Laptop

zt

Can anybody recommend a laptop primarily for software development? I'm currently using a dell latitude, but would like to avoid dell machines in the future.

My work will pay for this, so the budget is between 2500 - 3500.

Thanks in advance.

WillieDH

zt wrote:

Can anybody recommend a laptop primarily for software development? I'm currently using a dell latitude, but would like to avoid dell machines in the future.

My work will pay for this, so the budget is between 2500 - 3500.

Thanks in advance.

I'd try a Fujitsu Siemens Celcius Workstation laptop or an Alienware high spec

glynf

Area 51 7700


Check this baby out
Almost identical to the latest sager,(same ODM-Clevo) but AW are based in Athlone, handy if it goes tit's up.
-hopefuly santa s bringing me the 3.6GHz flavor

RicardoSmith

Theres nothing special about software development that requires a specific machine. Its more your use, if you want a big screen and lots of power but not too bothered how heavy it is, or something light and very mobile for flights.

Whats wrong with the Dells?

For me when coding I want a decent screen, a second screen if possible and as big a keyboard as I can get with full sized return and backspace keys and no weird layouts. I have a 16" laptop screen and most of the time I have a 2nd 17" TFT hooked up as a second monitor.

zt

RicardoSmith wrote:

Theres nothing special about software development that requires a specific machine. Its more your use, if you want a big screen and lots of power but not too bothered how heavy it is, or something light and very mobile for flights.

I was pretty vague sorry. I need a machine with lots of memory (2GB) and a reasonable CPU. Big screen is a must and as strange as it may seem, a good internal mouse. I would like something that lasts for about three hours - maybe with two batteries. I'm not particularly bothered about the weight.

RicardoSmith wrote:

Whats wrong with the Dells?

I find that the price of Dell machines accelerates quickly when you upgrade memory, CPU, disk etc.

I've also found problems with battery life on Dell machines. I've already had three batteries for my current machine (about 18 months old).

The previous two posts recommend the alienware machines. I've never seen these before but they certainly appear better value than the Dell machines.

What laptop do you use?

HaVoC

i not sure about this but from the look of it the chip on the alienware laptop seems to be just a desktop one but in a laptop which means it eats your battry for breakfest. Centrinos or Pentium M are probabaly the way to go if need over 2 and half hours battery time.friend of mine had a Compaq presario that had a huge battery in it that lasted for like 3 hours. Though i have heard compaq are rather evil custom ram and such.

RicardoSmith

I the battery problem may have just been a specific problem to your machine. Its not a characteristic of Dells in my experience. I have found Dells to last pretty well if looked after. Certainly better than other makes with the exception of IBM. Which are really tough it seems. IBM do some great laptops.

I use a Sony, but its a desktop replacement laptop, not very portable, but with an excellent screen. These days you'd be crazy to buy anything other than a Centrino.

Y.B.Sober

personally. if I had a budget like that I'd go for a high end Sony Vaio. My experiences so far have been very good. Sony also have a good backup service, which is important when you're spending much more than I do on food on a year!


Check out http://www.notebooksbilliger.de/ for some v.good bargains [as long as you can install your own english o.s. and don't mind the german keyboard which is slighly different to a qwerty]

RicardoSmith

Y.B.Sober - what sony backup services have you used?

zt - what do you need 2gb for? I have 1gb and to be honest theres not much difference over 512mb in most things.

dawballz

check out some lappys from www.rockdirect.com some fairly high spec machines there.
http://www.rockdirect.com/notebooks/xtremeti_3.htm has some good specs but looks a bit big and heavy.
haven't had any experience with them either though.
I'm also buying a laptop but i'm the one paying for it so i'm going for a Fujitsu-Siemens Amilo A 1630 from www.nice-pc.co.uk

Them alienware ones do look fairly snazzy though.

jessy

HaVoC wrote:

i not sure about this but from the look of it the chip on the alienware laptop seems to be just a desktop one but in a laptop which means it eats your battry for breakfest. Centrinos or Pentium M are probabaly the way to go if need over 2 and half hours battery time.friend of mine had a Compaq presario that had a huge battery in it that lasted for like 3 hours. Though i have heard compaq are rather evil custom ram and such.

