Poker

Hectorjelly

When I came to this forum first a year and a half ago poker was already a big part of my life, I used to race home on my bike from work to play the pot limit mtt on VC. By day I would be thinking of how i played the hands from the night before, and what I could do to improve. It got to the stage where I couldnt fit poker and work in; there was only space for one. So now poker is my working life; and I am always conscous that I take it very seriously because of this, often times too seriously when in debates on forums. At the end of the day poker is a game, and a damn odd one at that. Imagine explaining poker to someone who had no idea what it is.

Well you get cards of random strength, and then you try and make wagers so that you either win the pot uncontested or get called and win through the strength of you hand.

I see, and how do you know what other people have.

You dont.

And what tactics can you use?

Well you can decide to put more money into the pot or not.

Whereas explainging a game like risk or chess is very simple, they mirror (to some extent) real life situations.

Anyway, to get to the point I was asked last night why I played poker, what attracts me to it, and I couldnt really give a good answer. Partially because i was out of my mind on apple vodka and trying to get a good angle on some partially clothed breasts, but also because I genuinely couldnt come up with an answer. So that got me interested in why people play poker. Is it the
gambling? The camaraderie? The joy of losing large sums of money to morons?
So it would be great if people could write about what attracts them to poker, now and in the past.

I think Toms answer would be paticularly interesting, what was it about poker that made you invest so much energy/time in the Irish poker scene (and still finding time to win the odd event ).

mewso

I think actually one of the things about the game is the fact that it is hard to put into words. I love the buzz. I get a rush even in low stakes STTs to this day but I know others don't unless the stakes are higher. There are many little things in the game that give me satisfaction, pegging weak players and slowly taking their chips, bluffing opponents off hands, beating your peers in an online game , and of course many lows like that evil river card but when all are combined they make for an unbeatable experience.
As for Tom hes in it for the fame and glory obviously.

Lafortezza

Part of it is proving that you bigger balls than the other guy. That you're cleverer and better than him. "I can take your money when you're trying your best to stop me" kind of thing. It's the challenge and competition factor.

When alot of us on the poker forum started playing there were drunken home games nearly every weekend. 5 Euro buy-in cash games isn't exactly high stakes but you'd struggle to find more aggressive and tougher games. Everyone wanted to be top dog and take the money and bragging rights home. That's what made those home games so good.
That and the copious drinking, slagging of Tom and Mr Pudding's barbecues.

The social side of it has become less and less as I get a bit more serious about poker. Online I'm only ever playing for $$, not for the fun, not as a way to pass the time. I rarely play live now but when I do it's to make money. If I get some banter and have a laugh at the table then it's a bonus.


The other non-money related thing I like is the sense of community that this poker forum (and the irish poker scene even though I'm less involved in that ) has. It's a good thing to be part of a group of people that actually as a group has some power over the game we play. By shouting loud enough we've changed the way alot of tournaments are run and probably changed the way particular poker sites are run too. Going for pints with people from on here and counting the number of time people say "And then the flop came down.." is fun too.

BigDragon

For a game that attracts winning/competitive people there is a whole load of losing. So it must be the sado/masochistitic (sp) nature in us. Really I think that its in my nature to be better at something than most people I know. Unfortuately it'll never be chatting up women so poker will do. Also, I like puzzles.

willis

As mentioned the adrenalin rush of a huge bluff is amazing imo, especially in cash games. The main reason i love poker so much is that you can never be a perfect player. No matter how good you think you are you can always get better. I love the challenge of sitting down with strangers and trying to outwit them, get inside their heads a little and i love the psychology of poker. Its a thinking mans game and i love the competitive nature of the game when it comes to tournies. I love checking the lobby and seeing the numbers in an mtt decreasing and see myself slicing my way through the field or see the tables decreasing in a live game. I just love the game of poker plain and simple

Lex

I would add to all the above that I also love the entrepreneurial aspect of the game. The fact that we as poker players are an extraordinary group of people, and I have met countless friends through a passion for a game of cards, but at the end of the day you're out there playing on your own, doing it for yourself. Nobody can play for you and the only way you will improve is through a hint of obsession, research, discussion and a desire to win.

