Pro-gaming: It's here to stay!

Memnoch

With the recent World Cyber Games held in singapore being a huge success I'm starting to come to the realisation that pro gaming is here to stay and that this fledgling sport has a guarenteed future.

I'd say the factors that are part of this spread include
1) More and more people playing video games throughout the world. In many places gaming and the internet are starting to replace television as a primary source of entertainment of today's youth.
2) Availibility of broadband resulting in more and more people playing competitive online games.

Sponsers around the world are starting to realise the potential of gaming as an advertising avenue for their products. In some places gaming is starting to get REALLY big. Sadly the true pioneer in this region is Asia, with Korea being the flash point for all this.

Professional gaming in Korea is part of mainstream television with several channels dedicated to E-sports. Lots of people take part as "full time pro's" in the e-sports scene competing in leagues and tournaments (not unlike the premiereship in England). The top players in Korea earn $300,000 in sponsership saleries alone + what they can take home as tournament prizes.

China is another big and growing hub for asian gaming and it is starting to be taken up in other asian countries as well though not as big yet.

Europe while being a fair bit behind asia as far as the pro-gaming scene is concerned isn't completely dead in the water. Germany is the main hub here and there is even a german e-sports channel, though I'm not sure if it's internet broadcast only or if it does broadcast on normal television as well.

America isn't left out of this revolution either, with numerous leages and tournaments popping up. The CPL's world tour gave away 1 million$ in prize money this year for painkiller alone. Quake 4, next year's CPL game will probably pick up where it left off.

I think the key is that in europe and america, competition organisers have established a succesful business model on which to build upon and that organising these leages etc is actually profitable. Because gaming is still a "small time" sport, this tends to lure sponsors easily. After all companies with millions to spend on marketing can easily afford to throw aroudn a couple of hundred thousand at gaming in return for potentially huge viewership.

Ireland unsurprisingly is nowhere on the e-sports scene. In my opinion the primary reason for this is eircom and their retarded tactics to slow broadband penetration and the poor quality over all of broadband service in this country. Still slowly but surely broadband IS catching on in Ireland and the current and upcoming generations are growing up in a digitally enabled culture.

So what are you're views on pro-gaming? Is it something you would ever be intersted in following like other competitive sports? Is it something you would ever hope to participate in? And would there be any interest in a community and pro gaming scene within Ireland. I suppose the one way in which we differ from other gaming nations is that Ireland is very casual player heavy.

P.S. any lamers thinking about claiming that gaming isn't a real sport because it doesn't involve physical activity need only to look at chess and kindly stfu pre-emptively.

Kazujo

I think it's about time that gaming was recognised as a sport. it's only now with the (limited) proliferation of broadband that playing games is no longer something that people play alone or in very small groups. It is now a very big social activity.

As you say chess has been recognise as an international contest for years, lets face it watching a Counter Strike Tournament is a whole lot more interesting than watching a chess match.

It's one of those dream professions to get payed for playing games, not even debugging or anything just playing. Fantastic

Kare Bear

http://www.worldchampgames.com/htbapg/ebook/

This could come in handy.

Canis Lupus

I've played games since a wee little chap when I got my Commodore. I love games and it's rare that I'm not playing one and I defend gaming whenever someone slags it off.

However I don't consider gaming a sport. I consider it a passtime. I don't mind the word pro gaming as such but calling it a sport just sounds silly to me.

Memnoch

Canis Lupus wrote:

However I don't consider gaming a sport. I consider it a passtime. I don't mind the word pro gaming as such but calling it a sport just sounds silly to me.

because?


there are always people who resist change. What you said is pretty much exactly what was said about the things we now consider sport when they were in their infancy.

"Football, it's a great past time but not to be taken seriously when there is a real man's work to be done."

koneko

MTV did a lot of coverage recently on this, with the Xbox 360 launch they had a "Gam0RZ" (yeah... I know...) week, they covered Xbox360 launch parties but also had another True Life show on gaming, this one was on Pro Gaming particularly ("True Life: I'm a Pro-Gamer"). They're not great at picking their targets for the show, they did have Zyos on it though (pro Halo player). Fatal1ty was on their last show, good while back now. They did some coverage of the CPL aswell, that was on a few days ago. All sorts of mainstream news media are picking up on it. IIRC Time had an article on it, I think Fox Sports had something on it, lots of other magazines and websites.