My Acer TravelMate 290lci Last 5.5hours, it’s the spec in my signature

secret_squirrel

Most of the dell lappy's at my place have had their batteries go - admittedly the laptops are pretty old and stay plugged in constantly but still...

Not sure anyone elses laptops wouldnt behave the same under the same circumstances though....

Boro

Normally I hate Dell machines (as a consequence of working there i guess) but i do think their laptops (well the newer ones) are quite nice. They are solid without being spectacular, but in the main, they are well put together and reliable.

I was installing some laptops for a client recently - they were Inspiron 8600's (i think) with centrino 2GHz processors, 1 gig of ram, 60gb harddrives and 15.4 wuxga screens (17" widescreen). Lurvely machines - full sized keyboards, fantastic screens, plenty of oomph and loads of battery life. When i was setting them up, they were telling me they had 6 hours of life left in them. This was while i was installing office 2k3 on them and running in maximum performance mode. If you take care of the battery properly (discharge/recharge cycle, dont use while plugged in, etc) then they would last you a long time.

Expensive enough though, between 2 and 2.5 grand (with all the extras like monitor stands, docking stations, cases, extra batteries, etc).

Capt'n Midnight

zt wrote:

Can anybody recommend a laptop primarily for software development?

Do you want to use it plugged in most of the time where raw speed is important ? (with a big LCD and built in drives )
Or do you want to work away from a power outlet where battery life and portability is more important ? (smaller, less robust etc.)

With laptops portability and battery life come at the price of performance so decide which path to take..

by software development - intensive as in testing a running app or less so in the case of coding ?

HaVoC

jessy wrote:

My Acer TravelMate 290lci Last 5.5hours, it’s the spec in my signature

thats my point pentium M and Centrino have uber battery time

Serbian

glynf wrote:

Area 51 7700


Check this baby out
Almost identical to the latest sager,(same ODM-Clevo) but AW are based in Athlone, handy if it goes tit's up.
-hopefuly santa s bringing me the 3.6GHz flavor

I was going through the site configuring loads of machines thinking, "These are great, and not too expensive!".

Then I realised the prices were in sterling :mad:

Bastards.

Fibonacci

I swear by my IBM thinkpad. Have been using different models for over 5 years now, and never had any trouble.

They are solid workhorses that take a fair bit of knocking too. The T4X series are great mix of performance and size.

Cost a little bit more, but if work are paying I thouroughly recommend them.

secret_squirrel

zt wrote:

a good internal mouse.

The IBM thinkpads get almost universal praise for having very good touchpads and nipples. Also tend to have some of the best keyboards too.

RicardoSmith

secret_squirrel wrote:

Most of the dell lappy's at my place have had their batteries go - admittedly the laptops are pretty old and stay plugged in constantly but still...

Not sure anyone elses laptops wouldnt behave the same under the same circumstances though....

I was working on an upgrade project recently and we replaced about 200 laptops. There were a mix of Dell and HP. The HP's were wrecked whereas most of the Dells weren't too bad. Nearly all the HP's had dead batteries but at least 30% of the Dells still had some battery cpacity left. If you look at 2nd hand laptops for sale the vast majority of them are IBM's and Dells.

zt

Our software uses lots of caching stuff. It would be useful to be able to test this locally.

RicardoSmith wrote:

zt - what do you need 2gb for? I have 1gb and to be honest theres not much difference over 512mb in most things.

RicardoSmith

zt wrote:

Our software uses lots of caching stuff. It would be useful to be able to test this locally.

Some cache to need 1Gb!!!!!!

zt

Capt'n Midnight,

You have hit the nail on the head.

I spend a limited amount of time writing code these days. Testing the code is often very data and memory intensive.

I would generally use my laptop like a desktop machine when I'm coding and testing (plugged in to AC power) but I need some level portability.

I'm now beginning to think along the lines of a lower spec laptop and a dedicated desktop machine for running tests etc. I tend to forget that With broadband access I don't need everything on my laptop.

Capt'n Midnight wrote:

Do you want to use it plugged in most of the time where raw speed is important ? (with a big LCD and built in drives )
Or do you want to work away from a power outlet where battery life and portability is more important ? (smaller, less robust etc.)