Amaru

lafortezza wrote:

Part of it is proving that you bigger balls than the other guy. That you're cleverer and better than him. "I can take your money when you're trying your best to stop me" kind of thing. It's the challenge and competition factor.

This is exactly what it is that attracts me to the game. For the last 3 years of my college education, i was bored by the complete lack of anything that challenged my intelligence. I'd played poker for years, but it wasn't until i saw the movie Rounders that it turned me onto the fact that there could be more actual strategy involved in the game than slow playing when you had a good hand. What followed was the purchase of Super System, and i was blown away by the amount of maths, psychology and overall intelligence that was required to play the game. Finally, there was something to challenge me intellectually and i threw everything i had into trying to get better, even amassing a small library of poker books(of course my college education suffered because of this, but thats for another day).

I'd also been very sporty my whole life, but in recent years my love for it declined as the competition did. People just weren't interested in playing, and were playing more to play than to win. When poker came along, my interest was sparked by the emphasis placed on winning. You're placed in direct competition against other people, and the best part about it was that there's always a game going online. For me, the money isn't all that important. I've always had an "easy come, easy go" attitude to my finances(probably why i've never had any). Its nice to be able to make money, but i was surprised by how dissatisfied with myself i was when i turned my first winning month, which i contribute to the fact that i just didn't feel challenged anymore by the players at the limits i was playing at(this was of course the inspiration for the "moving up in the world" thread). I reckon i'll play poker as long as i find it challenging, and when that day comes, i'll probably move onto something else. Hopefully it won't be anyday soon, but i expect i still have a long way to go before that is!

califano

I like poker because i find the challenge of playing mirrors life in many ways in that poker as in life is full of trials and tribulations and also quite a solitary game.
Despite being in close proximity to others when playing and even listening to and partaking in the banter at the table your still very much on your own anonomous even and i like that.
Playing poker is also what i imagine a solo yacht race to be like. Your at the start in dock on level terms with your peers but when the fog horn goes your totally on your own. Different people choose to take different routes to achieve the same goal. Nobody is there to help nor do you want anybodys help, this is a challenge you want to face alone. Eventually once in a blue moon the course you decided to chart works out against all the odds and you come in to dock ahead of everybody else to reap the rewards and the prestige. And it all starts again, a new race a new voyage. The want compete and win again to savour victory once more makes us come back and back for more!.

staringelf

if i'm being honest its primarily the potential to make a lot of money.

secondary to that is all the stuff thats already been mentioned: the buzz, camaraderie, how it relates to so many real life situations, what it teaches me about myself and the psychological insights into other peoples minds, etc etc

staringelf

rounders123 wrote:

I like poker because i find the challenge of playing mirrors life in many ways in that poker as in life is full of trials and tribulations and also quite a solitary game.
Despite being in close proximity to others when playing and even listening to and partaking in the banter at the table your still very much on your own anonomous even and i like that.
Playing poker is also what i imagine a solo yacht race to be like. Your at the start in dock on level terms with your peers but when the fog horn goes your totally on your own. Different people choose to take different routes to achieve the same goal. Nobody is there to help nor do you want anybodys help, this is a challenge you want to face alone. Eventually once in a blue moon the course you decided to chart works out against all the odds and you come in to dock ahead of everybody else to reap the rewards and the prestige. And it all starts again, a new race a new voyage. The want compete and win again to savour victory once more makes us come back and back for more!.

nice analogy by the way. sums it up quite well

Marq

Amaru wrote:

For the last 3 years of my college education, i was bored by the complete lack of anything that challenged my intelligence.

What did you study in college that you found didn't challenge you intellectually? I have always found academia to be rewarding due to its practical infinity.