Gaming is a past time, like a lot of things (football, poker, golf). Doesn't mean you can't do those things for a living, if you're really really good, and lucky.

The UK, Germany and France are catching on (ESCW is in Paris), it's only a matter of time before more countries do. The Scandi countries have done for a while now, they put out some great players/teams.

Canis Lupus

Memnoch wrote:

because?


there are always people who resist change. What you said is pretty much exactly what was said about the things we now consider sport when they were in their infancy.

"Football, it's a great past time but not to be taken seriously when there is a real man's work to be done."

heh heh. I don't really mind what pro gaming is called. Altho I would probably wonder how you classify it as a sport as there is no one single computer game that everyone plays universally with one set of rules. Football is football, tennis is tennis, chess is chess and so on. Gaming is Quake one day and CoD the next with a bit of C&C here and Rome Total war there. Gaming as a concept is playing computer games hence a passtime in my eyes, gaming covers too much to be classified as a sport.

Tusky

Kazujo wrote:

I think it's about time that gaming was recognised as a sport. it's only now with the (limited) proliferation of broadband that playing games is no longer something that people play alone or in very small groups. It is now a very big social activity.

As you say chess has been recognise as an international contest for years, lets face it watching a Counter Strike Tournament is a whole lot more interesting than watching a chess match.

It's one of those dream professions to get payed for playing games, not even debugging or anything just playing. Fantastic

Its not a sport ffs.

Memnoch

Tusky wrote:

Its not a sport ffs.

because?

Memnoch

Canis Lupus wrote:

heh heh. I don't really mind what pro gaming is called. Altho I would probably wonder how you classify it as a sport as there is no one single computer game that everyone plays universally with one set of rules. Football is football, tennis is tennis, chess is chess and so on. Gaming is Quake one day and CoD the next with a bit of C&C here and Rome Total war there. Gaming as a concept is playing computer games hence a passtime in my eyes, gaming covers too much to be classified as a sport.

right so football, tennis and chess are different sports

Just as within gaming there are different games each with their own set of players and fanbase. Off course I take your point, because of the fluid nature of gaming it's hard to use the same terms to define it, but that doesn't stop it from being a competitive and profession pathway. It will probably take some time, because right now pro-gaming is in it's infancy. and still growing, so there is more than enough room for all these different types of competitions etc. Right now anything that increases exposure is good.

Eventually there will need to be consolidation, probably the establishment of a global as well as national bodies that define the rules of the sport universally and so on and so forth. One would think this will be difficult considering the diversity of gamign and gamers, which makes it hard to envision the future exactly.

The only thing that is for certain in my view is success and continued growth, exactly what it congeals into, only time will tell. But the sooner people take their prejudices and heads out from under the blanket the sooner we will see progress

Illkillya

Memnoch wrote:

With the recent World Cyber Games held in singapore being a huge success I'm starting to come to the realisation that pro gaming is here to stay and that this fledgling sport has a guarenteed future.

I'd say the factors that are part of this spread include
1) More and more people playing video games throughout the world. In many places gaming and the internet are starting to replace television as a primary source of entertainment of today's youth.
2) Availibility of broadband resulting in more and more people playing competitive online games.

Sponsers around the world are starting to realise the potential of gaming as an advertising avenue for their products. In some places gaming is starting to get REALLY big. Sadly the true pioneer in this region is Asia, with Korea being the flash point for all this.

Professional gaming in Korea is part of mainstream television with several channels dedicated to E-sports. Lots of people take part as "full time pro's" in the e-sports scene competing in leagues and tournaments (not unlike the premiereship in England). The top players in Korea earn $300,000 in sponsership saleries alone + what they can take home as tournament prizes.

China is another big and growing hub for asian gaming and it is starting to be taken up in other asian countries as well though not as big yet.

