Third Level schenanigans!

Imposter

From the indo (needs registration - free):

THIRD level GAA has been rocked to the core by the suspension of three high profile DCU players for three months on the grounds of eligibility.

Laois star Ross Munnelly, Dublin utility player Shane Ryan and Diarmuid Kinsella, one of the key components in Wexford's run to the league final this year, have all been banned for 12 weeks by the Higher Education Council (Comhairle Ardoideachais).

The decision to suspend such a high profile trio is being viewed as a crackdown on what the governing body of third level GAA feels is a gross exploitation of eligibility requirements for their competitions.

Recruitment drives have been commonplace in universities and institutes who want to strengthen their GAA teams and there is a lot of discontent in the whole third level scene over this issue. Now the Comhairle has sent out a strong warning signal to players and the various GAA departments in third level institutes that they are not prepared to tolerate abuse of requirement guidelines in the future. Further suspensions to high profile players can't be ruled out.

A new constitution, in operation since September, has empowered Comhairle Ardoideachais with a passport to investigate eligibility of third level players GAA players.

The suspensions to Munnelly, Ryan and Kinsella apply to all GAA activity and date back to the three players' last games which, in all three cases, was a Higher Education league game against Sligo IT on November 30.

One of the players contacted did not want to comment because he was so unsure of what he had been suspended for, saying only that the charge against him lacked clarity.

In effect they will miss their counties' O'Byrne Cup and opening league matches, can't play for their clubs and can have no further involvement with their third level institute.

Strong team

Ironically, DCU are hosting the Sigerson Cup next spring and appeared to have assembled a strong team that could also include Westmeath's Dessie Dolan and Mayo's Conor Mortimer. The draws for all third level competitions took place in Croke Park yesterday but that event was overshadowed by the decision on Tuesday night to suspend the three players because "they did not conform with the Comhairle Ardoideachais bye-laws on eligibility and breached Bye-Law 30 of the CA Constitution" according to a GAA statement.

The advent of so many scholarships to third level effectively allows colleges to pick and choose the players they want provided they are available for studies.

None of the three players were available for comment but DCU's games development manager Tom O'Donnell issued a statement last night saying the club and players will be appealing the suspensions through the normal appeal procedures of the GAA.

There have been doubts for the last number of years over the eligibility of players from a number of colleges who have enjoyed success in both hurling and football. Munnelly is undertaking a masters in education as is Shane Ryan. The course does not require full time attendance at the north Dublin University but still involves a large investment in time.

Kinsella is studying a masters in investment and treasury and like Munnelly and Ryan's cases the Higher Education Council felt they did not reach the required criteria on eligibility.

If the ruling is not successfully overturned by DCU it has the capacity to test the eligibility of players in every GAA playing third level institute. A potential test case involving rising Dublin dual star John McCaffrey was due before the Disputes Resolution Authority on Tuesday night but that hearing has now been postponed until the new year.

McCaffrey, who is studying for a diploma in sports management at UCD, a course that requires attendance there for just one day a week, also failed to meet the Comhairle Ardoideachais requirements on eligibility.

McCaffrey, the Dublin minor hurling and football captain in 2005, is on a scholarship, and UCD are determined to fight his corner.

This should be interesting. This abuse has been going on for years.

The Rooster

Seems very harsh on the players - they were simply told they could play. If wrongdoing has been going on, its DCU who committed it and should be punished.

According to the Irish Times, Dessie Dolan is up on similar charges so is likely to receive a similar ban.

Imposter

The Rooster wrote:

Seems very harsh on the players - they were simply told they could play. If wrongdoing has been going on, its DCU who committed it and should be punished.

According to the Irish Times, Dessie Dolan is up on similar charges so is likely to receive a similar ban.

I'm not so sure about the players being innocent either. If you play illegally you will be suspended, that is the rules. Otherwise playing overage players or ineligible players would be par for the course.