RoundTower

I like the challenge and the competition of playing and doing well. I was a chess player long before I played poker, so it's the same kind of drive.

It's more than that, though, because I also enjoy gambling. I don't bet on sports/casino games etc., but I probably would have found something else if I didn't play poker.

padser

I hate poker. I really do. Just after making a forage from my normall STT to some low no limit cash. Made some terrible plays, got some horrendous beats.....just wondering why i bother. :mad:

Amaru

Marq wrote:

What did you study in college that you found didn't challenge you intellectually? I have always found academia to be rewarding due to its practical infinity.

Computer Science. It wasn't just the subject matter that wasn't intellectually challenging, it was the tasks they set for us. Any project, regardless of how long the deadline was completeable with 2 or 3 days of decent effort. Also, several modules were assigned every year that were in no way relevant to the course, which always annoyed me immensely.

Academia is rewarding, this i agree with, as i still pursue areas of knowledge that most study at the college level(business, psychology, etc). However, computers, and especially programming, are very limited areas of knowledge, ones which can be mastered in very few years.

RMcG

I have asked myself this question a million times, I have also asked myself whay we exist a million times too. Why do we exist? I have many theories just like everyone else but no answer, why do I play poker? I have many theories to this too, the answer to this is we are what we are. We do not choose poker, poker chooses us and its ****ing true. Why is it that I like the taste of lemon yet my brother gets sick when he puts lemon in his mouth, why do I like Brunettes when my best mate likes blondes, WE ARE WHAT WE ARE, poker chooses us, we were born to be poker players and if we struggle, we struggle, if we strive, we strive........

We love poker because we were born to love poker, dont believe me. Try giving poker up, try to not play poker for a year...........result, impossible, why? Becasue at the end of the day we cant change who or what we are. ....

We all love poker because we were born to be poker players. Amen.

I ****ing love poker so so so much.:D

Hectorjelly

There speaks a man who is running well.

5starpool

RMcG wrote:

I have asked myself this question a million times, I have also asked myself whay we exist a million times too. Why do we exist? I have many theories just like everyone else but no answer, why do I play poker? I have many theories to this too, the answer to this is we are what we are. We do not choose poker, poker chooses us and its ****ing true. Why is it that I like the taste of lemon yet my brother gets sick when he puts lemon in his mouth, why do I like Brunettes when my best mate likes blondes, WE ARE WHAT WE ARE, poker chooses us, we were born to be poker players and if we struggle, we struggle, if we strive, we strive........

We love poker because we were born to love poker, dont believe me. Try giving poker up, try to not play poker for a year...........result, impossible, why? Becasue at the end of the day we cant change who or what we are. ....

We all love poker because we were born to be poker players. Amen.

I ****ing love poker so so so much.:D

A-fecking-men

RMcG

Hahahah cheers lads and A-fecking-men is right

Imposter

An interesting and different thread! It's been a while!

As for poker, what a game! As Hector said "Imagine explaining poker to someone who had no idea what it is". You can even expand that to include better players explaining it to people with some but less experience/knowledge. They might think they understand but they rarely get it.

Funkyzeit

It's the ups and downs that attract me - some nights I think I'm unbeatable other nights (like last night) I think I'm a right muppet out of my depth....:o

AmarilloFats

Hope. The hope that one day you'll be beating the bigger games and can retire to Poland or where ever....It's the dream that drives me.. . . .And the few $$ along the way... and all of the reasons above...horn of death for poker

jimbling

Hectorjelly wrote:

Imagine explaining poker to someone who had no idea what it is.

I seem to be doing this very often indeed.... and I have not once been able to get it across in a satisfactory manner. I see them nodding .. . and hear them mumbling...... "yes, yes, I understand", but I know they don't. They have no clue.

Unless someone has already caught the bug, then it is inevitable that they will not, nor want to, understand where your coming from.