Europe while being a fair bit behind asia as far as the pro-gaming scene is concerned isn't completely dead in the water. Germany is the main hub here and there is even a german e-sports channel, though I'm not sure if it's internet broadcast only or if it does broadcast on normal television as well.

America isn't left out of this revolution either, with numerous leages and tournaments popping up. The CPL's world tour gave away 1 million$ in prize money this year for painkiller alone. Quake 4, next year's CPL game will probably pick up where it left off.

I think the key is that in europe and america, competition organisers have established a succesful business model on which to build upon and that organising these leages etc is actually profitable. Because gaming is still a "small time" sport, this tends to lure sponsors easily. After all companies with millions to spend on marketing can easily afford to throw aroudn a couple of hundred thousand at gaming in return for potentially huge viewership.

Ireland unsurprisingly is nowhere on the e-sports scene. In my opinion the primary reason for this is eircom and their retarded tactics to slow broadband penetration and the poor quality over all of broadband service in this country. Still slowly but surely broadband IS catching on in Ireland and the current and upcoming generations are growing up in a digitally enabled culture.

So what are you're views on pro-gaming? Is it something you would ever be intersted in following like other competitive sports? Is it something you would ever hope to participate in? And would there be any interest in a community and pro gaming scene within Ireland. I suppose the one way in which we differ from other gaming nations is that Ireland is very casual player heavy.

P.S. any lamers thinking about claiming that gaming isn't a real sport because it doesn't involve physical activity need only to look at chess and kindly stfu pre-emptively.

My views on pro gaming are... if you're in it for the money, then forget about it. I can earn far more than all but the exceptional few (boxer, fatality, poker players, etc) working 9 to 5. If you're in it for the challenge and the enjoyment of the game then thats fine.

It really put it into perspective last night though, when Vo0, just a young fella, was playing for $150,000 in the CPL final.
Taken from ESR, here are the top 5 earners in Painkiller in the CPL last year.
1. Vo0 ( $232,000 )
2. Fatal1ty ( $231,000 )
3. stermy ( $111,000 )
4. zyz ( $102,750 )
5. Ztrider ( $ 86,500 )
From a game with a total of 17 players, that is a lot of money. I wonder what kind of prizes will be given for Quake4 1v1 tourneys next year.

Ireland is way behind and falling further behind every month. A few years ago, we had teams of international standard in Q3, UT, and CS to start with - we had lots of clans and organisation, but now we have nothing. I want to be able to support some Irish guy at CPL next year, don't care what game it is, but with the current community that is not possible.

I had a look at clan scene in Ireland a few weeks ago when I was writing a column on quake.ie - I was just browsing through the OpenCups in Clanbase to see how q4 measured up to the other games in terms of clan numbers... I was amazed at the lack of Irish Clans. The Irish gaming community as a whole has been severely weakened over the past few years - I don't know whether it has been assimilated into the UK scene, or whether it has disappeared altogether.

Memnoch - I think I remember you being in dNC? This is the only Irish professional clan I can think of, and although it didn't last, nobody followed in its footsteps, took the step up to form a Eurocup standard clan in any game. Why is Irish online gaming so weak? Lack of broadband is a factor - we would have had a Eurocup standard team in Q3 and/or Q4 but we were particularly unlucky with most Quake players living in the bog and on ISDN - in other games though, I see the bulk of the players have broadband.

There is nothing stopping somebody from forming an 'esports' team in Ireland which can realistically hope to win big things - the standard at the top in most games is much lower than some people think, and the individual player standard in Ireland is higher than most people think. Some incentives would include competitive LANS in Ireland with real prizemoney... while I enjoy Darkside lans and all these, I'm not the biggest fan of casual gaming, and I prefer clan wars. If anyone wants to offer $2,000 prize money for the winners of the clan competition in ANY game, then I can assure you that Team Crockery will be there. Sadly, these days I don't think there is any team that can match Team Crockery's willingness for competition.

Beecher

I do see gaming as a sport, its something that involves exertion (mental, and in some cases physical), its competitive and each game has a set of rules that must be followed.

Canis Lupus wrote:

there is no one single computer game that everyone plays universally with one set of rules.

