Speed Limits in Dublin City

Victor

New, mostly lower, speed limits are proposed in particular in the city centre, but also in some suburban residential areas and for the Port Tunnel.

Proposed limits: http://www.dublincity.ie/living_in_the_city/getting_around/by_car/traffic_management/draft_special_speed_limit_bye_laws_2006.asp
Existing limits: http://www.dublincity.ie/living_in_the_city/getting_around/by_car/traffic_management/speed_limits.asp

*Roads in the Marino Area.
*Roads in the Ballsbridge Area.
*Roads in the City Centre -Area – Bounded by Parnell Street part of Capel Street and North King Street to the north the North Quays to the south, O’Connell Street to the east and Church Street to the west.
*Roads in the City Centre Area – Bounded by Parnell Street to the north, Eden Quay to the south, Gardiner Street to the east, Beresford Place to the south east, and O’Connell Street Upper and Lower to the west.
*Roads in the City Centre Area – Bounded by the South Quays to north, College Green, Dame Street, Lord Edward Street and Christchurch Place to south, St Michael Hill and Winetavern Street to west and D’Olier Street to east.
*Roads in the City Centre Area – Bounded by Dame Street, College Green to north , Cuffe Street to south, part of Grafton Street, Nassau Street, Dawson Street, part of St Stephens Green North and West to east and Aungier Street , South Great George’s Street to west.
*Roads in the Ringsend Area.


EXTRACT FROM DRAFT

FIRST SCHEDULE
Eighty kilometres an hour
1. Chapelizod Road from the county boundary to its junction with Con Colbert Road.
2. M1 motorway, northbound, from the N1 to the City Boundary.


SECOND SCHEDULE
Sixty kilometres an hour
1. James Larkin Road and Dublin Road (Kilbarrack).
2. Howth Road between a point 60 metres east of its junction with Brookwood Avenue and a point 46 metres south-west of its junction with Watermill Road.
3. Howth Road between a point 32 metres east of its junction with St. Assam’s Road East and its junction with James Larkin Road-Dublin Road (Kilbarrack).
4. Oscar Traynor Road between a point 320 metres east of its junction with Coolock Lane and a point 74 metres north-west of its junction with the Malahide Road.
5. Finglas Road (National Road N2) from a point 90 metres west of its junction with Tower View Cottages (adj Glasnevin Cemetry) and the Dublin City boundary.
6. Kylemore Road between its junction with the Naas Road (National Road N7) and a point 46 metres south of Kylemore Road railway bridge.
7. Walkinstown Avenue between its junction with the Naas Road (National Road N7 and its junction with Long Mile Road.
8. Long Mile Road between the Dublin City boundary and a point 46 metres west of its junction with Walkinstown Parade.
9. The Stillorgan Road (National Road N11) between the Dublin City boundary and a point 180 metres south of its junction with Anglesea Road.
10. The Chapelizod Road between a point 100 metres west of its junction with Phoenix Park access at Islandbridge Gate and a point 100 metres east of its junction with Phoenix Park access at Chapelizod Gate.
11. Griffith Avenue Extension between a point 100 metres west of its junction with Ballymun Road and a point 100 metres east of its junction with Ballygall Road East.
12. Con Colbert Road from Sarsfield Road to a point 150 metres west of its junction with South Circular Road
13. The Malahide Road between a point 50 metres north-east of its junction with the roundabout at Artane to a point 50 metres south west of its junction with the N32.
14. N32 Clare Hall Road from the M50 motorway to a point 50 metres west of its junction with Malahide Road
15. N32 Clare Hall Road from a point 50 metres east of its junction with Malahide Road to its junction with Grange Road.
16. Malahide Road from a point 50 metres north of its junction with the N32 to the Dublin City boundary.
17. M32 motorway from its junction with N32 to its junction with the M1 motorway.
18. M1 Motorway southbound from the entrance to the Dublin Port Tunnel to the N1.
19. St. John’s Road West from its junction with Military Road to its junction with South Circular Road.
20. Naas Road from the City Boundary to its junction with Kylemore Road.
21. Grange Road from the City Boundary to its junction with Hole in the Wall Road.

THIRD SCHEDULE
30 kilometres per hour

Roads in the Marino Area.

Brian Road
Brian Terrace
Brian Avenue
Carlton Road
Casino Road
Croydon green
Croydon Gardens
Croydon Park Avenue
Croydon Terrace
Fairview Avenue Upper
Fairview Avenue Lower
Fairview Green
Fairview terrace
Haverty Road
Marino green
Marino Mart (part of from Haverty Road south to Fairview)
Marino Park
Merville Avenue
Morroch Terrace
Philipsburgh Terrace
Shelmartin Avenue
Shelmartin Terrace
St. Aidan’s Park Avenue
St. Aidan’s Park
St. Declan Road
St. Declan Terrace
St. Joseph’s Terrace
Torloch Parade
Windsor Avenue
Windsor Lane
Windsor Villas

Roads in the Ballsbridge Area.