Someone doing a postgrad is normally eligible so I can't see why a masters is any different. Someone only doing a part-time course was never eligible and Tom O'Donnell of all people should know that. The guys only attending one day a week may be eligible if they were full-time students who may be attending another affiliated college (for example: In our case in Trinity, Marino teacher training college was affiliated with us as were other colleges)

mchurl

I dont see any reason qhy the three lads shouldn't be allowed to play for us. They are members of the college and nearly every day you will see them around the place. This has been building up for a while because a lot of colleges have been putting in complaints over the panel that is out in DCU. I can see this lingering on for a long time.

In the case of McCaffrey, it is ridiculous that he ccannot play for the college just because the course he picked isnt as high a standard as some other course's.

Imposter

mchurl wrote:

In the case of McCaffrey, it is ridiculous that he ccannot play for the college just because the course he picked isnt as high a standard as some other course's.

Is it a full-time course? Doesn't sound like it.

LegacyUser

I think most of the discontent seems to stem from the fact that some people are of the opinion that the third-level institutions can 'cherry-pick' up-and-coming inter-county players for their teams.

The most recent controversy like this has been in UCD, where a number of Senior Dublin Hurling Clubs got together to release a statement calling on the administrators to tighten up on the eligibility rules in third-level.

I personally would be of the opinion that a player can play either in his home county championship or in the championship of their respective college. E.g. A hurler from Kilkenny who is in UCD would opt to play either in the Kilkenny Hurling Championship, or in the Dublin Championship with UCD, but not both. I've no problem with a student playing Sigerson/Fitzgibbon Cups with their college, and still remaining with their club, but if the college compete in the championship then its time to make a choice.

Removing the "second-chance" option would quickly force players to choose their allegiance at the beginning of the season, and would also ensure that students aren't enrolled in sham courses in colleges purely to play for their sports team.

Just my 2c.

bru

Imposter

This is a different issue than UCD playing in the Dublin championship. In this case teams seem to have be playing players that are clearly ineligible. There is also the issue of many colleges using rather creative ways to ensure certain players (read senior inter-county players) are eligible for Fitzgibbon or Sigerson. This second part has been going on for years.

Lemlin

I think alot of this discontent has stemmed from Sligo IT's dominance of the Sigerson in the past few years. That said, Sligo haven't resorted to the same tactics as DCU. The majority of their players, like Christy Toye and Paul Durkin, are actually students attending the college doing courses.

The fact that they have such a strong team is because of their Sport and Recreation course which many sport-minded people take. DCU look to have gone head hunting people.

For example, this year they picked up two of the Cavan county team, John Tierney and Seanie Johnston, and Ronan Flanigan, a county minor who starred for the Schoolboys Aussie Rules this year. That's three players from just one footballing county.

M1cky

hold on a second there lemlin, john tierney is in final year at the college, he's studying sports science, its a four year DEGREE, sean johnston is in final year at the college, he's studying accounting and finance, its a three year DEGREE, and ronan flanagan is in first year at the college, he's studying sports science as well so none of those cases are remotely suspect. in tierneys case he had to complete a two year cert in tralee to gain access to the degree course in dcu. and by the way, sports science is not like that sports management degree thing in ucd, a course invented to enroll footballers to allow them be eligible for sigerson. sports science is a pretty demanding degree in its own right, allowing successful graduates to pursue further studies in physiotheraphy for example, (james carolan from your own club a perfect example) so they certainly didn't pick up any of those three lads. as for 3 guys from 1 county... sure they had gavin duffy, and michael hannon 2 years ago and both those guys were there legitimatley as well. the problem is with the guys doing the masters, this is the first year people doing masters have been suspended for playing sigerson. they Higher education board must have examined the courses these boys were doing and decided they were not "proper" masters, and the system was being abused. conor mortimer, who started a four year degree this year has been left out of the accusations. it is a little harsh on the players, they were asked to sign up to do the masters, obviously with the aim of playing football, lets not be naieve, but thinking the courses they were doing would allow them to do so. and since people doing masters have never been questioned before, only guys doing certs and dimplomas have had question marks over their eligibilty raised, so to get 12 weeks is kinda rough on them.

mchurl

I reckon there is a good chance that these bans may be reduced or even removed on appeal. I'm sure the lads in question didnt know that they were ineligible. Why would they risk being banned?