Is there one single real life sport that everyone plays universally with a fixed set of rules? Not everyone plays football, or rugby or runs laps etc etc. When playing online these days each online game has its own fixed rules which are used for competitions, sure people make mods for the game which might change them but these arent use for the competitions, cept for big mods which have become seperate games in themselves (like indoor football spawned from real football), but this modding of the game is similar to playing headers and volleys in the local field instead of football, its a bit of fun in the field but it will never progress from there.

Canis Lupus wrote:

gaming covers too much to be classified as a sport.

I totally disagree with you. Thats like saying ball games cover too much to classify them as sports, you dont have to play them all! Some people like ball sports, some people like FPS, some people like track sports, some people like RTS. But just like ballgames, of which there are hundreds, you have your games which dominate by popularity, like football or rugby and these are the ones which are professionally concentrated on, just like in FPS's we have counterstrike and battlefield where people put in the same commitment.

In closing im not a big gamer, I do dabble in a little online counter-strike at night and I do dabble in a little football in college. Im far from professional in either but I do recognise both as a sport.

Cake Fiend

Did you think it was going to just go away?

Kazujo

I think gaming will follow a similar path as poker. I mean poker has exploded over the last year or so with dedicated satelite channles and tournaments being televised every other night so why shouldn't gaming get the same exposure.

Put in some cash prizes and some resonable advertising and it could be a big success. Now I'm not talking in the BBC virtual reality/build you own warrior stuff that they have tried before. I mean televised championships using actual games. Like what Gamesmaster on C4 and GamesWorld on Sky used to do.

If people will sit there and watch a group of people playing poker till 3 in the morning why wouldn't people watch a counter strike or UT tournament?

Tusky

Memnoch wrote:

because?

Well personally I dont consider anything that doesnt involve physical activity a sport.

Memnoch

Tusky wrote:

Well personally I dont consider anything that doesnt involve physical activity a sport.

so chess, snooker and billiards are not sports?

Tusky

Memnoch wrote:

so chess, snooker and billiards are not sports?

Yes, they are, but I personally dont think they should be. To me, they are 'games' and shouldnt be looked upon as sports.

Memnoch

Tusky wrote:

Yes, they are, but I personally dont think they should be. To me, they are 'games' and shouldnt be looked upon as sports.

I'm glad that such a narrow-minded outlook isn't more pervasive through society then. One would have hoped that humanity would have evolved beyond the point where it isn't necessary to prove your suprior physique in order to engage in healthy competition.

Tusky

Memnoch wrote:

I'm glad that such a narrow-minded outlook isn't more pervasive through society then. One would have hoped that humanity would have evolved beyond the point where it isn't necessary to prove your suprior physique in order to engage in healthy competition.

Of course you can engage in healthy competition in chess, darts or whatever else Im a fan of these games,... I just dont take them as seriously as I would a real sport. Do you think someone who is at the top of their game at football, tennis, rugby or whatever other sport can be compared to a top darts player ? Not in my opinion.

Zillah

Memnoch wrote:

I'm glad that such a narrow-minded outlook isn't more pervasive through society then. One would have hoped that humanity would have evolved beyond the point where it isn't necessary to prove your suprior physique in order to engage in healthy competition.

Dude, your main problem seems to be that you think being called a "sport" is the only way for it be a recognised socially acceptable activity.

If physical activity isn't a key requirement of a "sport" then how do you define a sport anymore?

Anything with competition? How about roulette? Or black jack, or role playing games? Gambling?

Pro gaming can have respect and recognition, but it doesn't have to be called a sport to do that.

Memnoch

Tusky wrote:

Of course you can engage in healthy competition in chess, darts or whatever else Im a fan of these games,... I just dont take them as seriously as I would a real sport. Do you think someone who is at the top of their game at football, tennis, rugby or whatever other sport can be compared to a top darts player ? Not in my opinion.

as i said, luckily enough such narrow minded attitudes aren't pervasive throughout society. People do consider chess, billiard etc. players to be equivilant to tennis/football players, the different games just attract different followings. Weather you take them seriously or not is your opinion and up to you but you have no objective reasoning to do so, other than your own pre-formed ideas. This whole concept of a real sport is moronic to say the least

Memnoch

Zillah wrote:

Dude, your main problem seems to be that you think being called a "sport" is the only way for it be a recognised socially acceptable activity.

