Confusing Junction - Chelmsford Road and Ranelagh Road

ballooba

What's the deal with the lights at this junction?

It's the junction in Ranelagh with the Spar on one corner.

If you are coming out of the Cul De Sac facing in the direction of Chelmsford Rd there is a combined left right filter onto Ranelagh Road that both come on at the same time.

At the same time as this is happening the lights for those coming from Chelmsford Rd are green i.e. turn left /turn right/ go straight ahead into Cul De Sac.

You have traffic going 5 ways at once:
1) From Chelmsford Road crossing one lane turning right.
2) From Chelmsford Road turning left.
3) From Chelmsford Road going straight ahead.
4) From Cul De Sac crossing one lane going right.
5) From Cul De Sac crossing going left.

I was turning right from the Cul De Sac to travel in the same direction up Ranelagh Road as this gentleman who was turning left from Chelmsford Rd. There was a car before him turning right. I felt there was enough time to get across before my man rounded the corner.


The guy stopped about a foot shy of hitting the side of my car. I was still completing my turn into the lane as was he but he had accelerated to freak me out. Luckily, I don't freak out easily and was still making way. Could my 'L' plates have caused this rage?

[edit] See attached map: http://ballooba.net/map.gif
Cul De Sac is called Elmpark Avenue[/edit]

mike65

Moving this to Commuting/Transport

Mike.

daymobrew

ballooba wrote:

I felt there was enough time to get across before he rounded the corner.

The guy stopped about a foot before hitting the side of my car.

The first sentence I quote makes it sound like you took an ill advised risk (i.e. you 'felt' wrong) and were lucky not to have been hit from the side. I believe that the car turning left has the right of way over you.

The second sentence makes it sound like you did have a collision but the rest of the paragraph makes it sound like you 'got away with it'. Where you hit or is it just a confusing sentence where "before hitting the" should be replaced with "from"?

ballooba

My driving instructor always told me that if I felt there was a safe gap that I should go for it. There probably was in this case but I couldn't be sure because the guy definitely accelerated to try and freak me out.

[edit]
I'm doing my test soon and I was told that if waiting to turn right that if there was a safe gap in the oncoming traffic that I should make my turn to show confidence to the instructor. If I missed too big a gap I may be done for insufficient progress.

That is, as long as there is not a red light above the filter.
[/edit]

BrianD

Actually it's pretty straightforward. Chelmsford Road - Elmpark Avenue is treated as one axis of a cros road. Therefore you yield to left turning traffic. It's quite possible that both of you assumed that the signal only applied to you and that all other traffic would be stationary. While it may not seem like a straightforward "crossroads" the onus is on the drivers to anticipate that other cars may have a green signal.

seamus

BrianD wrote:

Is the cul-de-sac signal controlled?

No. It kind of makes the junction into a T, but because it's so small, it's more of a laneway onto the main road than an actual road, hence there are no traffic signals. As such, ultimately you must yield to all traffic when exiting the road.

ballooba

Actually there are lights coming from the Cul De Sac, they pretty much mirror those on the opposite side of the junction, except that those coming from Chelmsford Rd are allowed travel straight ahead also.

MicraBoy

No. It kind of makes the junction into a T, but because it's so small, it's more of a laneway onto the main road than an actual road, hence there are no traffic signals. As such, ultimately you must yield to all traffic when exiting the road.

There are lights on the cul de sac side, and it is signalled like any other cross road. The layout is a bit off center though which makes it confusing. That said I regularly see the traffic coming from Chelmsford road (turning right) failing to yield to cars coming left out of Elmpark Ave.

I guess the driver of the other car didn't agree that you had enough time ballooba! But yeah in principle you would be fine if the gap is big enough. I think however for your test you should be more cautious than this. If this happened in a test I think you would be in trouble, regardless of the bad behaviour of the other driver.

ballooba

So basically yield to traffic turning left.

That's a bit of a pain in the ass because there will be a constant stream of traffic coming from Chelmsford Road turning left and you won't get a chance to turn right.

Is it possible to turn right here at all without breaking the law. Even if there are no cars turning left from Chelmsford Rd you have to keep them on your left as you pass.

seamus

MicraBoy wrote:

There are lights on the cul de sac side, and it is signalled like any other cross road. The layout is a bit off center though which makes it confusing. That said I regularly see the traffic coming from Chelmsford road (turning right) failing to yield to cars coming left out of Elmpark Ave.

Ah OK. It's been a while since I was down there.