Try telling someone that poker is a more complex game than chess, tell them its a beautifully intricate and delicate game...... they laugh, and think you have a gambling problem :eek:



so what is it I love about poker... its just that!, your playing a game thats a never-ending battle. I find it enthralling that I know so much about the game, after months of reading, studying, practising..... and yet I am still so inept... still so far from the truth.

I'm not so sure that its poker that chooses you... I think its you that choose poker.. you just don't know it. Most poker players have similar qualities, relatively high IQ (although due to my high intake of dope over a period of more than 10 years, mine has dropped a quite few notches )..... A logical mind...... A Problem Solver... and a bit of a gambler... the list goes on.


I have always had a gambling streak in me... since the age of 8 when I won a load of crap at the local bazaar. Then turned 10 and discovered the slots on the ferry to france...... and won : no turning back now! Next was learning to play rummy from the grandmother (excellent card player), and winning the coppers off the family after christmas dinner...... and on it went.

Over the last 4/5 years I have gone through stages of betting on horses, football etc etc.. And what I find amazing is that through poker I am learning to dull my gambling streak... rid myself of my impulsive nature... numb my fiery temper.... and learn more and more about my own personality and conditioned behaviour.

there may be other games like it... there may be.. but none that I know of.

Ste05

Excellent Post Jimbling, and very akin to my own feelings about this whole topic.

I think you have my feelings and experience down perfectly, although I'd add that Poker is also a fantastic outlet for the competitive streak in me, and us all I'm sure, for me, this used to be satisfied by Sports, but when I was badly injured about 2 years ago, I was out of action for 9 months and haven't been able to get back to the level I was before. And now Poker provides an even better outlet for satisfying my own urge to win and be competitive.

bmc

I think Jimbling is the one who has come closest to the answer (in my mind).

We are gamblers. We are gambling addicts to some degree or another.

Some of us are gamblers who are making a regular profit.

Some of us are gamblers who think we are making a profit.

Some of us are gamblers who are losing some money.

Some of us are gamblers who are losing the house and family.

Some of the above gamblers are better at controlling how much they gamble but I think it is the same gambling addiction as roulette, blackjack, horses, whatever.

We can justify it to ourselves though by talking about "zero sum", "beatable", "long term" games. Thats the difference. We like to gamble but we are often too smart to take on the biased odds games.

Sinfonia

I think Jimbling is the one who has come closest to the answer (in my mind).

We are gamblers. We are gambling addicts to some degree or another.

Some of us are gamblers who are making a regular profit.

Some of us are gamblers who think we are making a profit.

Some of us are gamblers who are losing some money.

Some of us are gamblers who are losing the house and family.

Some of the above gamblers are better at controlling how much they gamble but I think it is the same gambling addiction as roulette, blackjack, horses, whatever.

We can justify it to ourselves though by talking about "zero sum", "beatable", "long term" games. Thats the difference. We like to gamble but we are often too smart to take on the biased odds games.

i dunno about that, i dont really like to gamble.
i dont like any casino games, really.
poker's a great game. i'd have as much fun playin for free as i would playing for money. the only difference is, i play better when its for money, because there's more at stake, same as if i played pool for money, i play better because i dont want to lose money. if i didnt enjoy playing poker for free, i wouldnt play it for money, i d have no fun then, it would feel like work.

NickyOD

I still don't know why I play poker.

handsfree

i play poker because i like making the right decisions. i teaches me to evaluate the evidence before me and make an educated guess to what other players have. from here i can base my decision on what kind of player my oponent is: will he fold top pair to a clever bluff or simply call me down. anyway your decision are rewarded or punished instantly. the only times i think i'll quit is when i make the right decision and lose to runner runner flush or inside straight draw.

jimbling

Ste05 wrote:

Excellent Post Jimbling, and very akin to my own feelings about this whole topic.