If physical activity isn't a key requirement of a "sport" then how do you define a sport anymore?

Anything with competition? How about roulette? Or black jack, or role playing games? Gambling?

Pro gaming can have respect and recognition, but it doesn't have to be called a sport to do that.

Nope, it's already recognised as a socially acceptable activity. People who claim gaming is anti-social etc are of no interest to me . I re-iterate, chess, and billiards are considered to be sports.

The problem is people like tusky above who classify things into "real" sport and "games" and only think that "real sport" should be taken seriously. In any case people hiding under their blankets are always around, I'm sure in time as gaming grows even more widespread and pro-gaming attracts a larger and larger following, which is inevitable really such attitudes will start to fade out.

It's sad that history must always repeat itself. People like tusky were talking about football and tennis 80 years ago the way he is talking about pro-gaming now.

Jazzy

well yeah i agree with ya killy, tho as i said on quake.ie, u missed all of UIE's entries in the opencups (we are in 3 team cups, 3 of us in 1v1 open, 2 2v2 TDM teams and ofc the TAM ladder which we are currently 6th and on a streak of 10 \o/ [Blatent Boasting ]).
That said u are right, although i hear 1st-IB are in the euro cup for CoD.

To be fair if u want to be a pro- gamer as it were u HAVE to be basically a rich kid who has alot of natural talent. Rich so u can stay at home and play all day and get better and better and talent cos well..... practice doesnt always make perfect.
being a pro gamer is like having a dream job of being a pornstar etc. it happens to the very very few. In Ireland atm we just dont have the organisation or talent to have big prize money events. The most we have are things like Midlans were u win nifty graphics cards and the like, not REAL prizes if ya get me. A few of us are heading over to i-Series in Febuary which should be cool and we will be basically representing Ireland for it, but we will get HAMMERED, no joke, getting by the first round would be a major achievment in my eyes

overall, atm in ireland, its a case of dream on.... but Community LAN is showing promise.......

Memnoch

Jazzy, i disagree with the rich kid philosophy.

I think it's more a case of determiniation and a willingness to take risks. Fatality for example (the guy who just won 150,000$ at the Winter CPL painkiller tourney) wans't a rich kid by any means. You can read up about him but he basically pushed himself up.

Though I think you may be kind of right with regards to ireland, because in order to have broadband and a decent pc in the house and be supported by your parents some measure of wealth at least is required.

This is not true globally however and if someone was really motivated to do it then they probably could succeed. In gaming more than anything else practise counts for a lot more than just talent.

Gaming is no where near the stage of most professional sports where it's easy to make a viable career (relatively speaking) out of it. I mean people who play for 1st /2nd division premiereship teams in england can make a good living off it, while in gaming u need to be in the top 10-20 in the world to have a chance and only the top 5 or so really earn a "great" wage (which is still peanuts compared to other sports). The exception off course is unless you live in Korea, and I take that as a model for what hopefully gaming will be like in the future here, as broadband becomes more widespread and cheaply availible.

JimmySmith

Tusky wrote:

Yes, they are, but I personally dont think they should be. To me, they are 'games' and shouldnt be looked upon as sports.

I think you're right. I too have a problem with the definition of sport and game.
I think sport is anything that involves breaking a sweat.
For example i dont believe shooting should be part of the olympic games but i do think the biathalon should be because there is a physical exertion element to it.

I suppose a better way to describe it would be that athletes play sports. I dont consider chess players or snooker players athletes. This is not to detract from snooker or chess players at all. They are equally deserving of their place in the game and hero status when they excel and entertain the masses. I just think they are different types of competition and should be categorized as so.

Tusky

Memnoch wrote:

Nope, it's already recognised as a socially acceptable activity. People who claim gaming is anti-social etc are of no interest to me . I re-iterate, chess, and billiards are considered to be sports.