With laptops portability and battery life come at the price of performance so decide which path to take..

by software development - intensive as in testing a running app or less so in the case of coding ?

zt

Can any comparison be made between the speed of M processors and standard desktop processors?

For example, the clock speed of a Intel Pentium M 1.7 Ghz is nearly half of a Intel Pentium 4 3.2Ghz processor. How does this relate to real performance?

RicardoSmith

http://www.gamepc.com/labs/view_content.asp?id=gmso&page=1&cookie%5Ftest=1

Y.B.Sober

RicardoSmith wrote:

Y.B.Sober - what sony backup services have you used?

returns and using their technical team for support. also their website is great for getting sony specific drivers etc.

RicardoSmith

Y.B.Sober wrote:

returns and using their technical team for support. also their website is great for getting sony specific drivers etc.

Which site and numbers do you use?

I find most of the drivers, in particular the gfx ones are quite old.

HaVoC

RicardoSmith wrote:

http://www.gamepc.com/labs/view_content.asp?id=gmso&page=1&cookie%5Ftest=1

cool a centrino version of the AMD 64 sounds cool

Y.B.Sober

RicardoSmith wrote:

Which site and numbers do you use?

I find most of the drivers, in particular the gfx ones are quite old.

unsure about the drivers been old, all i know is that they solved all my problems. Never had to phone them, just used the club vaio website.

jessy

zt wrote:

Can any comparison be made between the speed of M processors and standard desktop processors?

For example, the clock speed of a Intel Pentium M 1.7 Ghz is nearly half of a Intel Pentium 4 3.2Ghz processor. How does this relate to real performance?

My 1.3 Benchmarked a little bit faster than a 2GHz P4

jessy

Fibonacci wrote:

I swear by my IBM thinkpad. Have been using different models for over 5 years now, and never had any trouble.

They are solid workhorses that take a fair bit of knocking too. The T4X series are great mix of performance and size.

Cost a little bit more, but if work are paying I thouroughly recommend them.

More praise for the IBM laptops, but if you get an IBM then you will pay an arm and a leg for what you get.

secret_squirrel

jessy wrote:

More praise for the IBM laptops, but if you get an IBM then you will pay an arm and a leg for what you get.

Rubbish!

Are Thinkpads cheap - nope - but they are no worse than sony for example.

Plus you get something that has been tested to death and is build to last.

You get something that are almost universally acclaimed for their input devices.

Personally if I didnt want pose value I would get another IBM in a flash - as long as work was paying!

jessy

secret_squirrel wrote:

Rubbish!

Are Thinkpads cheap - nope - but they are no worse than sony for example.

Plus you get something that has been tested to death and is build to last.

You get something that are almost universally acclaimed for their input devices.

Personally if I didnt want pose value I would get another IBM in a flash - as long as work was paying!

Whats Rubbish?
who said anything about IBM's been worse than Sony?
You really think its worth paying that much more for something that "is built to last" what face value dose that have in a market that changes by the month? I sure an IBM machine would last 10-15 year but who would be using it then?
Like i said IBM are great machines but expencive.

secret_squirrel

jessy wrote:

Like i said IBM are great machines but expencive.

Where did you say this exactly?

Last time I checked IBM prices were on a par with sonys. Afaik know no-one has said IBM's are better/worse than sony's. I was just comparing 2 brands who both have premium pricing policies. Sony's look a little better and IBM's are built a little better (IMHO).

You implied that IBM's arent worth the money - I contend they are - especially if work is paying.

Back on topic - my Centrino 1.6Ghz benches somewhere between a 2.4 and a 2.6 Ghz P4 depending on the task. A rough rule of thumb is +1Ghz - (a small fiddle factor).

jessy

secret_squirrel wrote:

Where did you say this exactly?

jessy wrote:

More praise for the IBM laptops

Depends on your interpretation of “praise”.

The company I work for has over 500 IBM Thinkcentre on there network, and I can verify that they are very good machines, but I can assure u that they are by no means bullet proof. The company I work for is also getting cheaper machine (Non IBM) because it’s to hard to justify spending so much more on a machine that’s going to be replaced in 2-3 years anyways.

RicardoSmith

The price premium on Sony's is also to do with their superior screens.