days in Jan), and online only an average of 5 hours a week, so I know where my main perceived strengths are.

bmc

5starpool wrote:

Live, confidence is something that you can convey to other players...

Hey Gholimoli... Nice to meet you the other day.

I think 5starpool has just hit on something that makes a big difference between live and online play. Online, other than the nonsense in the chat box, the game is a game of numbers. You get a sense of personalities from the patterns but it is nothing compared to suddenly having eight or nine real faces with facial expressions and mannerisms suddenly invading your game.

It can be hard not to be distracted by some guy's noisy banter as he casually tosses half of his stack over the line, or by the stoney face of somebody making an all-in and sitting statue-like staring at the pot.

Try to ignore all of that for a few games. Focus on the same information that you get online... bet size, pot size, position, etc. and over time you'll start to pick up on people's mannerisms... don't force it.

gl