The problem is people like tusky above who classify things into "real" sport and "games" and only think that "real sport" should be taken seriously. In any case people hiding under their blankets are always around, I'm sure in time as gaming grows even more widespread and pro-gaming attracts a larger and larger following, which is inevitable really such attitudes will start to fade out.

It's sad that history must always repeat itself. People like tusky were talking about football and tennis 80 years ago the way he is talking about pro-gaming now.

I do think they should be taken seriously. Of course they should. No doubt the people that play them are highly skilled and trained. I just dont see it on the same level of sport that I see other games. Also, I dont know if its healthy for us to allow our children to put in the necisary training to become a pro gamer. I, play games far too much, far far too much. If I wanted to reach the level of a pro-gamer ( if I even could ) I would have to play games 10 times more. Is it healthy to allow our children to sit on front of pcs for 10 hours a day training for this ? I dont think so.

Zillah wrote:

Dude, your main problem seems to be that you think being called a "sport" is the only way for it be a recognised socially acceptable activity.

If physical activity isn't a key requirement of a "sport" then how do you define a sport anymore?

Anything with competition? How about roulette? Or black jack, or role playing games? Gambling?

Pro gaming can have respect and recognition, but it doesn't have to be called a sport to do that.

Well said, you said it better than I could have. Ive been playing games all my life and would love for pro-gaming to be taking more seriously. I would love there to be leagues, international stars and televisied competitions....I just dont, and never will, consider it a sport. You seem to think that for that, Im looking down upon it. Im not.

JimmySmith wrote:

I suppose a better way to describe it would be that athletes play sports. I dont consider chess players or snooker players athletes. This is not to detract from snooker or chess players at all. They are equally deserving of their place in the game and hero status when they excel and entertain the masses. I just think they are different types of competition and should be categorized as so.

Exactly. Can Fatality be compared to an athlete competing in the olympics ? no.

Memnoch wrote:

Jazzy, i disagree with the rich kid philosophy.

I think it's more a case of determiniation and a willingness to take risks.

Determination and willingness to take risks...sure. What about the high spec pc, high speed internet connection and the ammount of times on your hands to train when others may be out working ?

Draupnir

Poker isnt a sport either, officially anyway I believe. Its till considered a game.

Anyway, gaming should never be considered a sport since it is not your physical self taking part in the game. Pressing buttons which control a virtual character who then carries out the complete activity means its not sport.

Also, video games dont need natural, god given talent to start with. Anyone can be good at them if they play long enough. Every sport involves natural talent first, practice later. Video games involve practice first and practice later.

sharpswifty

Memnoch wrote:

The exception off course is unless you live in Korea, and I take that as a model for what hopefully gaming will be like in the future here, as broadband becomes more widespread and cheaply availible.

Apparently gaming life in Korea isn't all good news, I read gta is banned altogether and with the online games, surrounding companies and media having such a stranglehold on the public conscious, other genres and games from other countries rarely make it on the scene there... all they do is play starcraft.

It would be great to have a similar amount of internet and gaming cafes here, where you can smoke and actually meet hot girls and such...tbh there are a good few in Dublin, so that's a start...

Memnoch

Draupnir wrote:

Poker isnt a sport either, officially anyway I believe. Its till considered a game.

Anyway, gaming should never be considered a sport since it is not your physical self taking part in the game. Pressing buttons which control a virtual character who then carries out the complete activity means its not sport.

this whole arguement of sport is an arguement of semantics and definitions, so i'm not gonna take part in it anymore I guess I don't care what people want to call it, but at the end of the day it's going to be big, and involve a lot of money and have a lot of fans and followers, names and categorizations are largely irrelevant in the end. The number of people who take pro-gaming seriously is only going to grow not diminish

Also, video games dont need natural, god given talent to start with. Anyone can be good at them if they play long enough. Every sport involves natural talent first, practice later. Video games involve practice first and practice later.

You're wrong there. I agree that practise and training is a HUGE factor. But the truth is, it is equally so for any sport. The top 100 or so guys in the world all practise a lot, but not every one of them is as good as the others. Certain teams and players tend to dominate and it's not something u can simply explain away by practise alone. Why does Fatality win every single game he plays? I'm sure there are pleanty of people out there who practise as much as him.

