Nut flush possible draw

Mmmm_Lemony

Tuesday night. Fair few bob on the table. (For me anyway)

4 players. Two short stacks. Me slightly trailing to chip lead. By about 2 BB

Im on the button with k5c.

UTG folds.

I think of raising but call.

Sb folds.

BB checks.

The board came Ac 3s Qc.

Straight and flush draw.

*Going through my head - If I win the hand I win the moolah*

BB Checks. Bet heavy and was *reluctantly* called. Turn kd.

BB Bet All in. Didn't even see the straight draw for him. I think, hold tight or have a gamble. I call.

Turns over j 10 o

Pray for a club...

I'm in the car on the way home, like a broken record, 'fcuk', 'fcuk', 'fcuk'...

I know the rule. Don't tangle with chip lead, but was this such a bad call after all. About half of my chips were in on my last bet, but the blinds weren't that big. I could have recovered (or gone Tilt).

How much are you willing to gamble on a flush draw? Should I have been all in before the turn?

mewso

As far as I'm concerned you shouldn't have been in the hand at all. I would be interested to know what kind of odds you gave him with the bet on the flop but it looks like he considered folding which means he isn't a total donkey. You may very well have have committed yourself with the flop bet and the turn became a call when it should have been an easy fold.

Mmmm_Lemony

I was in the hand because it was checked around. Before the turn are four clubs a good hand. Good enough to gamble/bet heavily?

ollyk1

We're missing a lot of details here. Payouts/blinds etc.

Anyway I hate the limp. You were going to raise, lost your bottle (for whatever reason) and instead of doing the only other sensible thing (folding) you did the worst thing - flat called.

Then the flop comes scary but the guy isn't buying your overpair theory because he calls you with a gutshot straight draw (so either you didn't bet enough, or he's mad, or he knows you'd raise preflop with AT+ QJ+ etc and therefore reckons thats missed you and he can take it off you on the turn. We'd need a lot more detail about the player to say). You have a flush draw and a runner runner straight draw NOT a straight draw!! And as it turns out an overcard. You hit your king but its very hard to put the guy on a gutshot straight draw the way this hand has gone down so the hand basically played itself from there imho.


Based on the sketchy details given I don't like how either of you played this hand, and your right I'm sure the shortstacks were laughing at you both for getting tangled in this hand at all. Not that getting tangled with the big stack is such a crime in my opinion if you can put pressure on and force the other stack to define his/her hand early - which you failed to do.

*Going through my head - If I win the hand I win the moolah*

Very expensive mistake a lot of people make trying to win the whole thing with one crucial hand, sometimes it happens that way and sometimes you rob the guy over a period of time, make good lay downs and victory inevitably comes. I think the rugby boys call it "white line fever" and it happens all the time in live poker tournaments.

P.S. Are you saying you called thinking you thought you were behind and only with the flush draw or did you call because you thought your king was good?

Mmmm_Lemony

I'm learning all the time, as everyone is, but I'm not long at the game so don't expect alot of experienced plays.

I figured he didn't have Ax or Kx or Qx because he checked preflop where he would normally raise with these hands.

Checked again on the flop. I thought I was behind figuring he had low pocket pair when he called.

In the end I was only thinking about one thing. Flush.

When the K came and he went all in I didn't see his straight and figured he was trying to steal, pretending to hold a K, I had one, and with aq on board I figured I was ahead with an extra out of a flush. I'm not disciplined/experienced enough to fold a these cards preflop. Or post flop when checked into me but it's where I want to be at.

Just wondering would anyone else here play a possible flush. Obviously not, or certainly not the way I did.

I take on board it's as much about folding as anything else. Thanks.

Amaru

Mmmm_Lemony wrote:

Tuesday night. Fair few bob on the table. (For me anyway)

4 players. Two short stacks. Me slightly trailing to chip lead. By about 2 BB

Im on the button with k5c.

UTG folds.

I think of raising but call.

Sb folds.

BB checks.

The board came Ac 3s Qc.

Straight and flush draw.

You don't have a straight and flush draw here. Only a flush draw. You'd need runner runner for either straight, so unless the turn helps you, you can't count straight cards as outs. As such, you have to play the flop like you have just the regular 9 flush outs.

I know the rule. Don't tangle with chip lead, but was this such a bad call after all. About half of my chips were in on my last bet, but the blinds weren't that big. I could have recovered (or gone Tilt).

The rule is not "don't tangle with the chip lead". This only applies on the bubble. Any other time in the tournament is fine, so unless only 3 get paid here the rule doesn't apply. You're going to have to tangle with him some time, otherwise you'll never win first.

How much are you willing to gamble on a flush draw? Should I have been all in before the turn?

No. Unless you have a massive chip lead, you can't justify making a -ev decision to draw to the flush. The only time i'll gamble with a flush draw is when i have something to go with it, i.e. a pair, 2 live overcards, a straight draw, and even then a lot of other factors would influence the decision.

Mmmm_Lemony

Thanks Amaru. It was winner takes all in case you were wondering. About 200+ yoyos which is alot for me.