I think you have my feelings and experience down perfectly, although I'd add that Poker is also a fantastic outlet for the competitive streak in me, and us all I'm sure, for me, this used to be satisfied by Sports, but when I was badly injured about 2 years ago, I was out of action for 9 months and haven't been able to get back to the level I was before. And now Poker provides an even better outlet for satisfying my own urge to win and be competitive.

ty... and another interesting point. I would agree with you that it will help a competitive streak. You have something to put your mind and efforts towards. This helps a lot. But I would also say that having a serious competitive streak could hinder your ability to play poker. I may be completely off here, but I would think that the want to win every time could have a negative effect. ie you would be looking less to the long run, and more towards the immediate outcome....which is never a good idea in poker.


also... bmc, I think you picked me up wrong there. I am not saying that we're all a bunch of gambling addicts... not at all.

Some of us may have come from that background - in fact quite a few did. But it is definitely not confined to that. When I said we needed "a bit of a gambler" in us, I was more alluding to risk-taking, entrepreneurship etc

Ardent

I don't agree about the gambling angle. I've never gambled in my life - never took a flurry on the horses or a football match, not my scene.

Poker is the closest I've ever got to gambling and even then I wouldn't consider it gambling. I only play it online and only for the $$$. If I was losing money or merely maintaining a status quo, I wouldn't keep playing it.

Ste05

jimbling wrote:

This helps a lot. But I would also say that having a serious competitive streak could hinder your ability to play poker. I may be completely off here, but I would think that the want to win every time could have a negative effect. ie you would be looking less to the long run, and more towards the immediate outcome....which is never a good idea in poker.

This is so true, and it's a discipline I wrestle with every night, when I'm in a hand at all, I'm always looking for how to win this hand in particular, and where it goes wrong is when I fail to see that I can't win the hand, and this is where my poker development is at present, I'm trying to train my brain that to lose the minimum is the very same as winning the maximum, and to try and see it in a kind of reverse winning (kinda thing that I can't quite think of the right word to insert here)

I can see this post, going down a long dark and boring road, so I'll cut it there and agree again with you Jimbling

bmc

jimbling wrote:

also... bmc, I think you picked me up wrong there. I am not saying that we're all a bunch of gambling addicts... not at all.

No, no. I gathered that. Sorry.

What I was trying to say is that you're the first one to make any reference to the gambling element of it. Its a black topic that most people who play poker shy away from.

It is my opinion though that all of those who play poker with as much "dedication" as a lot of people on here are in it for the gamble, even those of us who are smart enough to maximise our gains or avoid getting sucked down into the more murky depths of addiction.

I remember from Andy Black's interview on RTE after the WSOP that he certainly didn't shy away from the question. When he was asked if he was "addicted to gambling" his answer was, "I would like to think so".

jimbling

Ste05 wrote:

I can see this post, going down a long dark and boring road, so I'll cut it there and agree again with you Jimbling

lol... sure.

Shortstack

Poker IS gambling but not in the same way as Sports betting or horses or roulette.

It is more akin to the Chelsea team putting a lump sum on themselves to win the Premiership.

YOU are backing yourself to win at a game of skill (long term).

We are all addicted to gambling that we are the best in whatever game we choose to enter.

padser

I disagree with the assertion that im (or all of us are) a gambler.

When i head to the casino (iv only been 5/6 times and have never won, broke even once) I go to play either a tournament (less then E50) or E10 or E20 STT. Its not gambling as i regard the money i spend as for entertainment purposes. I may or may not (in casino so far its always been not) get my money back and have had free night. Instead of spening e50 in the pub i spend it 'entertaining' myself at a poker table. I dont see how that is the same as gambling since my primary aim is to enjoy myself and the buy in is the cost of that.

Online is slightly harder to justify, since i do play there with the intention of coming out ahead, and am paying money to do so, so I guess thats a form of gambling but i still cant accept its akin to betting on horses......or even chelsea.