You can only go so far with practise. As with any other sport, you can hone your speed and reflexes by dedicated practise, but at the end of the day when you are facing another player of equal "skill" it's a battle of minds, of out smarting your opponent, being able to think fast and make decisions, being able to macro and micro at the same time.

This is why players such as Spirit_moon, 4k.Grubby and Fatality have carved a name for themselves in their respective games. Grubby doesn't even practise as much as some other wc3 players (not to mention he is dutch ) :P

I agree with your point about korea, ofc things are not all rosy over there, but it's a good start at least!

Memnoch

NIall, it's very unfair to compare Pro-Gaming to Football because gaming as a competitive sport is only 5-10 years old, football has been around 10 times as long. Still if you look at korea they have phenomenal crowds and mainstream coverage and viewership.

I agree that chess and poker can be boring to watch even for those who have an interest in it, because there is a lot of "thinking" involved.

However when it comes to pc games they can be pretty fast and hectic and so much more fun to watch. Pro-gaming has a lot of hurdles to overcome before it becomes as big as main stream sports in the rest of the world, but the process has begun and I don't think it's reversible

Zillah

Memnoch wrote:

Nope, it's already recognised as a socially acceptable activity.

Thats a bit of a dodge rather than a response. My point was about the degree of acceptability. Lets call it "respect" instead. You feel that if everyone were to call pro gaming a sport then it would be given much more respect. Its all about respect and recognition. Why else do you care about the arbitrary title?

Who cares if chess is called a sport? What does that have to do with WHY you want pro gaming called a sport?

Creamy Goodness

i have to admit i wouldn't call it a sport either but as a game.

i do follow the pro cs scene a lot and it seems that the dominance is in the scandinavian countries with america in second and europe and asia coming in third.

pro gaming will get bigger and i think it might even hit the stage that it is shown on tv like poker but it will short lived it won't last like other sports like soccer/rugby etc.

pro gamers to make a lot of money though Sk.swe the swedish cs clan make about €30,000 before taken into account their winnings. although 30,000 isn't exactly a load of money compare to say footballers, it's not to be sniffed at.

what i find a shame though is that there is no irish pro teams in any online game

segadreamcast

Zillah wrote:

Dude, your main problem seems to be that you think being called a "sport" is the only way for it be a recognised socially acceptable activity.

If physical activity isn't a key requirement of a "sport" then how do you define a sport anymore?

Anything with competition? How about roulette? Or black jack, or role playing games? Gambling?

Pro gaming can have respect and recognition, but it doesn't have to be called a sport to do that.

Bravo. If you classed gaming as a sport, you'd have to class pro-eating et al as a sport, and that's just not realistic. It sounds like some gamers just have a burning ambition to be recognised alongside their more athletic peers which, in reality, won't happen.

Draupnir

Another problem with this gaming/sport thing, is that each video game would have to be judged on its own.

If CS is called a sport, are all video games then called a sport? Does the mean Chess on a computer is a sport while actual chess on a physical board remains a game?

Memnoch, for me you are getting too hung up on arguing the case that people should "recognise" gaming as a sport, or recognise it full stop.

You should realise that the people interested in pro gaming are already interested in it and more will come.

You dont see football fans trying to get rugby fans to like their sport if they dont already. Put your effort into making pro gaming better for those interested than into trying to convert those not.

Personally, I like the idea of a progaming worldwide league. Very interesting concept. I reckon I could be top one hundred at Top Spin on the Xbox. As I was once in Xbox Live. But that wouldnt make me a top one hundred in the world sportsman would it? Since I have a considerable beer gut and am lazy as sin.

Also, I don't know who Fatality is, what game does he play?

Zillah

Lol. He sponsors my motherboard...I know that much. Damn good motherboard. Apparently...

Jazzy

he was the worlds top quake3 player for CPL (Cyberathlete Professional League), then he played UT2003, then painkiller, now quake4. these are the games that CPL chooses and have the most money (single player) in them.

we are going to have to wait a few years still before we can definately make a judgement on "pro-gaming" as to whether its a sport or not, my opinion atm is that:
Football = Sport
UT2004 = game