showdowns-to show or not

connie147

having just opened a new poker club in killarney,one point that urgently needs addressing is showing of cards in a showdown situation. some players obviously avoid showing cards when they hear of a better hand and arguements are starting as to who is entitled to see cards. is there an exact ruling on this or can i invoke a house rule to cover showdown situations. any boardsters suggestions would be appreciated before house ruling is implemented

The Troll

connie147 wrote:

having just opened a new poker club in killarney,one point that urgently needs addressing is showing of cards in a showdown situation. some players obviously avoid showing cards when they hear of a better hand and arguements are starting as to who is entitled to see cards. is there an exact ruling on this or can i invoke a house rule to cover showdown situations. any boardsters suggestions would be appreciated before house ruling is implemented

use the boards search function on google, there are loads of posts relating to this as recently as last week.

Scotty #

We were just talking about this yesterday>> http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=320329

IMO if someone pays to see then they GET to see. Likewise the winner has the right to see what he got called with.

bohsman

The correct ruling is.. If there is a bet and a call then the bettor shows first and it moves left around the table. Anyone at the table can request to see any players cards involved in the showdown.

If there is no bet on the river the showdown starts with the first to speak.. left of the dealer and again anyone can request to see any cards involved

The Troll

Scotty # wrote:

We were just talking about this yesterday>> http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=320329

IMO if someone pays to see then they GET to see. Likewise the winner has the right to see what he got called with.

I think the caller should see first and have a chance to muck as he has paid to see them. Same system as is used in online poker.

Scotty #

bohsman wrote:

The correct ruling is.. If there is a bet and a call then the bettor shows first and it moves left around the table. Anyone at the table can request to see any players cards involved in the showdown.

If there is no bet on the river the showdown starts with the first to speak.. left of the dealer and again anyone can request to see any cards involved

Agree 100%. Its extremely annoying when your put in a bet and get called- turn your cards over and the other person just sighs and mucks. you want to know what he's willing to call with.

bohsman

Scotty # wrote:

Agree 100%. Its extremely annoying when your put in a bet and get called- turn your cards over and the other person just sighs and mucks. you want to know what he's willing to call with.

Dont be afraid to stand your ground and insist they turn their hand over first

Scotty #

Yes but (as I read on another post) what if its too late and their cards are already in the muck??

I don't think this is official but might be of intersest from www.pokerlistings.com/general-poker-rules/showdown

5. Any player who has been dealt in may request to see any hand that has been called, even if the opponent's hand or the winning hand has been mucked. However, this is a privilege that may be revoked if abused. If a player other than the pot winner asks to see a hand that has been folded, that hand is dead. If the winning player asks to see a losing player's hand, both hands are live, and the best hand wins.

RoundTower

connie147 wrote:

having just opened a new poker club in killarney,one point that urgently needs addressing is showing of cards in a showdown situation. some players obviously avoid showing cards when they hear of a better hand and arguements are starting as to who is entitled to see cards. is there an exact ruling on this or can i invoke a house rule to cover showdown situations. any boardsters suggestions would be appreciated before house ruling is implemented

You just opened a new poker club. Make any rules you like. Ideally the rules should be fair and consistent. I suggest you use the same rules that Oscar suggested, but there is no problem if you decide on one of the alternatives "all cards must be shown" or "left of the dealer shows, regardless of the last bet" or "last player to bet on any street shows".

If someone throws their cards in the muck they should be irretrievable. If someone else wants to see their cards after that, too bad.

Crumbs

bohsman wrote:

The correct ruling is.. If there is a bet and a call then the bettor shows first and it moves left around the table. Anyone at the table can request to see any players cards involved in the showdown.

If there is no bet on the river the showdown starts with the first to speak.. left of the dealer and again anyone can request to see any cards involved

I don't like this.

If you can ask to see cards for information purposes, isn't it stupid not to ask to see all cards in every hand? Why shouldn't you ask? I don't think etiquette or time-wasting are valid answers.

The rule should either be that all hands must be shown in a showdown, regardless of whether someone has already shown the pure nuts, or else...

The Troll wrote:

I think the caller should see first and have a chance to muck as he has paid to see them.

This is the way it generally is with the addendum that players can ask to see other cards not revealed in a showdown.

This rule was originally introduced to deter collusion. In order to try to catch any cheaters in action, this is the best rule that could be come up with. "Any player may request to see any hand if they suspect collusion." What bullcrap. Anytime I've seen a player invoke this, they don't even know that the whole point of the rule is to detect collusion. I've even read posts on this forum from people saying they've asked to see someone's cards just to rile them. If anyone ever asks to see my losing cards, I'll take it that they're implying I'm a cheat and I'll smack them across the head.

It's a rule that needs to be clarified and standarised.

Here's a good article on the subject.

Scotty #

Nah!! Still think they should be shown