Any Gearbox Oil experts here?

BrianD3

I think I might change the gear oil in the Laguna now that it's done 100k. According to the Renault workshop manual the oil doesn't need to be changed as part of routine servicing. But its an easy job and I figure it might prolong the life of the 'box as long as I use the right oil. If I don't get the right stuff I won't bother with the change.

The recommend gear oil is Tranself TRJ 75w80 API GL-5. This oil is apparently sold by Renault dealers and is expensive. I wonder if there is anywhere else to source this oil or an equivalent spec oil. I don't recall ever seeing any Elf lubricants in any motor factors.

I changed gearbox oil before on another Renault and had major difficulty getting the right oil (Tranself TRX 75w80 API GL-5 was recommended for it) Even Renault dealers seemed clueless and tried to sell me oil which was of unknown or wrong spec. I tried various motor factors but none had the right oil, it was either wrong API or the wrong viscosity. Finally I got some Total BV 75w80 in GSF. It didn't say anything about API on the container but I later found out that it was GL-5. So that's the oil I used. I presume that this was more or less equivalent to the Tranself TRX.

I am probably being an anorak about this, still I'd be interested to hear any comments on gear oils

murphaph

I think pretty much all manual transmission gear oil in a factors complies with the API GL-5 spec which is a long sanding one (I know the entry level Castrol EP75 stuff does). I read on Retro-Renault of many Renault owners dropping out the gear oil and replacing it with ATF! It's more expensive but apparently gives excellent results. Might be worth thinking about if you're gonna do this. I think you're right tio change your gear oil at your current mileage tbh.

ds20prefecture

I have a bad whine off my 4th gear so I added a small bottle of Lucas additive to the gearbox oil at the last change (it is part of regular servicing on the DS). It made a big difference, with changes being much smoother and the whine less pronounced, but only for about 3 months. The additive just temporarily increased the viscosity of the oil, and cost me about €30 :mad:

HashSlinging

I get my gear oil changed at every service.. just as preventative maintenance..

BrianD3

murphaph wrote:

I think pretty much all manual transmission gear oil in a factors complies with the API GL-5 spec which is a long sanding one (I know the entry level Castrol EP75 stuff does). I read on Retro-Renault of many Renault owners dropping out the gear oil and replacing it with ATF! It's more expensive but apparently gives excellent results. Might be worth thinking about if you're gonna do this. I think you're right tio change your gear oil at your current mileage tbh.

I will check out the oil in the factors again but last time I looked a lot of the oil was API GL-4. Some oils claimed to be "Hypoid EP80" or whatever but were GL-4, I thought the term hypoid was only used to describe GL-5 oils? Might be wrong about that.

Also, a Renault dealer tried to sell me Tranself TRZ which is GL-4. A different dealer tried to sell me gear oil in a plain black container, when I questioned him about the spec I got a blank stare :rolleyes:

Not sure about the ATF idea either Although the guys on retro-renault generally seem to know their stuff

murphaph

HashSlinging wrote:

I get my gear oil changed at every service.. just as preventative maintenance..

So do I.........on my motorbike I think hanging your gear oil on every service is way OTT but whatever floats your boat I suppose!

HashSlinging

Well my car is two years old and has 85k on it. as I said preventative maintenance..

milltown

If you call one of the oil companies/distributors they should have tech guys tohat can tell you which, if any, of their oils meet that spec. When I was sourcing oils for plant machinery we found Tedcastles (don't laugh) particularly good in that respect.

ATF in a non-auto box doesn't sound like a great idea to me btw.

Also agree that gear oil changes at every service on a car is too much. If you're racking up those sorts of miles I'm guessing that your gearbox isn't constantly heating up and cooling down á la school/shopping run type usage. If that's so, you're not at much risk of condensation inside your gearbox being absorbed into the oil and causing it to break down. In fact the cynic in me would suspect that if you're using the same garage/mechanic all the time and he knows your habits, he'll probably just wipe the drain plug clean and charge you for the change. Might change it every one in four. Or maybe I just know too many mechanics!

BrianD3

milltown wrote:

In fact the cynic in me would suspect that if you're using the same garage/mechanic all the time and he knows your habits, he'll probably just wipe the drain plug clean and charge you for the change. !

That's if it even has a drain plug AFAIK many cars don't these days.

I agree that changing gear oil every service on a modern car is OTT and is taking "preventative maintenance" to extremes.

murphaph

HashSlinging wrote:

Well my car is two years old and has 85k on it

:eek: Are you driving now? :eek:

murphaph

Have a look at this dat sheet from Maxol. Most of those products are readily available in irish factors.