Pembroke Lane.
Elgin Road
Wellington Lane.
Heytesbury Lane
Wellington Road.
Raglan Lane.
Raglan Road.
Waterloo Lane.


Roads in the City Centre -Area – Bounded by Parnell Street part of Capel Street and North King Street to the north the North Quays to the south, O’Connell Street to the east and Church Street to the west.

Abbey Cottages
Abbey Street Middle
Abbey Street Upper
Anne Street North
Arran Street
Arran Street East
Bachelors Lane
Balls Lane
Beresford Street
Britain Street
Britain Street Little
Byrnes Lane
Cambell’s Court
Capel Street (Parnell St to North Quays)
Chapel Lane
Chancery Street
Chancery Place
Charles Street West
Church Avenue
Church Terrace
Cuckoo Lane
Father Matthew Square
Georges Hill
Greek Street
Green Street
Green Street Little
Halston Street
Hamilton Court
Henry Street
Henry Place
Hotel Yard
Jervis Street
Jervis Lane Upper
Jervis Lane Lower
Liffey Street Upper
Liffey Street Lower
Litton Lane
Lotts (North)
Mary’s Abbey
Mary’s Lane
Meetinghouse Lane
Moore Street
Moore Lane
New Street North
Ormond Place.
Ormond Market
O’Connell Street Upper
O’Connell Street Lower
O’Rahilly Parade
Prince’s Street North
Swifts Row
Sampsons Lane
Strand Street Great
Strand Street Little
St Michans Street
St Michans Place
Stirrup Lane
Wolfe Tone Street


Roads in the City Centre Area – Bounded by Parnell Street to the north, Eden Quay to the south, Gardiner Street to the east, Beresford Place to the south east, and O’Connell Street Upper and Lower to the west.

Abbey Street
Abbey Street Lower
Beresford Lane
Britain Place
Cathedral Street
Cathal Brugha Street
Champions Avenue
Cumberland Street
Deverell Place
Earl Place
Earl Street North
Findlater Place
Harbour Court
Marlborough Street
Marlborough Place
Norththumberland Square
Sackville Place
Strong’s Court
Talbot Street ( Marlborough St.to Gardiner St.Lwr.)
Thomas Lane



Roads in the City Centre Area – Bounded by the South Quays to north, College Green, Dame Street, Lord Edward Street and Christchurch Place to south, St Michael Hill and Winetavern Street to west and D’Olier Street to east.

Adair Lane
Aston Place
Adsills Row
Anglesea Street
Bedford Row
Bedford Lane
Cecilia Street
Copper Alley
College Street
Cows Lane
Crane Lane
Crampton Court
Curved Street
Cope Street
Crown Alley
Crow Street
D’Olier Street
Essex Gate
Essex Street West
Essex Street East
Eustace Street
Exchange Street Lower
Exchange Street Upper
Fishamble Street
Fleet Street
Fownes Street Lower
Fownes Street Upper
Foster Place
Merchant’s Arch
Parliament Street
Parliament Row
Price’s Lane
Scyamore Street
Temple Bar
Temple Lane South
Westmoreland Street.


Roads in the City Centre Area – Bounded by Dame Street, College Green to north , Cuffe Street to south, part of Grafton Street, Nassau Street, Dawson Street, part of St Stephens Green North and West to east and Aungier Street , South Great George’s Street to west.

Andrew Street
Annes Lane
Anne Street South
Aungier Lane
Aungier Place
Balfe Street
Bow Lane
Castle Market
Chatham Row
Chatham Street
Chatham Lane
Church Lane
Clareedon Market
Claredon Row
Claredon Street
Coppinger Row
Dame Court
Dame Lane
Digges Lane
Digges Street Upper
Duke Lane
Duke Lane Upper
Duke Street
Exchequer Street
Fade Street
Glendinning Lane
Glover’s Alley
Harry Street
Johson Court
Johnson Place
King Street South
Lemon Street
Longford Street Little
Mercer Street Lower
Mercer Street Upper
Stephen Street Lower
Suffolk Street
William Street South
Wicklow Street
Trinity Street
York Street


Roads in the Ringsend Area.

Aikenhead Terrace
Celestine Avenue
Dermot O’Hurley Avenue
Doris Street
Fitzwilliam Quay
Gerald Street
Gordon Street
Hasting Street
Hope Street
Howard Street
Joy Street
Magdalen Terrace
Ormeau Street
Oliver Plunkett Avenue
Philomena Terrace
Penrose Street
Somerset Street
South Dock Place
South Dock Street
Rosary Terrace
Veronica Terrace


FOURTH SCHEDULE
1. M1 motorway, southbound, between the City Boundary and the Dublin Port Tunnel.
2. The Dublin Port Tunnel, Southbound.
3. The Dublin Port Tunnel, Northbound.

mackerski

That settles it - they really are smoking crack in there. Does anyone want to explain the benefit of applying a 30-limit on roads like:

Westmoreland St.
D'Olier St.
College St.
O'Connell St.
(Much of) Abbey St.
Capel St.

???

Also, was anybody else surprised at the stated intention to use variable limits around the Port Tunnel? The recent legislative changes opted specifically not to sanction such limits, which seems to undermine any such bye-law.