*EDIT* maybe online can be justified in the sense that if you are a better player, then the odds are in your favour. No one would suggest that the owner of a casino is gambling by setting themselves up as the 'house' in a blackjack game......after all in the long run the game is unbeatable. Equally in $3 and $5 STT im enough ahead of the field to make it not a gamble in the long run???? I

Tackle

I love it because I can make a living out of it. Great money, flexible hours, no boss annoying me. As for the game itself, I just love sitting down at a few cash games and trying to clean out as many people as possible and seeing my stack going up and up. I find live play boring, it's just too slow. I'm only interested in making as much money as I can, not really into the social/recreactional aspect of it so I only play online.

jimbling

bmc wrote:

No, no. I gathered that. Sorry.

What I was trying to say is that you're the first one to make any reference to the gambling element of it. Its a black topic that most people who play poker shy away from.

It is my opinion though that all of those who play poker with as much "dedication" as a lot of people on here are in it for the gamble, even those of us who are smart enough to maximise our gains or avoid getting sucked down into the more murky depths of addiction.

I remember from Andy Black's interview on RTE after the WSOP that he certainly didn't shy away from the question. When he was asked if he was "addicted to gambling" his answer was, "I would like to think so".

okay... I'm going to start another thread on the subject of gambling addiction etc, as I don't want this subject to take over this thread (I have a few issues with it ). I wish to leave this for the "why do I play poker" question.

jimbling

jimbling wrote:

okay... I'm going to start another thread on the subject of gambling addiction etc, as I don't want this subject to take over this thread (I have a few issues with it ). I wish to leave this for the "why do I play poker" question.

lol.. maybe I wont bother after all....seems already taken over

bmc

padser wrote:

I disagree with the assertion that im (or all of us are) a gambler.

Online is slightly harder to justify, since i do play there with the intention of coming out ahead, and am paying money to do so, so I guess thats a form of gambling but i still cant accept its akin to betting on horses......or even chelsea.

Is there no allure coming from the fact that you MIGHT win?

Perhaps you're not one of the people who I "politely" referred to as "dedicated", but I think for the bulk of the people who spend as much time as many on this site eating, sleeping and drinking poker there must be a stronger lure than "the craic".

It is not the same as betting on horses because we know the bookie has the overall odds tilted in his favour. It's also not the same as horses in that we have no control over the race itself (or the roulette ball, or the blackjack cards). We do have control over who we play against (thats adjusting our long term odds) and how much we play for and how focussed we remain during the game.

I think the bulk of people who see themselves as "poker players" but not "gamblers" are experiencing the lure of gambling but are too smart to put money into anything in which they don't see a mathematical edge or at least a potential one.

That isn't to say that everyone who has ever played a poker game is playing for the gamble but for the bulk of "repeat customers" I think its true.

Marq

I play Because.

jimbling

bmc wrote:

I think the bulk of people who see themselves as "poker players" but not "gamblers" are experiencing the lure of gambling but are too smart to put money into anything in which they don't see a mathematical edge or at least a potential one.

yes but if you really think about it... .what is that lure. It is the winning - been the best - and getting a reward.
But everything works on this basis.
The golfer wins money, the tennis player wins money. They spend hundreds / thousands in getting themselves to where they are. ARE THEY NOT GAMBLING. What if they don't become a succesfull pro, what about the rugby player who spends his life training gets injured and can never play again - all that time - all that time... and we all know what time is


People say due to the chance element in poker it can not be regarded as a game of skill. But does the best golfer always win the open, does the best soccer team always win the match etc etc.. i could go on.

Poker is not, in the pure sense, a game of skill. But neither is it a game of chance. And I believe it to be much closer to a game of skill than to a game of chance.

bmc

jimbling wrote:

Poker is not, in the pure sense, a game of skill. But neither is it a game of chance. And I believe it to be much closer to a game of skill than to a game of chance.

Completely agreed, but to play it you wager money to win more money. You can be skilled at gambling. To be skilled at gambling you put your money in when you are ahead. Sometimes you lose, but in the long term you profit.