HashSlinging

OTT or not its my 20 euros and peace of mind goes a long way when your covering this type of mileage.

greglo23

you dont really need to change the oil in a gearbox very often as it does'nt suffer from the same wear and tear as engine oil, ie , pollutants created by the combustion process. nonetheless it is good practice to change it sooner than the manufacturers guidelines depending on the sort of driving you do as in lots of urban stop-start short trips with multiple gearchanges.

as for using ATF for a lubricant a lot of modern cars have it as standard for the last few years. i know that the older landrover boxes used to give trouble because the box was very tall and the heavy gearoil EP90, when cold, did not get thrown to the top which resulted in premature failure. changing to ATF due to its thinner viscosity sorted this. automatic transmissions actually suffer from higher stresses than manual so the oil is actually much higher spec. i have put it in a few cars which suffered from heavy gearshifts and it made a huge difference on cold mornings.

i reckon once your oilseals are in good condition you should have no problem with ATF but if you feel you need to stick to original specs then you can also buy synthetic gearoil. these guys http://www.millersoils.net/index2.html in the uk, have some very good products and its possible to buy them here.

franksm

I understand the differences in weights and viscosity etc as spec'd for engine oil and manual trans oil, but you tend never to see that info for auto-trans fluid.

Can anyone tell me what the difference is between TQF fluid and, say, Dexxron-2 ? I need to buy a load of TQF but all the other typese seem more readily available. (It's for a '75 Stag btw)

lomb

HashSlinging wrote:

Well my car is two years old and has 85k on it. as I said preventative maintenance..

buy something with a three year unlimited mileage warranty :v:

AMurphy

BrianD3 wrote:

....
The recommend gear oil is Tranself TRJ 75w80 API GL-5. This oil is apparently sold by Renault dealers and is expensive. I wonder if there is anywhere else to source this oil or an equivalent spec oil. .....

Use any 75w80 API GL-5 Castrol, Shell, Mobile does not matter.

Main difference between GL4 And GL5 is compatibilitywith seal and busing materials, not in lubrication of the gears.

ATF's tend to have a lot of modifiers in them in order to provide the same shear resistance with a lighter viscosity and to provide buffering of the wet clutches as they close and open.
Dexron/Mercon are basically mineral based and more suited to band/brake auto clutches, more modern ATF tend to be synthetic and have more of the shear resistant buffering materials added, and more suited to multidisk clutch packs.

cheapthrills

Peugeot dealers keep Total 75w80 in stock or can order it and it was under €20 for the required 2 litres. renault wanted over €40;)

BrianD3

Peugeot dealers keep Total 75w80 in stock or can order it and it was under €20 for the required 2 litres. renault wanted over €40

Yeah, I used Total BV 75w80 GL-5 before. Got it from GSF and IIRC it wasn't too expensive.

This and the Elf are the only oils I've seen with this exact description. I didn't see this in any other brand such as Castrol etc. I saw EP75, EP80, 75w90 etc. but not 75w80. Maybe some of these terms are just an alternative way of describing the same oil?

pauln

I saw EP75, EP80, 75w90 etc. but not 75w80. Maybe some of these terms are just an alternative way of describing the same oil?

The EP in oil grades such as EP75, EP80 stands for extreme pressure rated and basically means that the oil will maintain a strong enough film between the gear teeth so as not to be squeezed out when they're meshing together, essential in transmission oils.
The W stands for winter, it means that the oils viscosity has been measured at a lower temperature as compared with an oil with no W in its grading which would have its viscosity measured at a higher temperature. It's to simplify the grading of oils for different climates e.g. oils for use in the artic and one for use in the desert (Extreme example).
The numbers either side of the W represent the oils viscosity at a lower (left number) and higher (right number) temperature.
Without two numbers I guess the oil is taken to have a constant viscosity inside its range of operating temperatures?

BrianD3

cheapthrills wrote:

Peugeot dealers keep Total 75w80 in stock or can order it and it was under €20 for the required 2 litres. renault wanted over €40;)

Just an update on this, I checked with GSF a couple of days ago and Total BV 75w80 gear oil is around 6.50 for a litre. It does not say on the containers what the GL number is. But I contacted Total before and was told by a tech guy that it's GL-5. This would probably be a good gear oil for a lot of modern cars. I'll probably use it in my car.
edit: from checking Total's website I now discover that BV transmission oil is in fact GL-4. So I was told wrong information by Total before. Balls :rolleyes:

AMurphy

If so, just drain it and replace. Save the GL4 for such uses as a tiller/lawnmower gearbox, or some non-critical application.

grk_car

BV 75w80 seems good, I might also try it in my own car.

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JHMEG

When I was changing the transmission oil in my old Integra, the only recommended oil was Honda MTF-II. No other oil is recommended, though I think 10W30 engine oil can be used in an emergency.

In the end I got the MTF-II from a dealer: they don't normally sell it to joe public, so they only have it in 50 litre drums. They sold me 3 litres in a white container for 7.50 a litre.. In return I got peace of mind and what felt like a brand new gearbox.:)

BTW, ATF is more like brake fluid than oil, and I wouldn't be at all inclined to use it in a manual transmission.

Ernie Ball

Anyone know where one can get Redline gear oil in Ireland?