Dermot

cyclopath2001

mackerski wrote:

That settles it - they really are smoking crack in there. Does anyone want to explain the benefit of applying a 30-limit on roads like:

Motorists driving at innapropriate speed when they can?

mackerski

cyclopath2001 wrote:

Motorists driving at innapropriate speed when they can?

Care to elaborate?

Dermot

Victor

At times those streets are very clear from a traffic point of view (and Paddy thinks "wide, straight street, no traffic, floor it"), but can have vast numbers of pedestrians.

Tell me, does anyone need to do any faster on those streets?

ApeXaviour

mackerski wrote:

That settles it - they really are smoking crack in there. Does anyone want to explain the benefit of applying a 30-limit on roads like:

Westmoreland St.
D'Olier St.
College St.
O'Connell St.
(Much of) Abbey St.
Capel St.

???

AFAIK these things are based (and rightly so) on population density and number of road accidents (in this case involving pedestrians). Having driven on all of those streets I've seen how people consistently dart out infront of traffic. Even when it's not busy for traffic it will still tend to be busy with pedestrians. There is an attitude among people walking these areas that the entire place is semi-pedestrianised. At 30kmph you are far far less likely to kill somebody than at 50kmph.
As a student in the city centre, I regularly walk around and numerous times have nearly been injured by idiots bombing around places like college green trying to beat an amber light.

There is also the added incentive of trying to decrease traffic through the city centre. If you feel town with it's low speed limits will be a bottle neck for you, you'll tend to go around it.

I for one applaud this measure. It's quite sane and will be very beneficial.

mackerski

Try to focus on benefit, though. I've lifted a small subset of through-routes out of a set of roads that, by and large, may indeed benefit from 30-zones. The benefit, where present, is twofold. It restores a bit of quality of life to pedestrians and it encourages drivers to avoid the roads that are thus restricted. Let's deal with these one by one:

Benefitting pedestrians:

Consider Wicklow Street. It's narrow. Pedestrians throng the narrow footpaths. Many of them want to cross. Many of them do, whether it's safe or not. The road, of course, is narrow enough that any that do cross can do so swiftly enough, assuming they feel (and are) safe doing so. A 30-zone can help here.

Now let's look at D'Olier Street. There's no point trying to give that back to pedestrians. With about 5 lanes of cars (however slowly they go), there's nothing a pedestrian can do with it (watch during the rush hour in sub-30 traffic to test my assertion). In fact, it's such a bad street for pedestrians that it (and Westmoreland St. more so) has actual barriers to prevent pedestrian silliness. The very last thing you want to do on a road like this is encourage pedestrians to colonise it further.

Discouraging motor traffic:

This can be a worthy goal. In the two examples above, we can probably agree that Wicklow Street with fewer cars would be a Good Thing. Trouble is, given that this is discouragement, not the outright bans that some would favour, the motorists thus discouraged need to actually go somewhere. Ideally, they'd choose the wider roads that are intended as through routes, and that can't offer pedestrians great quality of life no matter what happens. That's why international practice on 30 zones is not to place them on through routes except at actual hazard points. 30-zones have to be used sparingly to have a useful effect, just as you can't set a whole A4 page of type in boldface and expect people to pay it greater heed.

Keep in mind, the more 30-zones there are, the less respected they will be and the thinner the enforcement will be. Thin enforcement means high pressure for results, and that means more speed checks on D'Olier Street than Wicklow Street. And that just seems arse-backwards to me.

So I'll ask again - why is it better to plaster the whole central area, including through routes, with 30 zones rather than focussing on ones that will bring actual benefit?

Dermot

Victor

But they don't want any of those streets being used by through-traffic (other than public transport).

John R

Of course without effective enforcement it will make no difference at all. Despite the choking traffic there are always sections of streets that are clear and it is an everyday occourence to have cars doing 40-50 on city streets when they can without any real fear of being caught. Much more likely to get done for speeding on the Stillorgan Dual carriageway.

mackerski

Victor wrote:

But they don't want any of those streets being used by through-traffic (other than public transport).

They mightn't, but that doesn't prevent them being through routes. Their capacity and placement guarantees that status. And you still haven't shown any benefit resulting from a drop in speed limit on these routes.

Consider the message this will send - we're talking about the very first 30 zones most Irish people will ever see. Which of these sentiments do you see getting most buy-in from motorists?:

1. We're applying 30-zones in a targetted way on roads whose safety or pedestrian-friendliness will benefit from it.

2. We're applying 30-zones in places that will benefit from it plus in a load of places where they'll bring no benefit and where you'll end up driving anyway. We don't want you driving on those streets anyway.

I've never seen any other country deploy 30-zones based on reasoning number 2. And most places that "play fair" seem to have acheived a high degree of acceptance among drivers.

On the plus side, at least the new speed limits will expose Dublin's cyclists for the law-ignoring bunch that they truly are. I've no doubt the Guards will be even-handed and will prosecute speeding cyclists just as readily as they do motorists...

Dermot