I am not saying that all poker players are gambling addicts. Whether you are an addict or not depends on whether you can stop or not. I'm not saying that those who are addicts have "gambling problems" either. I suspect that Hectorjelly is addicted to poker but it's clearly not a problem for him.


I am suggesting that the ups and downs, the thrills, the disappointments, the rushes and the risk of losing something of value or winning something of value is the lure for most people. Perhaps not in your case. Certainly not in EVERY case.

Iago

When I first started playing draw poker I was 10-11 and I played for pennies against my friends, sometimes I found that I could turn those pennies into 10p and 20p and even 50p, this allowed me to buy goods and services and it was good...

Then I didn't play for the guts of 10 years or so and when I started playing again it was more for the social aspect of the game than anything else. Home games with friends, beer and playstations, pizza and sometimes leaving with more money than I arrived with. Then it was about the craic and the bragging rights. It was about bluffing and semi-bluffing and playing weak and pretending to be strong and generally just out thinking and out manuevouring people. Much like when I play chess, the satisfaction comes as much from beating the other guy as it does for any prize/money I may get.

Now when I play, I almost exclusively play online, there is no social or craic aspect, it's all about the money. Specifically how much money I can make in a given period of time. I'm playing part-time but only because at some point in the future I hope to be good enough to play full-time and therefore remove the need for me to work at all. I enjoy the game, but it's a means to an end, at times it feels like work, at times it's the most frustrated I get, but more often than not I really enjoy just playing and tracking how I'm doing.

I may play for the money, but the money wouldn't be enough if I didn't enjoy the game enough.

hotspur

I don't think that it's at all true to say that the majority of poker players play for the gamble. Yes poker is considered gambling and so all poker players gamble. But if you knew the profile of a very significant portion of the new Internet poker players who have taken up the game over the past 3 years then you would see a non-gambling group. This is a group that is almost never written about, but since I know them from my own background I'll tell you who they are.

Poker for proper money was previously a gambler's world, no different from blackjack, horses, roulette etc. Then when it became more mainstream it became part of the "gaming" culture, not gaming as in the Las Vegas euphemism, but gaming as in the world of game playing like chess, board games, other card games, i.e. the subculture populated by young, very intelligent and often socially less confidant males. This group is a non-gambling non-risk taking population who graduated to poker because it was a great game and they could make a lot of money from it. They don't play for the gamble, they play for the game and for the money they can make from it. And these are the successful online poker players out there.

The best example is the migration of players from the trading card game magic: the gathering to poker, and I don't think anyone can fully appreciate how the poker phenonemon developed without understanding the importance of this game's role. You may not have heard of the game but a huge number ofthe top young poker players in the world came from it, e.g. Dave Williams (wsop 2nd place), Noah Boeken (ept winner), Eric Froelich (youngest ever wsop braclet winner), Jordan Berkowitz (current wcoop main event champ), Thunder Keller, and many many others who make big money online.

Magic, which led to Pokemon and Uh Gi Oh among other card games, taught a generation of teenagers and students that you could make money from playing cards. They created a worldwide pro tour which is like the wpt with a prizefund of millions of dollars per year. For example the winner of the 2004 world championships was 15 or 16 and he won about $35,000 for coming 1st. Having learnt that his intelliegence and skill at cards can result in him earning very large sums of money at an early age do you think he has started playing poker? Of course he has. Practically every player who was successful at this game moved into poker because they learnt that they could get material benefits from their game playing skill. Gone are the days when all very good gamers got was the respect of their geeky peers.

The point I'm making is that a significant portion of today's poker players, particularly successful Internet poker players, are gamers not gamblers. They don't play for the thrill of the gamble, in fact given their nature most of them are adverse to that kind of stimulation, it's about the game and money. I can tell you from my research that a huge number of Internet poker players don't engage in any other forms of gambling.

As I said this is very seldom written about but here is a book that deals with the prototypical top magic gamer turned poker player:
http://www.revolutionsf.com/article.html?id=2801

kincsem

Why do I play poker?

I like many types of gambling. I'm 55. In my 20s I played social games for cash. You need to play high enough that it hurts. Once when my pay was £250 a month I was in a £400 pot.

For about 20 years I didn't gamble, just the occasional Grand National or World Cup bet.

From the start of the 1990s I was big into horseracing. I went to the racecourse, not the bookies. After winning £3,500 on the 1992 English Derby I spend years researching horse pedigrees and even wrote a program to do it automatically. I want to know what others don't know.

But I have no interest in slots, roulette, blackjack or other games devoid of skill. I play games where I can get an edge. It is nice to win but I think what poker players really want most of all is to play, and to play well. They like the pressure.

It might be a primative hunting thing. Sneak up on that big dinosaur and show him that set you have been slow-playing.

Tip for the English Derby 2006: Sir Percy @ 16/1 Paddy Powers last time I looked.

bohsman

I started of on the 10p blackjack machine in Quirkeys around 10 years ago had a couple of big wins, found out the machine accepted 5cUS coins so brought a load back from America and got myself an edge.
Moved onto doing the football coupons but never won so moved onto the dogs and horses untill Poker found me.

These days I dont feel that I gamble, if I think the bookies are way off on a football match I will lump on and I play blackjack when I have an edge

Rnger

bohsman wrote:

....and I play blackjack when I have an edge

this confuses me. surely you have to play a few hands of blackjack before an edge presents itself eg. doulbe on 11 against a 6. Perhaps you just mean that your on a lucky streak.. but they dont exist

bohsman

Rnger wrote:

this confuses me. surely you have to play a few hands of blackjack before an edge presents itself eg. doulbe on 11 against a 6. Perhaps you just mean that your on a lucky streak.. but they dont exist

bonuses.

ocallagh

I enjoy playing cards, winning money is also good and I definitely like to gamble.

The satisfaction I get from winning a tourny keeps me coming back for more... Also, when I bust-out from a stupid mistake I can't wait to get back in there and try to rectify that mistake.

There is a constant learning curve associated with poker.. If I know I'm improving at something I won't get bored of it.

Apat from that the reasons above you also get to travel, meet interesting people and stay clear of the rip-off culture/**** nightclubs that have taken over Dublin!!

DubTony

Marq wrote:

I play Because.

hmmm ... Deep.


It has to be the challenge. Believe it or not I didn't know (or care) that you could play poker online until I heard that Partygaming was being floated on the stock market (so that's about 6 months ago). I frequented many casino sites and played mainly heads-up blackjack until, about 3 years ago, one site wouldn't pay me my winnings (got my stake back). But I don't recall ever seeing the word poker on any of them.

My only previous challenge was chess. I played it from age 10 to 12 (about 18 months). The chess class I was in didn't play in any tournaments (not that I knew there were any) and so every game was played against other class members. After 1 year I had beaten everyone in the class including the "teacher" (3 in a row) and was being hailed as the next great thing. I quit. It was boring.

Poker has a huge element of skill that intrigues me. At the moment I'm usually the mug at the table but I think I'm learning fast. But just when I think I've moved up a skill level, I come on here and read a thread and say "WOW ... I really am clueless."

I'm really looking forward to being able to sit at a table with some of you guys and feel like I can win. Now that's a challenge that should keep me busy for a long time to come.

RoundTower

padser wrote:

I disagree with the assertion that im (or all of us are) a gambler.

When i head to the casino (iv only been 5/6 times and have never won, broke even once) I go to play either a tournament (less then E50) or E10 or E20 STT. Its not gambling as i regard the money i spend as for entertainment purposes. I may or may not (in casino so far its always been not) get my money back and have had free night. Instead of spening e50 in the pub i spend it 'entertaining' myself at a poker table. I dont see how that is the same as gambling since my primary aim is to enjoy myself and the buy in is the cost of that.

Would you consider it gambling if you went out to the casino and lost €40,000 on punto banco, but were entertained very well?